# Celestina, I don't mean to be a jerk, but . . . **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 2, 2005, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920 "2005-02-02T02:51:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Rhubarb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/59ef9b/32.png) [@Rhubarb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhubarb)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/21 "2005-02-02T05:20:17Z")
> [@Silver Fire](#): > > Hey, I didn’t even know she’s black until you said so but knowing that doesn’t make it any less annoying and it sure as fuck doesn’t make me, or anyone else in this thread, racist. Fuck you for even bringing race into this. Black, you say? That’s odd. On my screen all you people are **Blue** , 'cept for the ones I’ve clicked on. Ya’ll are **Purple**. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e4f/32.png) [@Silver\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Fire)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/22 "2005-02-02T05:24:15Z")
> [@Nightwatch Trailer](#): > > My personal vernacular involves using “this” in place of “that.” Well knock it off, it’s annoying. 😛 I hope you’re right. If not, fuck this. I mean… that. Her. Whatever. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/23 "2005-02-02T05:33:36Z")
It’s hard, sometimes, to create a “voice” in writing, and taking on affectations can help define how you want to come across. One of my favorite authors, P.G. Wodehouse, for instance, was a writer that liked these long, tortured, sub-sub-sub claused descriptive sentances with oodles of adverbs and asides. Vonnegut loves these short, kind of jabbing paragraphs periodically puncuated by meaningless phrases (“So it goes.”) And Hemmingway…well, we won’t talk about Hemmingway. Anyway, I think **Celestina** is just trying to sound like herself, rather than sounding like the next girl. While I’ll agree that it’s (very) mildly annoying in overuse, I don’t think it’s a real problem in terms of comprehension of her meaning. If it bugs you, just skip her posts. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Talon\_Karrde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Talon\_Karrde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Talon_Karrde)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/24 "2005-02-02T06:07:12Z")
I thought the accent thing was really annoying, but then I read one of **Celestina** ’s posts and liked it so much that I decided I don’t care. I’ve decided that she’s a cool enough person that it doesn’t matter to me. ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/25 "2005-02-02T06:25:07Z")
> [@Nightwatch Trailer](#): > > My personal vernacular involves using “this” in place of “that.” The technical term for this is an idiotlect. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/26 "2005-02-02T06:44:47Z")
When I am feeling most informal and at ease with myself, I will sometimes write in dialect. It may be annoying to some, but it is actually common to do that in the South. I recall that during the opening ceremonies of the Olympic Games in Atlanta, there was a moment when a sign of some sort was flashed that said: > [@](#): > > HOW Y’ALL DOIN’? Just because writing in dialect might be lame or affected in your part of the country doesn’t mean that it is for Celestina. I do understand why people tire of it quickly though – except for _y’all_ which is a perfectly good word for informal English. ---
**Author:** ![Nightwatch\_Trailer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9dc877/32.png) [@Nightwatch\_Trailer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nightwatch_Trailer)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/27 "2005-02-02T06:53:13Z")
> [@roger thornhill](#): > > The technical term for this is an idiotlect. An insult? Draw thy steel, sirrah. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/28 "2005-02-02T07:02:34Z")
> [@Nightwatch Trailer](#): > > An insult? Draw thy steel, sirrah. 😉 Oops, my bad. I should of course have written idiolect, not idiotlect. ---
**Author:** ![uglybeech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/82dd89/32.png) [@uglybeech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/uglybeech)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/29 "2005-02-02T08:24:12Z")
It doesn’t annoy me because it’s not proper or because it’s over the top. It annoys me because it sounds phony to me. It clangs. Maybe it’s not, maybe that’s how Celestina talks, but ummm…well I’m always in favor of the throwing in the vernacular because the vernacular’s interesting. But this just sounds like a cliche. Can anyone tell just what dialect it is? ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/30 "2005-02-02T12:38:49Z")
I think celestina is white, from her pic on one or another of the people pages. Is my memory off? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/31 "2005-02-02T12:40:41Z")
> [@uglybeech](#): > > Can anyone tell just what dialect it is? “Southern vernacular” ? ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/32 "2005-02-02T12:51:52Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > Yall are racist for disrespecting the sister’s down home language. :wally You think black folks haven’t earned the right to do their own thing in this country by now? The HELL they haven’t! > > I can tell none of yall ever read any Zora Neale Hurston. And you talk about your “written” English. _Hpmh_. It’s clearly southern, but it’s not clearly AAVE - while AAVE and general southern English are similar, they’re not identical and this didn’t have that flavor, in my opinion. Have _you_ read Zora Neale Hurston? Most of what she wrote used standard English, actually. > [@uglybeech](#): > > It doesn’t annoy me because it’s not proper or because it’s over the top. It annoys me because it sounds phony to me. It clangs. Exactly. All the "I do declare"s, like I said, do not ring true. I have no problem with “y’all” - in fact, I use that word all the time, since it’s useful to maintain a singular-plural distinction in the second person. It’s just the excessive, artificial downhominess that bugs me. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/33 "2005-02-02T12:54:45Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > It’s clearly southern, but it’s not clearly AAVE - while AAVE and general southern English are similar, they’re not identical and this didn’t have that flavor, in my opinion. Have _you_ read Zora Neale Hurston? Most of what she wrote used standard English, actually. To whit: > [@Zora Neale Hurston](#): > > They huddled closer and stared at the door. They just didn’t use another part of their bodies, and they didn’t look at anything but the door. The time was past for asking the white folks what to look for through that door. Six eyes were questioning God. None of the grating, excessive dialect that Celestina uses. It shows up in dialect, but not in narration. ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/34 "2005-02-02T13:00:28Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > I have no problem with “y’all” - in fact, I use that word all the time, since it’s useful to maintain a singular-plural distinction in the second person. Nonsense. The correct way to indicate second-person plural is “yunz.” ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/35 "2005-02-02T13:07:50Z")
Does she post like that all the time, or is it just an occasional post, or part of a post?Because if posting in a “dialect” is just occasional, or just a part of a longer post, then I’d conclude that it’s done for emphasis, and IMHO, that’s okay. (Especially because I do it myself with some frequency.) If she posts like that all the time, well, I could see how that might be annoying. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/36 "2005-02-02T13:22:50Z")
I like the way **Celestina** is writing now. I feel her presence, her humanity, her warmth coming through better than ever. To see her writing in a voice that is comfortable and relaxed for her puts me at ease with her when we share ideas. Strong women like her know how to find their own voice and use it. Don’t like it? Better get used to it. Women from now on are going to have their own voice. **Celestina** , you go, girl. ---
**Author:** ![UrbanChic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9dc877/32.png) [@UrbanChic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UrbanChic)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/37 "2005-02-02T14:29:30Z")
I find it distracting and annoying, but not worth pitting. When I was reading the ‘Ask a Muslim Woman’ thread in GD, I couldn’t get more than a quarter through celestina’s posts. ---
**Author:** ![UrbanChic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9dc877/32.png) [@UrbanChic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UrbanChic)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/38 "2005-02-02T14:31:06Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > Strong women like her know how to find their own voice and use it. Don’t like it? Better get used to it. Women from now on are going to have their own voice. **Celestina** , you go, girl. Thanks for the laugh this morning. It’s been a sucky few days, but this was comedy _gold_. ---
**Author:** ![Stonebow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Stonebow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stonebow)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/39 "2005-02-02T14:45:05Z")
It’s about as annoying to me as the grapist was, I guess. I really like the fact that this is a place for ‘real’ discussion- no frills enlightenment. No avatars, a paucity of sig lines, etc. Just good talk. And i say this as someone who’s early posts were certainly less than stylistically correct- but when it was pointed out to me that my lack of capitalizations hindered people’s ability to converse with me, I made an effort to change to meet what I thought were the high standards of these boards. Of course, my content still generally sucks, but that’s neither here nor there. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![TroubleAgain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e480ec/32.png) [@TroubleAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroubleAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920/40 "2005-02-02T14:48:40Z")
Another vote for annoying here. I’m a native Southerner, and I hear it all the time. It doesn’t bother me much to hear it, but it bothers the hell out of me to see it written that way. Is it so much harder to type trying than to type tryin’? It strikes me as artificial and fake, too, I have to say. It seems like a “look at me” type thing, which is okay in the right context, but not in every post everywhere. I’ve been known to use it as a joke, in the right thread, on the right board…but very seldom, and definitely tongue-in-cheek. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/celestina-i-dont-mean-to-be-a-jerk-but/287920.md?page=3)