# Chai tea...wtf is it supposed to be? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 18, 2014, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669 "2014-05-18T02:58:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2014, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/81 "2014-05-18T20:33:36Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > Of course not, To fight my ignorance a little, could you answer the following? If I was in India, could I simply order “chai” or would I need to specify what kind of chai I wanted. If I can simply order “chai,” would I by default get the sweet, milky stuff? Would it be spiced? If I wanted plain black tea, what would I order? What would you suggest as a replacement name for “chai tea” in primarily English-speaking countries? Just “chai”? Thanks. I’m a Texan, so I’m more of an ice tea guy. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2014, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/82 "2014-05-18T20:53:56Z")
As a lover of Japanese media, and a native English speaker, I think I’d have exploded long ago if I had the OP’s attitude toward foreign borrowings of my language. English-derived words in Japanese narrow, broaden, or completely alter the meanings all the damn time. Pierce is a noun (earrings), bloomers are pretty much the opposite of what they are in English, etc… ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/83 "2014-05-19T00:07:14Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > To fight my ignorance a little, could you answer the following? > > If I was in India, could I simply order “chai” or would I need to specify what kind of chai I wanted. > > If I can simply order “chai,” would I by default get the sweet, milky stuff? Would it be spiced? You would most likely get sweet milky stuff. That’s how most Indians drink their chai. It would most likely not be spiced. You would have to specify Masala Chai if you wanted the spiced stuff. > [@](#): > > If I wanted plain black tea, what would I order? Kaali(black) chai(tea). > [@](#): > > What would you suggest as a replacement name for “chai tea” in primarily English-speaking countries? Just “chai”? Either Masala tea or Spiced tea would make sense. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/84 "2014-05-19T02:08:57Z")
Am I the only person who learned about “chai” and had no idea it was tea, because I never heard it called “chai tea”? The most common word I hear it modifying is latte. ---
**Author:** ![II\_Gyan\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bbe5ce/32.png) [@II\_Gyan\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/II_Gyan_II)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/85 "2014-05-19T07:36:30Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > You would most likely get sweet milky stuff. That’s how most Indians drink their chai. It would most likely not be spiced. You would have to specify Masala Chai if you wanted the spiced stuff. By spice, do you include cardamom or ginger? Because either one or both of those two are used commonly in plain ‘chai’. At most street tea vendors in Mumbai, at least. ---
**Author:** ![Echo\_Charlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b5e925/32.png) [@Echo\_Charlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Echo_Charlie)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/86 "2014-05-19T08:46:43Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > Like I said, for me, it’s because both English and Hindi are ‘my language’. There are hundreds of millions of Indians for whom English is their language. There’s a sizeable intercourse between English speaking American and Indian people (though most of it may be one way), and so to millions of speakers of the English language, ‘Chai tea’ is ignorant nonsense(literally). I’m pushing back against it in an appropriate forum 🙂 Perhaps it would be helpful to think of “chai tea” as an appropriate usage in American English, a language that differs in many ways from the English used by Indian people. Much as in the same way that British English has many usages that are different in American English. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/87 "2014-05-19T18:42:55Z")
> [@Rachellelogram](#): > > I always thought chai tasted kind of pumpkin-y. It’s a delicious beverage that is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea. I disagree. I hate pumpkin. I’m not a tea fan unless it has enough sugar in it to stand the spoon upright. Love chai tea latte. I’ll go with the spicy, milky, chai-y goodness. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/88 "2014-05-19T20:35:23Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > (and apparently, chai is a pretty universal word for tea, so I’m limiting matters by saying Hindi here). Apropos of nothing but tea and chai are actually cognates, i.e. they both can be traced back to the proto-sino-tibetan root \*s-la. > [@](#): > > When you, in ignorance, use a word from one of these in a nonsensical way in the other, I think I have a legitimate position in saying that it’s ignorant and nonsensical, and should be scotched. This is known as the etymological fallacy; it’s the idea that a word is somehow inextricably linked to an older or ‘original’ meaning. (I use quotes because if we dig enough we almost always can find a older meaning than the meaning under discussion.) Chai, in hindi, means tea. Then chai came to the UK and America but we already had a very popular and common word for tea, tea. So a process known as semantic differentiation occurred where chai -in english, mind you- developed a stricter meaning so that the semantic meaning of chai and tea would stop bumping heads. It’s a common and unremarkable process that happens all the time in all languages. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/89 "2014-05-21T03:23:56Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > I disagree. I hate pumpkin. I’m not a tea fan unless it has enough sugar in it to stand the spoon upright. Love chai tea latte. I’ll go with the spicy, milky, chai-y goodness. The flavor she’s talking about, I suspect, is not pumpkin so much as “pumpkin pie spices,” which calls to mind pumpkin by association (you also find a lot of this in pumpkin beers. They don’t really taste like pumpkin. They taste like pumpkin pie spice.) You know, nutmeg, cinnamon, cloves, ginger. I agree, the Indian spiced tea that is known as Chai in the US and perhaps other English speaking environs does not taste like pumpkin itself at all. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/90 "2014-05-21T10:54:31Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > If it’s ignorant nonsense, it’s ignorant nonsense. Now, you’re just getting a little insulting. The fact that Chai means Tea in Hindi is nothing more than irrelevant trivia to me, because I don’t speak Hindi, and have no desire to speak Hindi. In the English language, the one that I speak, Chai means Indian Style Spiced Tea. It can also be used to indicate the mix of spices one would use in that tea, that can also be used for other foods, like Lattes and Cookies. Amazingly enough, people who speak Hindi use a different word for that spice mix. It’s as if they speak an entirely different language. Shocking, I know. ---
**Author:** ![alexandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e68b1a/32.png) [@alexandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alexandra)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/91 "2014-05-21T11:15:32Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Now, you’re just getting a little insulting. > > The fact that Chai means Tea in Hindi is nothing more than irrelevant trivia to me, because I don’t speak Hindi, and have no desire to speak Hindi. In the English language, the one that I speak, Chai means Indian Style Spiced Tea. It can also be used to indicate the mix of spices one would use in that tea, that can also be used for other foods, like Lattes and Cookies. > > Amazingly enough, people who speak Hindi use a different word for that spice mix. It’s as if they speak an entirely different language. Shocking, I know. It’s as if you haven’t bothered to read any of the posts explaining that \*\*bldysabba \*\* and numerous other Indians speak both Hindi and English fluently and naturally. Got to admit, some of the pushback on this is a little defensive and ridiculous. Yes, language evolves, but it’s useful to have some pushback on that evolution to prevent redundancy, loss of nuance, and decreased utility and clarity. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/92 "2014-05-21T11:23:15Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Seriously? In the New York metro area (like Brooklyn!)? 100s, at least. > > The best man in my wedding was born and raised in Mumbai. Came here for grad school. I gotta ask him his take on this… I totally forgot to post- I emailed my friend and he wrote back. > [@](#): > > On May 18, 2014, at 1:49 PM, wrote: > > Hi XXXXXXX, > > Stupid question: does term “chai tea” (to refer to highly spiced, generally sweetened and with milk) bother you or seem silly when you see it or read it, since chai = tea? > > Truly curious… > > Hope all is well! > > XXXX Here’s his reply: > [@](#): > > XXXXX, > Ha! I suppose it doesn’t bother me- but you are absolutely correct in that it is redundant! [Unrelated personal conversation snipped] > A lot of chai chai is in my immediate future as we visit India this summer. > > XXXXXX So, like everyone’s been saying, yes it’s technically redundant and no, it does not bother him in any way. ---
**Author:** ![Meurglys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/258eb7/32.png) [@Meurglys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meurglys)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/93 "2014-05-21T11:26:02Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > In parts of the south of England, particularly London, we sometimes call tea “cha”. Does she say “chai” (rhymes with fly) or “cha” (with a long a as in “ah”)? If I heard someone from the south of England say ‘cha’ for tea, I’d assume they were actually saying ‘char’ and dropping the final letter… (But further reading shows me that both spellings are ok) And, while I haven’t liked chai when I’ve tried it, I quite fancy trying a [chai smoothie](http://www.eteaket.co.uk/you-old-chai-smoothie/) at one of my local teashops! ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/94 "2014-05-21T11:27:06Z")
> [@alexandra](#): > > Got to admit, some of the pushback on this is a little defensive and ridiculous. Yes, language evolves, but it’s useful to have some pushback on that evolution to prevent redundancy, loss of nuance, and decreased utility and clarity. Of course, in English, the development of the more specific meaning of chai prevents redundancy, increases nuance, utility and clarity. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/95 "2014-05-21T11:42:15Z")
> [@alexandra](#): > > It’s as if you haven’t bothered to read any of the posts explaining that \*\*bldysabba \*\* and numerous other Indians speak both Hindi and English fluently and naturally. Again, irrelevant trivia. Am I really supposed to care how many people speak both Hindi and English, and change my language (or consent to being insulted) because of it? If they don’t call this stuff Chai Tea in India that’s totally cool. It’s like how the British call French Fries “Chips” and Potato Chips “Crisps”. They have their words for the product, we have our words. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/96 "2014-05-21T12:15:23Z")
> [@alexandra](#): > > It’s as if you haven’t bothered to read any of the posts explaining that \*\*bldysabba \*\* and numerous other Indians speak both Hindi and English fluently and naturally. > > Got to admit, some of the pushback on this is a little defensive and ridiculous. Yes, language evolves, but it’s useful to have some pushback on that evolution to prevent redundancy, loss of nuance, and decreased utility and clarity. The OP started by saying it makes no sense. When it was pointed out that this linguistic phenomenon has a long history he just kept insisting it was nonsense and his opinion was the most valid. His posts set the tone. If the point was simply “English is weird”, well, few would have disagreed. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/97 "2014-05-21T12:57:25Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > If the point was simply “English is weird”, well, few would have disagreed. More like “languages are weird,” as this phenomenon exists in other languages, (although I don’t find this weird at all. It seems fairly logical to me.) ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/98 "2014-05-21T13:02:31Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > And, well, it’s also not just an English thing. This phenomenon exists in other languages, too. My guess would be that it’s fairly widespread, if not universal. Of course, but I was trying to specific to the OPs complaints and his tone. If he had said, “isn’t language weird”, that’d have been a similar tone, compared to what he did say. I do think English has a long history of appropriating foreign words and adapting them. Some languages are much more resistant- French for example. English seems to revel in adopting foreign words. Makes things interesting. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/99 "2014-05-21T18:50:59Z")
Why not choose to find it amusing? I remember a Taco Bell commercial for “Grilled Carne Asada Steak Tacos” and I thought that was pretty funny and made me feel all content and smug and superior for a few minutes. So just go with it and feel the glow! ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669/100 "2014-05-21T19:34:12Z")
I’ve never heard anyone use the term “Chai Tea.” It’s just Chai. Similarly, I’ve never heard anyone say salsa sauce or kielbasa sausage or Mount Fujiyama. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chai-tea-wtf-is-it-supposed-to-be/688669.md?page=6)