# celeocanth?/loch ness? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 12, 2000, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155 "2000-01-12T14:38:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@bda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bda)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/1 "2000-01-12T14:38:00Z")
whats up with the celeocanth? . . they caught one off of madagasgar i believe in 1936 . . and it was supposed to be extinct. has anyone ever found another? and what ever happened with the loch ness monster? . . do people still look for it? ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/2 "2000-01-12T14:51:00Z")
Yeah, that Attenborough guy actually showed a coelacanth being caught a few years ago. They catch 'em every once in a while. A couple of years ago, the last surviving member of the group that staged the photo of the Loch Ness Monster taken in the '30s admitted to having participated in the hoax. ---
**Author:** ![Oblio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c4cdca/32.png) [@Oblio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oblio)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/3 "2000-01-12T14:52:00Z")
Yes, but I can’t recall where or when the last celeocanth was caught. I also recall seeing a live shot of one not too long ago. ---
**Author:** ![bda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@bda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bda)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/4 "2000-01-12T14:53:00Z")
richard attenbourough? are any in aquariums? ---
**Author:** ![Satan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Satan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satan)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/5 "2000-01-12T15:32:00Z")
Yeah, I love that commercial too! * * * Yer pal, Satan _ **First Place** Most Popular Poster of the 20th Century Competition As overseen by Coldfire_ ---
**Author:** ![SaxFace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@SaxFace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaxFace)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/6 "2000-01-12T15:34:00Z")
You probably couldn’t find anything because the proper spelling is Coelacanth. Go to: [www.dinofish.com](http://www.dinofish.com) * * * Formerly unknown as “Melanie” ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/7 "2000-01-12T15:39:00Z")
I said “that Attenborough guy” because I never can remember which one (David or Richard) is the actor and which one is the “naturalist.” Whichever one has done the numerous nature documentaries showed one being caught while he was there on the boat. There was no mention of any in captivity. He also showed some slight differences between the fish of today and its fossilized great-grand pappies. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/8 "2000-01-12T15:43:00Z")
If I recall correctly, the modern coelacanths mostly live in the deep waters off the Comoros Islands in the Indian Ocean. The natives have caught them for centuries, but they don’t like to do that. The flesh is oily and unpalatable, there are too many bones, and they are heavy fish that tend to tear nets. The big scales make for nice scrapers, though. As this branch of the family seems to have moved into deep ocean back in the Devonian, it is not surprizing at all that they are mostly absent from the fossil record. Most of our good fossils come from rocks formed in shallow waters, usually in seas that covered low-lying continental areas. It is very difficult for geological processes to bring deep ocean sedimentary formation up to where we can search them for fossils. That being said, I understand that within the past decade or so some nice coelacanth specimens have been found in Cretaceous formations in the Middle East. So they are not as cryptic as they seemed when the living species was first brought to the attention of European ichthyologists. ## What does this ugly fish have to do with Nessie? Are you suggesting that the survival of a rare deep-ocean fish has bearing on the existence of a large sea-serpent in one of the most heavily travelled stretched of water in the British Isles? I fail to see any relevance. Dr. Fidelius, Charlatan Associate Curator Anomalous Paleontology, Miskatonic University “You cannot reason a man out of a position he did not reach through reason.” ---
**Author:** ![SaxFace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@SaxFace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaxFace)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/9 "2000-01-12T15:55:00Z")
Ha! I didn’t realize it, but I am on the Coelacanth Hall of Fame, according to the website. The coelacanth has always been my favorite fish and I’ve studied it a lot. The site is a really good place to learn about it, too, but if you have questions, lay 'em on me. * * * Formerly unknown as “Melanie” ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/10 "2000-01-12T16:04:00Z")
Cool! A second species in Indonesia! This could mean that there are any number of populations throughout the deepwater environs of the Indian Ocean. WHich, of course, carries no implications for my real life at all… ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/11 "2000-01-12T16:26:00Z")
Didn’t a couple of mechanics find a coelacanth in a trunk? Oh, wait, that was a full-size spare tire! 🙂 * * * The Canadians. They walk among us. William Shatner. Michael J. Fox. Monty Hall. Mike Meyers. Alex Trebek. All of them Canadians. All of them here. ---
**Author:** ![pluto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f08c70/32.png) [@pluto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pluto)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/12 "2000-01-12T16:33:00Z")
I didn’t find any info on this in a very cursory examination of the referenced site but IIRC there aren’t any coelacanths in captivity because they are deep-water denizens. When brought to the surface they expire. Cool site, though. Very well put together. * * * That’ll do, pig. That’ll do. ---
**Author:** ![bda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@bda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bda)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/13 "2000-01-12T16:34:00Z")
no . .that was jimmy hoffa ---
**Author:** ![bda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@bda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bda)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/14 "2000-01-12T16:36:00Z")
no relevance fidelius . . just one reminded me ive been wondering about the other ---
**Author:** ![bda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@bda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bda)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/15 "2000-01-12T16:44:00Z")
how deep water? . . do they have that luminescent thing? . . jeez what if we figured out how to gene engineer that thing into people. wow! . .is this a great age we live in . . or what? ---
**Author:** ![tanstaafl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba8739/32.png) [@tanstaafl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanstaafl)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/16 "2000-01-12T17:41:00Z")
> [@](#): > > do they have that luminescent thing? . . jeez what if we figured out how to gene engineer that thing into people. wow! . .is this a great age we live in . . or what? Closer than you think bda… Check: [http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/science/DailyNews/glowguns000106.html](http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/science/DailyNews/glowguns000106.html) or [http://www.prolume.com](http://www.prolume.com) * * * “Drink your coffee! Remember, there are people sleeping in China.” Dennis Matheson — [dennis@mountaindiver.com](mailto:dennis@mountaindiver.com) Hike, Dive, Ski, Climb — [www.mountaindiver.com](http://www.mountaindiver.com) ---
**Author:** ![Olentzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90ced4/32.png) [@Olentzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Olentzero)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/17 "2000-01-12T19:03:00Z")
National Geographic had an article on coelacanths a couple of years ago. Bet your library periodical index could help you locate it. * * * Cave Diem! Carpe Canem! ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2000, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/18 "2000-01-12T20:04:00Z")
As far as Nessie goes, a couple years back a man admitted to faking the famous blurry photo of its head and neck popping out of the water, having used a scale model in a tiny estuary. * * * “It’s my considered opinion you’re all a bunch of sissies!”–Paul’s Grandfather ---
**Author:** ![Yeah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/dbc845/32.png) [@Yeah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeah)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2000, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/19 "2000-01-13T04:00:00Z")
The recent identification of a coelacanth in a market in Manado, North Sulawesi, Indonesia demonstrates that mapping the locations where fishers catch them does necessarily provide an accurate map of where they live. I see no reason to believe that there cannot be large populations living off other tropical volcanic islands where deep water fishing is not practiced. The [dinofish.com](http://dinofish.com) website is indeed very nice but inexplicably fails to mention the 1950s horror classic, “Monster on Campus” starring Athur Franz and a coelacanth replica. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2000, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155/20 "2000-01-13T05:05:00Z")
Dr. F-out of curiosity, since you seem a man of academia (meaning publish or die, unless you got tenure), are you familiar with controversy over the naming of the Indonesian species that was discovered. Referring to the post-doc that spotted the first specimen from the new population which he saw in a fish market on his honeymoon. And the French bastard that “scooped” him? Dog eat dog world in who publishes first. I’ve got the references in Nature, but I’ll have to dig them up. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celeocanth-loch-ness/6155.md?page=2)