# CBS: Bush knew uranium story was false **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 11, 2003, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661 "2003-07-11T06:14:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/181 "2003-07-17T15:26:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > I won’t try to summarize it. Read the whole thing. december, summarizing an article is _not that hard_. You should try it sometime. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/182 "2003-07-17T15:27:53Z")
The Brokaw interview boils down to this statement by WMD hunter, David Kay: > [@](#): > > Kay: Well, if I knew what we were going to find, I wouldn’t be here this long already. But I can tell you what we’re looking for: we’re looking for documentary evidence. We’re looking for equipment, analytical results, sample results. We’re looking for testimony of Iraqis who were actually involved in the weapons program. I’m confident that we will get all three of those and be able to explain exactly what the nuclear, biological and chemical program was of Saddam Hussein. I don’t know what the truth is yet. But we’ve got a process that will get us there. Translation: We know there aren’t any WMDs so we’re going to pretend that finding a “program” is equivilent to finding WMDs. Luckily for us, _we_ get to define what constitutes a WMD “program,” and we can spin whatever “evidence” we want as proving the existence of that program. We don’t actually have to find any _stocks_ of WMDs to cobble together some bullshit presentation about a “program” sometime before the election campaign. We will then claim robotically during the campaign that the WMD allegations have been “proven” and that we need to “move on.” We will feign anger and exasperation whenever anyone tries to remind us that what the “president” actually asserted before the invasion was that Iraq had not just some nebulous “program” (and a “program” is whatever we say it is) but _thousands of stocks_ armed and ready to go. Of course, we haven’t found shit that we can even spin as a “program” at this point…but don’t worry, we will. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/183 "2003-07-17T15:28:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Gaspode \* > I wouldn’t know what conclusions you draw. I would draw the conclusion that we still don’t know the story on Iraq’s WMDs and it will take a long time to find out. We ought to wait and see. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/184 "2003-07-17T15:29:32Z")
> [@](#): > > **Brokaw:** But there’s no doubt in your mind, I gather, that in fact there was a program and it was substantial. > > \*\*Kay: \*\*I’ve already seen enough to convince me, but that’s not the standard. I’ve got to have enough evidence to convince everyone of that. And that’s why we’re going through this process. What a load of bullshit. From now on anyone that believes there’s some huge WMD stash is a fucking idiot in my book. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/185 "2003-07-17T15:41:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > \*\*I would draw the conclusion that we still don’t know the story on Iraq’s WMDs and it will take a long time to find out. We ought to wait and see. \*\* No it shouldn’t take a long time at all. Wasn’t Colin Powell pointing out buildings in that UN presentation? Shouldn’t that have been the first place our troops went? What did those turn out to be? ---
**Author:** ![Read\_Neck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@Read\_Neck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Read_Neck)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/186 "2003-07-17T15:46:49Z")
The Gaspode – I hold a very very dim view of alphabet news so this is a perfect example. 1. Tom Brokaw holds an interview with a person involved in the story. That’s good info. 2. Tom Brokaw states on the news. “David Kays says the US could be 6 months away from finding proof of WMD.” Still good. If I want,I can investigate further. 3. Tom Brokaw states on the news. “According to an “administration official” the US could be 6 months away from finding proof of WMD.” My bullshit meter pegs. Unfortunately,the 3s outnumber 1s and 2s by a wide margin… I don’t believe it’s any “vast conspiracy” but rather trashy journalism. The news programs compete for “market share/advertising dollars” like any other TV program so the more sensationalism they can spin the better their ratings. I quit watching alphabet news years ago but my bullshit meter still pegs automatically when I see ABC,NBC or CBS. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/187 "2003-07-17T18:04:44Z")
Now on CNN Tenet is saying he didn’t even read the final SOTU draft. > [@](#): > > Committee Vice Chairman Sen. John “Jay” Rockefeller, D-West Virginia, said: "I think that responsibility has to be taken by a lot more than George Tenet. > > “I think we have to face up to that. I think there are others in the administration who knew something about this.” > > Roberts said Tenet described the matter as a “serious error.” He said Tenet told the committee that “had he been aware of the information, he would have taken it out and that he bears the primary responsibility.” ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/188 "2003-07-17T18:25:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Collounsbury \* > \*\*Well, no need, I couldn’t fuck what some twit like yourself concludes. \*\* …? Alright then, let’s say “both,” and probably some other things I’ve missed. > [@](#): > > **To wit, that fact that the entire edifice of Anglo-American claims in re Iraq and its programs have proven false. Not slightly false, very false. Badly exaggerated, poorly characterized and generally without a good basis. Indeed, Cook (you do know who he is, don’t you? and others in the critical camp were spot on…** There’s no basis for saying that despite the loud and frequent remonstrations. The foreign affairs committee investigating never came close to asserting that anything has been “proven very false”, or proven a teeny bit false, or anything of the sort. But you’d know that. It takes no more critical reading skill to paint Cook and his lapdog Short as the paragons of truth and virtue while everyone else is inept…you’re aware of that too, I’m sure. This thread began as “Bush knew uranium story was false.” I don’t know that the uranium story is false, so I’ll wait for more information before believing it’s false, despite efforts made by ambitious members of both Parliament and Congress to spin a non-scandal of epic non-proportions. SOTU: “The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa.” True on its face, true according to the UK, but nonetheless a bald-faced deception obvious to anyone who can read. Yeah. Sure. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/189 "2003-07-17T19:18:34Z")
Boy are we going in circles here. It’s not about being a bald-face (you mean bold-face, but I digress) deception, it’s about the bigger picture, that the uncertainty should make us more conservative. Saddam may or may not have tried to acquire uranium. What does that mean? It means we don’t know shit, and we should go back to square one in our investigation. Once we have _proof positive_, then we should level the accusation, bring the case to the American people, or handle it through the UN. Nobody from the US or Britain can even provide a name, a place, a time, a year, let alone a turncoat Baath party official, in regards to this yellowcake business. The only scrap we have is “trust us”. I’ll assume, as I think everyone should, that he _didn’t_ try to acquire any uranium _until_ a case can be made otherwise. I’m not asking for much either, (none of this beyond a reasonable doubt shit), just _something_, anything besides telling me not to trust CBS, that could make me start to change my mind a little bit. “We have secret intel we can’t divulge” Bullshit, Bush and Blair are getting raked over the coals for this. If there was any single little scrap or evidence that could save their asses, (whether it should be released or not for national security reasons :D), they would bring it public in a heartbeat. This whole things stinks, and you know it. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/190 "2003-07-17T20:03:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > I would draw the conclusion that we still don’t know the story on Iraq’s WMDs and it will take a long time to find out. We ought to wait and see. Wasn’t that what Hans Blix and everyone else was saying back in March? And you were opposed to _that,_ IIRC… ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/191 "2003-07-17T20:07:41Z")
> [@](#): > > Bullshit, Bush and Blair are getting raked over the coals for this. If there was any single little scrap or evidence that could save their asses, (whether it should be released or not for national security reasons ), they would bring it public in a heartbeat. Well they are working on it- the first forgery didn’t work so well so they are using better crayons this time. **december** let me guess, some time around 2005 should be enough time, right? 😉 **Read\_Neck** I have to admit your listing ABC, NBC and CBS as biased, but omitting Fox New was truly amusing. Thanks. But, you ommitted CNN? Is that due to poor quality control on your behalf or they been co-opted by the John Birch Society while I wasn’t looking? Additionally, now that MSNBC has canned Michael Savage shouldn’t they be on your Big List O’ Evil? Don’t forget those crazy NPR liberals or public TV. Your pal, **elf6c** ---
**Author:** ![Read\_Neck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@Read\_Neck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Read_Neck)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/192 "2003-07-17T20:10:24Z")
World Eater,(and anyone interested) this book [“The Man Who Kept Secrets”](http://www.namebase.org/sources/AI.html) is an excellent read on the CIA. It’s well worth the time. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/193 "2003-07-17T20:11:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by World Eater \* > If there was any single little scrap or evidence that could save their asses,…they would bring it public in a heartbeat. Why should Bush make exculpatory information public _now_? I think he’s a smarter politician than his critics. We aren’t near an election. It doesn’t matter if his popularity drops during the summer of 2003. The interview I cited earlier said that the team looking for WMDs in Iraq will take a long time to reach conclusions. I predict that in the summer or fall of 2004 they will put out a comprehensive report showing all sorts of dangerous WMDs. The report will make the case that Bush saved the country and the world from disaster. His opponents will be seen to have been defaming the President while Bush was defending the nation. ---
**Author:** ![Read\_Neck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@Read\_Neck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Read_Neck)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/194 "2003-07-17T20:29:44Z")
elf6c - I didn’t forget anyone. The 24/7 news channels and even PBS do a pretty fair job of news because they devote more time. Radio? Do people still listen to that? ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/195 "2003-07-17T20:41:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > \*\*We aren’t near an election. It doesn’t matter if his popularity drops during the summer of 2003. \*\* We?!?! What the fuck are you the Borg or something? Who gives a rats ass about his popularity dipping and elections. He’s playing with peoples lives here, and I mean that in every sense of the word. This fucker is going to _cause_ a terrorist attack, not prevent one, and you care about his popularity? \*\* > [@](#): > > The interview I cited earlier said that the team looking for WMDs in Iraq will take a long time to reach conclusions. I predict that in the summer or fall of 2004 they will put out a comprehensive report showing all sorts of dangerous WMDs. The report will make the case that Bush saved the country and the world from disaster. His opponents will be seen to have been defaming the President while Bush was defending the nation. \*\* Save the the country and world from disaster? No you didn’t just say that. **Save the the country and world from disaster?** You just said GWB will… **Save the the country and world from disaster?** \*\*Bwahahahahaha! Bwahahaha! Hahahaha! \*\* …whewwww… \ ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/196 "2003-07-17T20:59:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > \*\*The interview I cited earlier said that the team looking for WMDs in Iraq will take a long time to reach conclusions. I predict that in the summer or fall of 2004 they will put out a comprehensive report showing all sorts of dangerous WMDs. The report will make the case that Bush saved the country and the world from disaster. His opponents will be seen to have been defaming the President while Bush was defending the nation. \*\* Evidence made public in fall 2004. Hmmm, just before the elections - enough time for it to be used to defame his critics and get him reelected before **that** evidence gets exposed as a steaming pile. The timing would be purely coincidental, I’m sure. Please tell me someone is using your account and posting this as a parody piece. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/197 "2003-07-17T22:08:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > I predict that in the summer or fall of 2004 they will put out a comprehensive report showing all sorts of dangerous WMDs. The report will make the case that Bush saved the country and the world from disaster. His opponents will be seen to have been defaming the President while Bush was defending the nation. … :eek: …? Wha…? [checking poster’s name again] Hmm… not Diogenes TC…? You know, **december** , with friends like you, the GOP doesn’t need any enemies. I can’t read your post in any other way, than you telling us how the spin to win '04, will be. This would then mean that: 1. The loss of American (and Iraqi) lives doesn’t matter to you, as long as the spin will work to keep GWB in office? 2. Or, you actually don’t care about truth, justice and freedom for all, and your only interest is in the spin? 3. Or, you are a certain kind of dweller under a certain type of construction, and meant to post this on another board. Enough with the rethoric (from me). I just had to rant. A straight question, **december** , and disregard what I wrote above: **In your honest opinion, do you think it’s right to stretch out the search for WMD or WMD programs, in order to gain popularity in the presidential election next year?** (on preview - I see that **Dissonance** has an equally hard time believing what **december** wrote.) ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/198 "2003-07-17T22:53:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Gaspode \* > In your honest opinion, do you think it’s right to stretch out the search for WMD or WMD programs, in order to gain popularity in the presidential election next year? No. I was half-kidding. But, I do think this issue has the potential to boomerang against the Democrats. I was addressing the political aspects because the current focus on the sentence from the SOTU looks to be like a political effort. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/199 "2003-07-17T23:09:15Z")
You didn’t answer if it’s right or not. ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661/200 "2003-07-17T23:13:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by World Eater \* > \*\*Boy are we going in circles here. It’s not about being a bald-face (you mean bold-face, but I digress) deception, it’s about the bigger picture, that the uncertainty should make us more conservative. > > Saddam may or may not have tried to acquire uranium. What does that mean? It means we don’t know shit, and we should go back to square one in our investigation. Once we have _proof positive_, then we should level the accusation, bring the case to the American people, or handle it through the UN. \*\* No, I meant bald-faced. Other than that I don’t really disagree with you. This particular cycle of media attention to different aspects of the uranium issue by itself does not help or hurt anyone’s case either way, imo. It’ll support some of what you’ve been saying, what I’ve been saying, some of what this one or that one thinks…my major problem is with the different media reports themselves. They make assertions, draw conclusions, raise questions…an _unnamed_ official, _close to_ the intelligence community, strictly off the record…etc etc. It’s maddening after a while if you’re a sincere news junkie, to have to wade through what is news and what is more likely campaign fodder. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-bush-knew-uranium-story-was-false/187661.md?page=11)