# CBS replied to me (re: Jonathon and TAR) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 30, 2004, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239 "2004-12-30T14:12:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Greywolf73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d9b06d/32.png) [@Greywolf73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greywolf73)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/1 "2004-12-30T14:12:32Z")
I thought you all might be interested in reading this. I wrote to CBS after watching the episode in which Jonathon hit Victoria, expressing my disgust that they would air that footage and that Jonathon wasn’t, at the very least, eliminated from the race. I didn’t know that “security officers” were present during the race. Now I wonder why they didn’t intervene? Or maybe they did and we just didn’t see that footage? Interesting. Here’s the reply I got yesterday: > [@](#): > > Thank you for writing to CBS regarding THE AMAZING RACE. We have noted your comments and concerns regarding the December 14 episode of this reality series. Please understand that THE AMAZING RACE is a program which chronicles a decidedly stressful experience that brings out strong emotions in its participants. Understandably, neither CBS nor the producers of the program judge the behavior or offer opinions about the relationships of the participants. Nevertheless, at all times during videotaping of the program security officers are close by and ready to intervene should a contestant be in danger of harm, either from the elements or even a co-competitor. > > Each series in the reality genre has its own contest rules that govern contestant behavior and the producers carefully consider any aggressive acts as they may apply to those rules. In addition, when extreme outbursts of frustration or emotion do occur on camera, a case-by-case decision is made whether or not to include such footage in the final edited program. We apologize if our decision in this case has caused you distress or concern. > > We appreciate your taking the time to write. Your comments have been shared with the senior executives at CBS. > > Cordially, > > Ray Faiola > Director, > CBS Audience Services ---
**Author:** ![Edward\_The\_Head](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ce73a5/32.png) [@Edward\_The\_Head](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Edward_The_Head)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/2 "2004-12-30T14:20:00Z")
Well even if it was a canned responce, you got the right one. I’ll bet they got a lot of flack from the public though and gave everyone the same email. Hopefully this will not happen again. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/3 "2004-12-30T14:43:44Z")
I’d like to note that when they did the “highlights” show this week, they included the run-up to the mat at the Brandenburg Gate, but didn’t show the shove at all. I think they got the message. Now whether that means they’ll just not SHOW Jonathan being an ass, I don’t know. I don’t have enough faith in human nature to believe he’ll actually STOP being an ass. ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/4 "2004-12-30T23:26:59Z")
I think they should have shown that. It would be dishonest, even for a reality series, to NOT show it. What was the desired response of the e-mail? ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/5 "2004-12-30T23:36:21Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I’d like to note that when they did the “highlights” show this week, they included the run-up to the mat at the Brandenburg Gate, but didn’t show the shove at all. I think they got the message. Quite the opposite from the [Slap Heard 'Round the World](http://www.mtv.com/onair/realworld/archive/epsd_summaries/rw7summaries.jhtml?Number=15) from _Real World_: Seattle. ---
**Author:** ![supervenusfreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@supervenusfreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/supervenusfreak)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/6 "2004-12-31T02:37:26Z")
> [@Troy McClure SF](#): > > Quite the opposite from the [Slap Heard 'Round the World](http://www.mtv.com/onair/realworld/archive/epsd_summaries/rw7summaries.jhtml?Number=15) from _Real World_: Seattle. I know. Every time they show highlights of “The Real World”, they seem tyo work the violent episodes into it. I was quite surprised that they did not included the “shove”, and the reactions to it. That would have made the clip episode very worthwhile. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/7 "2004-12-31T03:10:55Z")
Was the shove that big a deal? I haven’t been keeping up with the on-line buzz. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/8 "2004-12-31T04:15:39Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Was the shove that big a deal? I haven’t been keeping up with the on-line buzz. Do you often see real-life spousal abuse on primetime television? Yeah, I’d say it was a big deal. I was shocked. There had been some speculation about spousal abuse with these two before that, but to actually watch him hit her on national TV was just a little _too_ real. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/9 "2004-12-31T04:33:50Z")
Ah, I didn’t realize it’s being called spouse abuse. I just figured, ooh, that’s not gonna look good on camera, especially when they get done editing. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/10 "2004-12-31T04:41:50Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Ah, I didn’t realize it’s being called spouse abuse. I just figured, ooh, that’s not gonna look good on camera, especially when they get done editing. What would you call it, then? He physically assaulted her. Even if it was “only a shove”, he assaulted her. And it wasn’t Lori/Bolo type stuff either, where they’re both doing it playfully and to entertain. This was just nasty. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/11 "2004-12-31T04:50:09Z")
> [@Greywolf73](#): > > , expressing my disgust that they would air that footage and that Jonathon wasn’t, at the very least, eliminated from the race. Not knowing the show you are talking about I thought you wanted the guy killed. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/12 "2004-12-31T05:13:40Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > What would you call it, then? He physically assaulted her. Even if it was “only a shove”, he assaulted her. And it wasn’t Lori/Bolo type stuff either, where they’re both doing it playfully and to entertain. This was just nasty. I could be wrong of course, but I call it overacting/dramatizing to get more airtime on a reality show that loves to show people overacting/dramatizing everything. Sooner or later someone’s going to take it too far, but I’m not ready yet to call it assault. At least not a genuine assault. Maybe an “unscripted drama” assault. ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/13 "2004-12-31T06:36:40Z")
Well thank you, **GreyWolf** , and all the people like you who complained to CBS, for contributing to the continued pussyfooting and Disneyfication of network television. :rolleyes: What other moments would you like removed so they don’t offend your precious sensibilities? Kendra’s “breeding” comment? Bolo’s cerebral palsy act? Gus’s naked man-boobs? (Well, I might agree on that last one…) For that matter, CBS should remove all footage of the concentration camps from _Schindler’s List_ because they are too upsetting. And they should digitally erase the image of the World Trade Center from all movies prior to 2001 because they are too reminiscent of 9/11. And they should paint in Alex Trebek’s mustache because he looks too freaky without one. Oh, and taxicabs! I was attacked by a taxicab when I was young and they still give me night terrors whenever I see one. They’ve got to go. I seriously can’t BELIEVE how big a deal people are making over this event, and sometimes, the way they describe it, makes me think they were watching a different show altogether. Jonathan did not HIT Victoria. He hit her BACKPACK. But even if J. did punch V. in the mouth and force her to eat dog shit and call her Saddam Hussein’s bitch, I would not have a problem with CBS showing it. Because this is a REALITY show, and a reality show is supposed to show WHAT REALLY HAPPENS. Editing out J.'s abusive behavior does NOT make him any less of a despicable human being, in fact it’s a disservice to all viewers who deserve to see what a tool that creature really is. ---
**Author:** ![Kaitlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/73ab20/32.png) [@Kaitlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaitlyn)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/14 "2004-12-31T09:11:55Z")
CBS obiviously has a different sensibility than MTV when it comes to this sort of thing. During a marathon of Boiling Points last week, there must have been two dozen promos for a lame Survivor ripoff (both teams eliminate someone every round, regardless of who wins the challenges) in which a contestant hits another. Out of curiosity, I watched it (the promos worked on me, obviously) and it was actually pretty dull. One guy slaps another and is promptly eliminated from the game while the other guys whine about how unfair it is. Interesting concept–Battle of the Sexes–but poor execution and the worst host I’ve ever seen on reality tv. When you can’t even make a contestant hitting another interesting, your show has failed. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/15 "2004-12-31T09:24:02Z")
> [@KGS](#): > > Well thank you, **GreyWolf** , and all the people like you who complained to CBS, for contributing to the continued pussyfooting and Disneyfication of network television. :rolleyes: What other moments would you like removed so they don’t offend your precious sensibilities? Kendra’s “breeding” comment? Bolo’s cerebral palsy act? Gus’s naked man-boobs? (Well, I might agree on that last one…) My problem was not at all with the fact that CBS showed this footage. Like you, I feel like it’s better to see his behavior than to speculate about it and not really know. However, the issue for me is that there were no consequences at all for his actions, save the growing hatred of the TAR fan base. I have read similar complaints on other sites, where people are more upset that the incident was glossed over than they are that it was shown in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![TeaElle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@TeaElle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeaElle)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/16 "2004-12-31T09:24:23Z")
**KGS** , the problem isn’t that they showed what Jonathan did, it’s that there was no apparent reaction from the powers that be at The Amazing Race or CBS over what he did. Whether Jonathan’s hand was on Victoria’s body or on her backpack, what he did qualifies as an assault, he made material contact with her or an item directly connected to her in a manner which could have easily caused her bodily harm. It wasn’t accidental, it wasn’t unintentional, it was done maliciously and angrily. There’s no reason why an act of violence committed publicly, witnessed by dozens of people live on the scene, filmed and broadcast internationally should bear no consequences for the actor. ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/17 "2004-12-31T13:13:04Z")
> [@TeaElle](#): > > **KGS** , the problem isn’t that they showed what Jonathan did, it’s that there was no apparent reaction from the powers that be at The Amazing Race or CBS over what he did. J. got a severe talking-to by exec producer Bertram Van Munster after that leg, telling him to knock off the pushing & shoving. Granted, this was only revealed after the episode aired, and only those who read [small publications](http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/1221amazingrace21-ON.html) and TAR fansites would even know about it. CBS missed a prime opportunity to let all the casual viewers know by incorporating that into their clip show – unfortunately, they choked. As for the complaints…most of those I’ve read, in the form of “open letters” and such on dedicated TAR forums (where the vitrol is _intense_ – the comments here on SDMB are apathetic by comparison) seem to communicate that viewers were outraged by witnessing that incident to begin with, never mind the consequences. Let’s face it, the ones who sent official complaints were probably not in the most coherent frame of mind at the time, and probably felt silly the next morning. But it’s so easy to hit “submit”… > [@](#): > > Whether Jonathan’s hand was on Victoria’s body or on her backpack, what he did qualifies as an assault, he made material contact with her or an item directly connected to her in a manner which could have easily caused her bodily harm. I’ll give you that what J. did fits the strictest legal definition of “assault”, but c’mon. As it was, the scene was witnessed by several producers, security personnel, and at least one camera. And we know that none of them, including Victoria, felt it required any intervention or even a time penalty. Clearly, the scene looked much more brutal once edited into a 60-minute package. If Victoria had hit the ground, or if J. had hit any part of her body instead, I’d be much more inclined to agree with you. (And I’ll agree that Jonathan, like all professional wife-beaters, know just how far to push a situation without getting into real trouble. Obviously, he was so close to the line that he crossed it in many viewers’ eyes, while those on the scene decided he hadn’t.) > [@](#): > > There’s no reason why an act of violence committed publicly… Ah, there you go. Powerful buzzwords like “violence” and “assault” are being thrown around as if there’s no dividing line between an angry shove and a shotgun blast to the head. It’s inflaming the debate and making people react more unreasonably than they should. Yeah, it’s the Internet and it’s _de rigueur_, and I’m used to it by now. But it still pisses me off. ---
**Author:** ![Greywolf73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d9b06d/32.png) [@Greywolf73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greywolf73)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2004, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cbs-replied-to-me-re-jonathon-and-tar/282239/18 "2004-12-31T14:03:48Z")
> [@KGS](#): > > Well thank you, **GreyWolf** , and all the people like you who complained to CBS, for contributing to the continued pussyfooting and Disneyfication of network television. :rolleyes: What other moments would you like removed so they don’t offend your precious sensibilities? Kendra’s “breeding” comment? Bolo’s cerebral palsy act? Gus’s naked man-boobs? (Well, I might agree on that last one…) I don’t want my TV Disneyfied. Far from it. I just don’t consider spousal abuse entertainment. Like others have said, my issue is mainly with the fact that it was shown and then nothing was done about it. He wasn’t reprimanded or eliminated from the show. He suffered no consequences for what he did. CBS gave me the impression that they were thinking only of their ratings when they showed that footage, because by showing something like that and then not showing any reaction on the production team’s part, they knew that TAR fans would most likely be more inclined to tune in to the rest of the season just to see what Jonathon would do next.