# Change the demographics for your favorite show **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 16, 2008, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243 "2008-10-16T18:22:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Silver\_Tyger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Silver\_Tyger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Tyger)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/1 "2008-10-16T18:22:21Z")
Y’know make a cartoon aimed for adults. Change a soap opera into a cartoon. Stuff like that. Silverhawks (I know I do this one all the time) could be a serious sci-fi. Base it in a solar system near earth, instead of a different galaxy (they supposedly had a science adviser. I don’t think they listened to him.) Or possible inside a Dyson Sphere. Make the artificial sun Professor Light’s pet mad science experiment. Get actual songwriters to write music for Bluegrass and Melodia. Could be cool. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/2 "2008-10-16T18:40:04Z")
> [@Silver Tyger Girl](#): > > Y’know make a cartoon aimed for adults. Change a soap opera into a cartoon. Stuff like that. > > Silverhawks (I know I do this one all the time) could be a serious sci-fi. Base it in a solar system near earth, instead of a different galaxy (they supposedly had a science adviser. I don’t think they listened to him.) Or possible inside a Dyson Sphere. Make the artificial sun Professor Light’s pet mad science experiment. Get actual songwriters to write music for Bluegrass and Melodia. Could be cool. Just because I love you so much, STG, I’ll do \*Thundercats \*for you. First, while it’ll still be animated, it should be CG style. Second, it should be more overt that Lion-O’s maturation in the stasis tube while the Wilies did not is (a) a huge malfunction and (b) an enormous tragedy. Lion-O is important because only he can use the Sword, but Panthro, Cheetara, & Tygra think he is entirely unready to be ruler, particularly in these chircumstances. Third, the demographic horror of the situation at the beginning of the series–the loss of the 'Cats world and the fact that they’re a generation from extinction–should be overt. Include Pumira, Bengali, and Lynxo from the beginning, along with maybe five more non-aristocrat Thunderians. They can strongly resent the status quo, which they’d see as pointless in these circumstances. Also, have the natives of Third Earth see the 'Cats as exploiting them, because, well, they do. Fourth, make the Mutants, in particular, more of a threat. Move Mumm-ra to the background, and every time he appears he should vastly overpower the 'Cats; the mirror trick only works once, and only the Sword of Omens is hard put to match ole mummy-magic. Finally, have Tygra not meekly hand over the reins of leadership: there should be a struggle between him & Lion-O, with Jaga (whom both Tygra & Cheetara strongly distrust) pushing Lion-O to take over for his own dark purposes. A possible link between Jaga & Mumm-ra would not be amiss. Eliminating Snarf is a given. ETA: Oh, and Cheetara & Tygra can be a couple, about which Lion-O is unhappy for obvious reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Clivas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clivas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clivas)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/3 "2008-10-16T18:48:16Z")
Holy crap!! Somebody needs to pitch that Thundercats idea to a studio. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/4 "2008-10-16T18:51:31Z")
> [@Clivas](#): > > Holy crap!! Somebody needs to pitch that Thundercats idea to a studio. I am ALREADY HAVING THAT ARGUMENT with someone else. Or, in other words, it ain’t gonna be me and anybody who wants it can have it. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/5 "2008-10-16T18:54:36Z")
I forgot to mention that there should be a whole hell of a lot of Mutants. They should have landed on the same continent as the 'Cats but a nice distance away, and the Warrior Maidens & other natives should definitely see themselves as caught in the middle of a war they don’t give a fuck about. See: “A Private Little War” from ST: TOS. ---
**Author:** ![Yodalicious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yodalicious/32/8195_2.png) [@Yodalicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yodalicious)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/6 "2008-10-16T21:04:01Z")
Charlie’s Angels. Porn. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/7 "2008-10-16T21:05:17Z")
> [@Daddypants](#): > > Charlie’s Angels. Porn. 😃 I’m not really sure what you’d have to change there. I mean, you save on costumes, and certain scenes are longer, but otherwise it’s pretty much the same. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Tyger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Silver\_Tyger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Tyger)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/8 "2008-10-16T21:55:07Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Just because I love you so much, STG, I’ll do \*Thundercats \*for you. > > First, while it’ll still be animated, it should be CG style. > > Second, it should be more overt that Lion-O’s maturation in the stasis tube while the Wilies did not is (a) a huge malfunction and (b) an enormous tragedy. Lion-O is important because only he can use the Sword, but Panthro, Cheetara, & Tygra think he is entirely unready to be ruler, particularly in these chircumstances. > > Third, the demographic horror of the situation at the beginning of the series–the loss of the 'Cats world and the fact that they’re a generation from extinction–should be overt. Include Pumira, Bengali, and Lynxo from the beginning, along with maybe five more non-aristocrat Thunderians. They can strongly resent the status quo, which they’d see as pointless in these circumstances. Also, have the natives of Third Earth see the 'Cats as exploiting them, because, well, they do. > > Fourth, make the Mutants, in particular, more of a threat. Move Mumm-ra to the background, and every time he appears he should vastly overpower the 'Cats; the mirror trick only works once, and only the Sword of Omens is hard put to match ole mummy-magic. > > Finally, have Tygra not meekly hand over the reins of leadership: there should be a struggle between him & Lion-O, with Jaga (whom both Tygra & Cheetara strongly distrust) pushing Lion-O to take over for his own dark purposes. A possible link between Jaga & Mumm-ra would not be amiss. > > Eliminating Snarf is a given. > > ETA: Oh, and Cheetara & Tygra can be a couple, about which Lion-O is unhappy for obvious reasons. YES, with a few additions. Flesh out the Third Earth cultures - what are the Warrior Maidens really like? How do the Berbils really work? Things like that. I’d love to see the Berbils as not completely safe. What sort of secrets could they have, y’know? I’d say have the flagship crash first - say, maybe, they had contact with one other ship when the Mutants were attacking, told them to follow them, then the radio went out. No way of knowing if they heard or not. Make them have to think about cloning, or breeding with the natives, or just plain dying out. A few episodes (or a season?) later, the other ship lands, with Pumyra, Lynx-o, and Ben Gali, and other Thunderians. Pumyra, Lynx-o, and Ben Gali became de facto leaders during the trip, making them losing power more poignant. Make Thundera not a mono-culture. For example, all of the Thundercats aged a couple of years in suspension (except Lion-o aged more because Jaga messed with the capsule). Wilykit and Wilykat are like pygmies, and they’ll always be shorter and look younger, so people treat them as kids. Cheetara has a different culture from Panthro, etc. I don’t see Jaga as having a bad agenda, but being stuck very closely to the status quo - very conservative, while Tygra is more practical and thinks Lion-o is just too young. Sort of a royalty vs democracy thing. And Lion-o is stuck in the middle, muddling through the best he can. Make him unliked, but it’s not really his fault. Have the poor boy deal with having skipped through puberty and having to deal with adult urges and responsibilities, and suddenly having to decide whose advice to follow and the realization that adults aren’t infallible. And of course, since Lion-o is the only one who can see Jaga, he’s stuck with the other Thundercats thinking he’s gone nuts. I would actually keep Snarf. Seriously. Have him be another person discriminated against. Give him an actual name. Snarfs are like Neanderthals are to us. Just give him a less annoying voice, make him not especially bright, and have him be mama bear to Lion-o, and not always at appropriate times. Have a fight between science (represented by Tygra and Panthro) and mysticism (represented by Jaga/Lion-o and Cheetara). However, and this is what the new comics missed, have humor in there. Have light hearted bits and some cheesiness, like Deep Space 9 and Babylon 5 had. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2008, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/9 "2008-10-16T22:17:39Z")
> [@Silver Tyger Girl](#): > > YES, with a few additions. > > Flesh out the Third Earth cultures - what are the Warrior Maidens really like? How do the Berbils really work? Things like that. I’d love to see the Berbils as not completely safe. What sort of secrets could they have, y’know? No argument; in fact I meant to imply that in my earlier post. Also there must be either a heterosexual culture or a corresponding all-male culture for the WMs to survive more than one generation, so I want to see them. In fact, they could be nearer the mutant territories and the allies/saves of the Plundarians, causig some conflict among the WMs about how to deal with battling them; they obviously can’t afford to cut off all contact. > [@](#): > > I’d say have the flagship crash first - say, maybe, they had contact with one other ship when the Mutants were attacking, told them to follow them, then the radio went out. No way of knowing if they heard or not. Make them have to think about cloning, or breeding with the natives, or just plain dying out. > > A few episodes (or a season?) later, the other ship lands, with Pumyra, Lynx-o, and Ben Gali, and other Thunderians. Pumyra, Lynx-o, and Ben Gali became de facto leaders during the trip, making them losing power more poignant. I’d rather they all crashed at once, because frankly I want more Thunderians. Not enough to be a viable breeding group, though; about a hundred, say. So we have the original six, all of royal or noble birth, and a few dozen commoners, led by Pumira et al. The commoners DON’T have super-powers, by the way, which is why the nobles are dominant and why they’re obliged to be in front in a battle. > [@](#): > > Make Thundera not a mono-culture. For example, all of the Thundercats aged a couple of years in suspension (except Lion-o aged more because Jaga messed with the capsule). **Wilykit and Wilykat are like pygmies** , and they’ll always be shorter and look younger, so people treat them as kids. Cheetara has a different culture from Panthro, etc. My problem with Kit & Kat being adults is that they’re being actual kids is necessary for the contrast with Lion-O. I see Lion-O being quite estranged from the other three adults, though for different reasons. Panthro, the royalist, thinks he needs to be groomed for leadership; Tygra opposes it not so much because he wants to retain power but because he’s a republican (he’d be happier if Panthro took the lead, but that would just reinforce the royalist faction); and Cheetara because, being psychic, she can also see Jaga and strongly suspects his agenda is not the same as that of the living. Thus all three of them place different pressures on Lion-O, who takes refuge with the Wilies, who are the same chronological age as he is. > [@](#): > > I would actually keep Snarf. Seriously. Have him be another person discriminated against. Give him an actual name. Snarfs are like Neanderthals are to us. Just give him a less annoying voice, make him not especially bright, and have him be mama bear to Lion-o, and not always at appropriate times. > > Have a fight between science (represented by Tygra and Panthro) and mysticism (represented by Jaga/Lion-o and Cheetara). > > However, and this is what the new comics missed, have humor in there. Have light hearted bits and some cheesiness, like Deep Space 9 and Babylon 5 had. Speaking of the comics, there can be NO GANG-RAPING OF CHEETARA, PUMIRA, OR KIT BY MUTANTS, and anyone who suggests otherwise will be shot. With the possible exception of Jackal-men, mutants have no sexual interest in Thunderians. (Culinary is another matter.) ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/10 "2008-10-17T13:02:57Z")
> [@John Nowak](#): > > “It’ll be a piece of cake,” Feldmows assured him. “Heck, you > remember what it was like when you were in the academy - just by > showing up, just by letting them know that the stuff they read about in > history books was real, you’ll be making an impression. And you can > tell them how you sank the _Mahan_ in exercises, and a couple of old > war stories like we’ve been swapping. It’ll be fun.” > > The more he thought about it, the better the idea seemed to > Jürgen. Talking to a room full of cadets did sound fun. It would mean > an unexpected change to the schedule, but there was no reason to rush. > The crew would like an extra week of leave. > > Besides, it was flattering. He had spent the war commanding U- > boats, swinging between weeks of agonizing boredom and a few hours of > terror, under living conditions that would never be tolerated in a > prison. After the war was over he had come the ugly realization that > all he and his friends had accomplished was to delay the liberation of > the camps for a few weeks. All his sacrifices had been worse than > useless; they had merely prolonged the suffering on both sides and > plunged his homeland deeper into irredeemable disgrace. > > Then had come years of plowing through the water in container > ships, chafing like an Indy 500 driver forced to drive a practical > station wagon. He had felt himself, his talents, eroding, growing > foggy, until an icy female mouse from America hunted him down in a > dockside bar and showed him the plans for _Albacore._ > > Before he met her, he felt he was growing old and dying. Never > since. That was a passage from a story I first had the pleasure of reading a few years ago. All of the characters in that scene are mice. In a story set in the world of Disney’s 1989 cartoon series, _Chip n Dale’s Rescue Rangers_. That’s from the [third story](http://www.rescuerangers.50megs.com/stories/sov1.TXT) in the series. Dangermouse makes a cameo in the second story. The author added some original characters—and it’s one of damned few stories I can think of where such _don’t_ spoil the whole premise—and slightly but noticibly retools the canon characters. Their motivations, strengths, and backstories. And it. All. Works. Such a reworking of the series might not fly on American television—aside from the normal prejudice against animation, the whole thing would probably be considered “too cerebral,” to quote the learned giants of western fiction—but, if it could ever fly at all, _this_ series is how it could be done. I can’t pretend to imagine doing it any better myself. Four stars. Ran says check it out. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/11 "2008-10-17T18:02:37Z")
Mork, CSI Sent to the earth as an undercover agent to work within our system to hide the evidence of aliens, alien abduction, murder, and mayhem. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/12 "2008-10-17T18:17:38Z")
Oh, wow. Deja vu. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Tyger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Silver\_Tyger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Tyger)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/13 "2008-10-17T20:58:55Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Speaking of the comics, there can be NO GANG-RAPING OF CHEETARA, PUMIRA, OR KIT BY MUTANTS, and anyone who suggests otherwise will be shot. Only shot? Can’t we be more creative than that? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/14 "2008-10-17T21:00:43Z")
> [@Silver Tyger Girl](#): > > Only shot? Can’t we be more creative than that? I will leave it to you. The point is that Cheetara is not to be molested. Few would survive the attempt, anyway, and those who did would wish they hadn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Tyger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Silver\_Tyger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Tyger)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2008, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/change-the-demographics-for-your-favorite-show/468243/15 "2008-10-17T22:15:46Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I will leave it to you. The point is that Cheetara is not to be molested. Few would survive the attempt, anyway, and those who did would wish they hadn’t. Well, considering how muscular she must be just trying to rape her would be suicidal unless you’re Superman. Can I vote for castration and then being skinned alive as punishment?