# Change for a spouse's benefit: how much is appropriate? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 16, 2009, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079 "2009-10-16T19:48:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Haunted\_Pasta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/94ad74/32.png) [@Haunted\_Pasta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haunted_Pasta)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/1 "2009-10-16T19:48:05Z")
Based on what I posted in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=536202) (Post #11): How much should a partner in a marriage change for the benefit of the other? To me it seems there two basic ideas. Needless to say, both are based on the assumption that it would apply equally to both partners. “Change” can mean whatever you want it to- changing habits, changing viewpoints, changing general approaches to life, whatever. (A) You shouldn’t have to change much, but you shouldn’t ask your partner to change much, either. Sometimes there are exceptions, of course, but for the most part, each partner should just live and let live. (B) You should make a sincere effort to change as much as possible to please your partner, with the understanding that your partner will be making a similar effort on your behalf. It may be difficult, but the long-term benefit outweighs the short-term cost. What do you think? ---
**Author:** ![Hawkeyeop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/958977/32.png) [@Hawkeyeop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hawkeyeop)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/2 "2009-10-16T19:58:45Z")
I’m gonna go with choice C, strictly in between those extremes. ---
**Author:** ![Oregon\_sunshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/50afbb/32.png) [@Oregon\_sunshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oregon_sunshine)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/3 "2009-10-16T20:07:56Z")
I couldn’t answer with either A) or B), only a mixture of both, I guess. My opinion is that, although we shouldn’t expect spouses to change in any way just for their spouse’s benefit, both spouses have a responsibility to continue growing (or growing up, one might call it) and evolving as an end in itself. This, of course, generally results in people becoming more mature and better for one another, but it shouldn’t be done _just_ for the other person. Does that make sense? Married female BTW. ---
**Author:** ![pbbth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f9ae1b/32.png) [@pbbth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pbbth)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/4 "2009-10-16T20:15:41Z")
I won’t ask my SO to change anything that isn’t a direct safety hazard. If it would cause physical or mental harm to him or any children we have someday (leaving carving knives on the table or extreme road rage or something) then it has to be addressed but other than that I know what I’m getting into before I marry him and unless it is a dangerous thing I am willing to let it alone. ---
**Author:** ![EmAnJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d2c977/32.png) [@EmAnJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmAnJ)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/5 "2009-10-16T20:20:19Z")
I have to say I’m in between too, and it would depend on the circumstances. For example, I was an alcoholic and it was a big part of my life. I had to do a life overhaul in order to keep my husband around. I changed dramatically. On the other hand, if he wanted me to completely change my personality, or even if he wanted me to, say, convert to some weird religion, I’d say no way. ---
**Author:** ![C3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/c3/32/3108_2.png) [@C3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C3)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/6 "2009-10-16T20:28:23Z")
This is actually the one thing my husband and I continually disagree about. I feel like he “nags” me about little things and I get resentful because I let so many of his little things go. He feels like he should be able to bring up any little thing that irritates him and that I should, for the most part, accommodate his preferences. He thinks I should do the same with things he does that irritate me. I don’t want to mention all the stuff he does that annoys me, because I’m not a nag and I don’t want to become a nag. I prefer to just let it go and accept that he’s not going to become perfect if only I just keep tweaking his habits. I would say 99% of our disagreements come from this one issue. For all the big stuff, we are in agreement and we have the same values, so I’m talking about really trivial stuff like throwing dirty clothes on the floor right next to the hamper (one of his little things that irritates me) or not squeezing the toothpaste from the bottom (something I do that irritates him). To be clear, this is not a huge problem in our marriage or anything, it’s just something we don’t see eye to eye on. In fact, today we are celebrating our anniversary - 10 very happy years! ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/7 "2009-10-16T20:30:30Z")
I’m too old to change. ---
**Author:** ![gwendee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/35a633/32.png) [@gwendee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gwendee)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/8 "2009-10-16T20:36:04Z")
I had a tough time choosing. I think being married means agreeing to a certain amount of compromise. My husband asking me to change a longstanding habit of stepping out of my shoes wherever I was and leaving them there seemed reasonable to me. Asking him to start coming to church with me, or stop drinking beer seem like more change than is reasonable to expect. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/9 "2009-10-16T21:09:01Z")
I wouldn’t have married her if she needed a lot of changes. Obviously marriage involves compromise, but if we weren’t basically compatible, I don’t see the point of marrying her. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/10 "2009-10-16T21:27:25Z")
Any living-together situation takes _some_ measure of compromise. Therefore, he tries really, really hard not to leave partially-consumed glasses of milk in the bedroom (he leaves dirty glasses/dishes in the bedroom all the time; only bothers me with un-consumed milk) and I try really, really hard not to crack my knuckles when he’s around. These are the minor things we’ve decided annoy us (respectively) enough that they’re worth _asking_ for change. Most of the stuff, both major _and_ minor, we knew before we got married. Just FTR, I’m female, and we’ve been married for almost 21 years now, together for almost 27 years. Yikes. Mostly, we’re both pretty laid-back, and it’s one of the reasons neither of us makes many demands on the other. I mean, we _will_ do things, just because we know the other person appreciates it; on nights I know he’s going to be home for dinner, I try to plan something he really likes. He will bring me home bottles of wine he thinks I may enjoy (he doesn’t drink wine). But this is just simple thoughtfulness, not based on any demands/requests from the other side. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/11 "2009-10-16T22:36:37Z")
I think people of goodwill will generally adapt themselves over time away from behaviors that cause conflict with their SO or spouse. I find that has happened, without direct intention, in my 17-year relationship. But if you mean changing physical appearance unrelated to health (e.g. plastic surgery) then I have zero tolerance for any partner that expects that, and zero expectation that I would ever do that to please anyone except myself. Roddy ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2009, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/12 "2009-10-17T00:03:43Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > I think people of goodwill will generally adapt themselves over time away from behaviors that cause conflict with their SO or spouse. I find that has happened, without direct intention, in my 17-year relationship. I didn’t actually think about this, but I agree with you. With my husband and me, if one of us expresses some displeasure, even without saying “it really makes me crazy when you. . .”, I think we both make some effort at change. It’s considerate and thoughtful, and every interpersonal relationship benefits from that! ---
**Author:** ![Pyper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Pyper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pyper)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2009, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/13 "2009-10-17T23:24:42Z")
About 25 cents. _d&r_ ---
**Author:** ![Serenata67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/serenata67/32/10646_2.png) [@Serenata67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Serenata67)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/14 "2009-10-18T02:42:36Z")
Hmm… I’m engaged. I’m getting married in January, and I’ve been living with him like a “married couple” … so I aligned myself there. But I didn’t ask him to change much. And he didn’t ask me to. I got him to fold towels my way, and he’s taught me how to properly use a knife, but that’s not true “change.” ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/15 "2009-10-18T02:51:46Z")
In-between, but I lean towards A. Not married. I would be willing to change my behavior, but I can’t change who I am underneath, so while I could learn to clean the damn house already or things on that level, I couldn’t do something serious like join a church just to make a husband happy. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/16 "2009-10-18T03:05:16Z")
There are changes that benefit the relationship that both people should make (like not going out drinking with your single buddies all night, every night) and changes that you make _because_ you’re in a relationship (like considering the other person), and changes for no particular reason or a subjective reason that would have to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. I think the answer is somewhere in the middle, as usual. If you have one member of a couple who is wanting the other member to change significantly, then maybe the compatibility is not as great as they think. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/17 "2009-10-18T04:55:34Z")
I would never ask my husband to change who he is or what he cares about–it’s his life, not mine. We will, on occasion, try to modify each others behavior, but the only time its reasonable to ask is when a given behavior is neutral to one person and negative or positive to the other: i.e., I am pretty much neutral on shaving my legs. If I had a strong opinion about it either way, my husband would accept that without a problem, because they are my legs. If he had a strong opinion either way and I was neutral, I’d do what he liked. If neither of us really cares (the current situation), we don’t worry about it. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/18 "2009-10-19T05:27:23Z")
This is hard. I don’t think anyone should have to change, but if something you do hurts someone you love, you should at least try to not do it. Because, if I tell you that X hurts me, and you intentionally do that thing, you are pretty much telling me that doing that thing is more important than me. Yet, despite all this, I think (A) is the appropriate answer. One should be willing to change everything about oneself, but shouldn’t one required to do so, which is what (B) says. ETA: In fact, the way (B) is worded, I’m not surprised it is losing horribly. “Change as much as possible” implies changing one’s core personality, something people tend to abhor. ---
**Author:** ![Fastidiots](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@Fastidiots](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fastidiots)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/19 "2009-10-19T06:41:54Z")
I think my original reply in the original thread applies, I’ll also vote for option C. > [@](#): > > I think that to maximize your own happiness a married person ought to consider the fact that an unhappy spouse makes for an unhappy couple. Clearly there are stipulations and limits, and your own responsibility is to find a mate that is rational, and similar enough to yourself that any minor differences will be ignored, changed, or prehaps eventually endeared. I can think of dozens of things I now do out of habit, or no longer do because of her and vice versa. And they’re almost certainly all positive things. > > So yes, I do think it’s reasonable to expect your spouse to change to some degree (for they’re sake), and it’s improbable that being married wouldn’t change you. > > Edit: To add to this I don’t think it’s reasonable to put your spouse’s desires ahdead of your own, I think that is unhealthly and probably impossible, but putting your own desires first you ought to keep your spouses desires a close second (in a marriage of good faith of course). ---
**Author:** ![raspberry\_hunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@raspberry\_hunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raspberry_hunter)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079/20 "2009-10-19T16:56:35Z")
What **Manda JO** said – I didn’t want to vote on the poll because my answer is basically “It depends!” – our rule is generally that the partner who cares the most gets to decide. So… my husband cares a lot that the knives be washed right after cooking and not left in the sink for a long time as I used to do, and I don’t care very much, and I respect the argument that since we now have nice knives (I had crappy ones before we got married) we should treat them well, so I’ve changed that habit. He would mildly prefer if I dealt with spiders instead of asking him to do so, but I would much rather he do it, and he doesn’t really mind, so I haven’t changed in that regard 🙂 We’re both pretty easygoing, though. I could see this strategy not working if one partner cared a whole lot about most things and the other one didn’t. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-for-a-spouses-benefit-how-much-is-appropriate/514079.md?page=2)