# Cecil = partisan hack **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [April 11, 2003, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084 "2003-04-11T18:31:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TheMemeWarrior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TheMemeWarrior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheMemeWarrior)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/21 "2003-04-13T02:51:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by peepthis \* > \*\*It’s quite obvious to me that Cecil is a shrewd businessman. He knows that the great majority of the papers that carry his column are local, strongly liberal small papers. He shot his comment right at his target demographic, scoring a direct hit. I don’t care one whit about Cecil’s politics, but I don’t see his pandering to be any different than any other pundit on tv or the radio. \*\* There was nothing shrewd about his statement its only going to alienate readers (All be it only fussy whiner types) not attract new ones. In the past as a dozen people have already pointed out he’s made conservative points. I disagree with your point on the war but I dont share your strange compulsion to pretend the other side doesnt honestly hold their opinions. Maybe if you tried understanding why others hold an alternative view you wouldnt be so attached to your own. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/22 "2003-04-13T03:24:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by daz \* > \*\*It’s obvious now that the war was right, just, and necessary for all parties involved, even the French somewhat agree on that now. The world is now a better place because of it. \*\* Only a fool judges the wisdom of a decision by looking at the outcome. By your reasoning, playing Russian Roulette is a good idea–if you win. ---
**Author:** ![Creative\_Munster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/919ad9/32.png) [@Creative\_Munster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Creative_Munster)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/23 "2003-04-13T14:51:30Z")
He made a broad statement with a single sentence. He didn’t offer any information to support his viewpoint. It was unprofessional and unworthy of him. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/24 "2003-04-13T18:22:57Z")
Cecil (or his proxy) should be free to say whatever the Chicago Reader’s owners say he can say. I don’t think it was unethical; I just think it was uncharacteristically, well, shortsighted. People — especially people with friends and family fighting in the cities and deserts of Iraq — don’t take the war lightly. It isn’t a game. Nor is it a fitting prop to use as a joke. Wit is one thing, but foolish is as foolish does. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/25 "2003-04-13T20:20:02Z")
> [@](#): > > People — especially people with friends and family fighting in the cities and deserts of Iraq — don’t take the war lightly. It isn’t a game. Nor is it a fitting prop to use as a joke. Wit is one thing, but foolish is as foolish does. I didn’t take Cecil to be joking. I thought him to be serious in his opinion. He has a right to his opinion. Why would you think that Cecil considered the war a game? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/26 "2003-04-13T21:49:16Z")
Posted to the wrong thread. Sorry. There are two or three threads on this now, and in one of them someone suggested that he was likely just joking. If he was joking, it wasn’t funny. And if he wasn’t, it wasn’t tasteful. Even though I oppose the war, I know better than to _publish_ an opinion that the soldiers fighting in the deserts and cities are engaged in something foolish. Yes, he has a right to his opinion. But his opinion flies in the face of 81% of the American population. He might as well have talked about that fool desegration business. But if the Reader’s target audience is disenfranchized extremist liberals, then he’s fine. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/27 "2003-04-13T23:33:18Z")
**Lib** , if one thinks the war is foolish, the best you can do for the troops is be vocal about it being foolish so maybe people agree with you and it ends quicker. You know, to spare the lives of the troops who would have died otherwise? I think that’s a little more important than matters of taste… ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2003, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/28 "2003-04-13T23:47:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Lib, if one thinks the war is foolish, the best you can do for the troops is be vocal about it being foolish so maybe people agree with you and it ends quicker. You know, to spare the lives of the troops who would have died otherwise? Except, of course, that our de-facto President has set up all of us for this tar baby. If we back out now, the message will be taken as A) the USA doesn’t have the guts for a long war, and B) the USA doesn’t keep its promises. And the price ultimately to be paid in blood for _that_ is more than I want to think about. So, yes, it was a damn fool war to get into. But now we’re stuck with it, thanks to the damn fool we didn’t elect. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/29 "2003-04-14T04:59:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by John W. Kennedy \* > \*\*So, yes, it was a damn fool war to get into. But now we’re stuck with it, thanks to the damn fool we didn’t elect. \*\* I agree that in regards to the war the worst thing we could do now is pussy out. However, you are going to have to make a better case that Bush isn’t legitimately the president. The signal was smaller than the noise and a choice has to be made. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/30 "2003-04-14T05:37:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > Even though I oppose the war, I know better than to _publish_ an opinion that the soldiers fighting in the deserts and cities are engaged in something foolish. Odd that we’re willing to give up our liberties while we’re ostensibly helping the Iraqis reclaim theirs. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/31 "2003-04-14T07:37:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Revtim \* > \*\ ***Lib** , if one thinks the war is foolish, the best you can do for the troops is be vocal about it being foolish so maybe people agree with you and it ends quicker. You know, to spare the lives of the troops who would have died otherwise? > > I think that’s a little more important than matters of taste… \*\* People **don’t** agree with us. And the troops are not there under **our** orders. It is a foolish and myopic thing to weaken support for them. It emboldens those who wish to harm them. If the Fedayeen remnants think the troops have no support, they will renew their efforts to blow them up, hold children hostage, and so forth. The more support the troops have, the quicker the war ends. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/32 "2003-04-14T07:39:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\*Odd that we’re willing to give up our liberties while we’re ostensibly helping the Iraqis reclaim theirs. \*\* Liberals are already tossing out our liberties. They’ve been doing that since Emperor Roosevelt. Nobody is saying don’t oppose the war, only that — for your own sake — you shouldn’t look like a fool when doing it. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/33 "2003-04-14T14:59:56Z")
And obviously the only way to avoid looking like a fool when opposing the war, is to not do it publicly at all? Or to only do it apologetically? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/34 "2003-04-14T15:59:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > \*\*People **don’t** agree with us. And the troops are not there under **our** orders. It is a foolish and myopic thing to weaken support for them. It emboldens those who wish to harm them. If the Fedayeen remnants think the troops have no support, they will renew their efforts to blow them up, hold children hostage, and so forth. The more support the troops have, the quicker the war ends. \*\* I guess I don’t understand what it is that you think is weakening support for the troops. Can you elaborate on what it is that a person who is against the war should avoid doing, that in your opinion would lead to lengthening the war? I can’t imagine what could happened here in the US to urge on the Fedayeen remnants more than having US troops invading their homland. Protests here aren’t going to mean jack-shit compared to that. ---
**Author:** ![monty2\_2001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f0a364/32.png) [@monty2\_2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monty2_2001)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/35 "2003-04-14T23:44:07Z")
Painfully idiotic statement out of cecil on this one. Hey cecil, I’ve been a fan for a decade, but you are losing it. Better retire soon. You and ebert are getting NUTS in your age. ---
**Author:** ![Beer\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ad7895/32.png) [@Beer\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beer_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/36 "2003-04-15T06:18:18Z")
OFF TOPIC Today, in English Class, I commented on a Montaigne essay, On Cannibalism, in which he compares the brutality of New World cannibals to the brutality of religious persecution in 16th century France. My teacher, for some reason equated that with some horrible thing that one of Saddam’s sons had done. I said that I thought the essay was more applicable to American culture; as Montaigne had been trying to show that before his culture should demonize another they should look within, perhaps Americans would benefit from lessening criticism of other nations and dealing with some of the horrible things that we tend to overlook here. Looking back, it was a dumb comment to make in a class of 230 at an extremely pro-war campus. But half the people in the class jumped on me. Even my teacher was criticizing me for things that I never said, things that he inferred onto me. I had to argue with 100 people about what I had said and about my intent. Anyways, my point is that people are too damn touchy about this damn fool war. Both sides need to calm the hell down. ---
**Author:** ![Beer\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ad7895/32.png) [@Beer\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beer_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/37 "2003-04-15T06:19:41Z")
Also off-topic, why the hell am I not allowed to edit my own posts? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/38 "2003-04-15T12:21:16Z")
**Beer Penguin** , this board is just set up to not allow after-publication editing. We get to do it only on the “preview” function. Guess it’s a way to prevent “I never said that”. But your experience was informative… and in your case it wasn’t even a throwaway put-down like in Cecil’s comment, but an actual argument about how to interpret a source material that was out in the open for reference of those debating. Maybe the real “damn fool war” is the ideological one that has arisen _over here_, with unconditional, all-or-nothing, with-us-or-against-us vs. no-possible-justification, advocacies of both the pro- and anti- war positions. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/39 "2003-04-15T12:41:15Z")
> [@](#): > > why the hell am I not allowed to edit my own posts? Because it enables the practice of stealth trolling. ---
**Author:** ![Frumpy\_Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Frumpy\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frumpy_Jones)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084/40 "2003-04-15T13:11:36Z")
The effects of what Bush and his oil-hungry crew have done will not be seen for quite a few years. At which time, if things are bad, one of two statements will be made by republicans: [List] [li]It’s the deomcrats fault (Because a democrat will be in office)[/li][li]It’s something the democrats set in motion (Because nothing bad that happens during republican-run America, could possibly be the republicans fault, but was, instead, spear-headed by democrats, and LEFT with the republicans, when its bitter fruit ripened).[/li] Cecil’s comments are just as valid as yours. Which one is correct will be found out in time. You, my good sir, are not correct with your (first ever, theby lending you a very credible poster) post. Cecil, also, is not correct. This is simply because it just ain’t over. Who knows if Bush’s tactics, which placed us at odds with three of the seven most powerful nations in the world, will hurt future relations. Or how the world will view America when it is all said and done. We just don’t know yet. But History may help us: Last year, Bush vowed a war on Afganastan; to free their people from the evils and human rights violations that the Taliban had placed upon them. 15 months later, the Taliban have, accroding to news reports (Not many in America, by the way) been getting bold as of late, and gaining in confidence, and both vocal and acting supporters. Bush’s promise to help establish “Democracy, Human Rights, and reconstruction” in Afganastan sound errily familiar to the comments he’s made about Iraq. Yet the internationally raised one billion dollars “given” to Afganastan to help rebuild, is being seen ONLY in Kabul, where new cars, new resturants, and the rising land costs are visible. Also of note, Bush has earmarked a nice, democratic, human righted, and rebuilding amount of ZERO DOLLARS to help Afganastan this year. And this is the same ‘help’ he’s offering Iraq. For my exact views on the Iraq, war, [Click Here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=176828) . [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cecil-partisan-hack/168084.md?page=3)