# Chaplains: what percentage are in front lines? How many POWs (WWII-Vietnam)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 17, 2016, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829 "2016-10-17T13:09:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/1 "2016-10-17T13:09:04Z")
See query. Spinoff from thread (newly revived on the treatment Jewish POWs in WWII Europe ([What did the Nazis do with captured American soldiers who were Jewish? - Factual Questions - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=484609) Any breakdown by denomination would be interesting as well (although I can see drift on that topic, as to proportion of “faithful” in the troops, determinations of need, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/2 "2016-10-17T15:59:25Z")
A great-(great?-) uncle was the chaplain on USS _Arizona_. Presumably, had BB-39 gone to war, he would have been on the ‘front lines’ of naval battles. However, chaplains are non-combatants and may not fight. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/3 "2016-10-17T17:16:26Z")
Under the Geneva Convention, chaplains are non-combatants. Chaplains may not participate directly in combat, though the Geneva Convention doesn’t prohibit them from carrying a weapon. That said, most chaplains don’t carry weapons. If a chaplain is captured, he is not considered to be a prisoner of war and must be returned to his home nation unless he chooses to stay and minister to POWs. ---
**Author:** ![svd678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@svd678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/svd678)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/4 "2016-10-17T17:26:20Z")
A relative was an Army chaplain in WWII. He was with the unit (division?) from basic training until deployment. He went through the Battle of the Bulge. During fighting he helped the medics. They heard the incoming artillery shell that destroyed the house they were using - all except the room they were using. He had some medals which he never talked about. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/5 "2016-10-17T18:43:55Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > Under the Geneva Convention, chaplains are non-combatants. Chaplains may not participate directly in combat, though the Geneva Convention doesn’t prohibit them from carrying a weapon. That said, most chaplains don’t carry weapons. > > If a chaplain is captured, he is not considered to be a prisoner of war and must be returned to his home nation unless he chooses to stay and minister to POWs. But some of them apparently _can_ carry (and use) weapons, and the capturers can’t be expected to prove it? Have your cake and eat it too, it seems. Medics are trained to fight, aren’t they (and expected to?); but attacking a marked ambulance, or attacking _from_ one are both “illegal.” Confusing. Unsurprisingly. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/6 "2016-10-17T19:08:05Z")
I though medics were also noncombatants. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/7 "2016-10-17T19:19:21Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I though medics were also noncombatants. According to the Geneva Convention, yes. Intentionally shooting at a medic is a war crime. Unlike chaplains, medics that are captured are considered to be prisoners of war. However, medics who are captured must be allowed to tend to wounded prisoners. Many recent wars (of sorts) have been fought against insurgencies instead of regular armies, and these insurgencies often do not respect the Geneva Convention. Under these conditions, it is common for medics to not wear their traditional red cross (as it just makes them easy targets for snipers and such), and they do often participate in combat. ---
**Author:** ![gkster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gkster/32/14107_2.png) [@gkster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gkster)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/8 "2016-10-17T21:06:21Z")
The “fighting chaplain”, Francis Duffy. His statue with memorial plaque are in Duffy Square, the northern area of Times Square, by the TKTS booth. > **[Francis P. Duffy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_P._Duffy)** > > Francis Patrick Duffy (May 2, 1871 – June 27, 1932) was a Canadian American soldier, Catholic priest and military chaplain. > Duffy served as chaplain for the 69th Infantry Regiment (known as the "Fighting 69th"), a unit of the New York Army National Guard largely drawn from the city's Irish-American and immigrant population. He served in the Spanish–American War (1898), but it is his service on the Western Front in France during World War I (1917–1918) for which he is best known. Duffy, who typic... ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2016, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/9 "2016-10-17T23:07:17Z")
[Medal of Honor Chaplains](http://v-forvictory.blogspot.com/2013/04/the-medal-of-honor-chaplains.html) [Four Chaplains Medal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Chaplains%27_Medal) (Article has further links to other information regarding chaplains in U.S. service.) ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2016, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/10 "2016-10-18T03:09:01Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > If a chaplain is captured, he is not considered to be a prisoner of war and must be returned to his home nation unless he chooses to stay and minister to POWs. Honorary Captain John Weir Foote was a chaplain with the Canadian Army during WWII. He landed at Dieppe for the Dieppe Raid of 1942. For eight hours, while under heavy fire on the beach, he ministered to the wounded, including carrying several of them to landing crafts for evacuation. Towards the end of the raid, as the landing craft were preparing to leave for the final time, he was offered a place but declined. He returned to the beach and surrendered to the Germans, so that he could continue to minister to the Canadian troops who were taken captive. He remained in POW camps until liberation on May 5, 1945, almost three years of captivity. On February 14, 1946, the King awarded Foote the Victoria Cross for his gallantry in action and devotion to the troops under his care. He is the only Canadian chaplain to date to receive the VC. > **[John Weir Foote](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Weir_Foote)** > > John Weir Foote, VC CD (May 5, 1904 – May 2, 1988) was a Canadian military chaplain and politician. He received the Victoria Cross for his actions during the Dieppe Raid in 1942. Foote is the only Canadian chaplain to be awarded the Victoria Cross. After the war he was elected to the Legislative Assembly of Ontario and served as a Progressive Conservative member from 1948 to 1959. He represented the riding of Durham. He served as a cabinet minister in the government of Leslie Frost. > Foote was ... ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/11 "2016-10-21T14:22:15Z")
From longish article today in _Times of Israel_ on the retiring chief Marine Rabbi: chaplains are unarmed, but each (only in the Navy/Marines?) is shadowed by a Religous Program Specialist, who most definitely fights. Plus I learned kipas (yarmulkes) for enlisted look like they are regulation, in camo. > **[Highest-ranking Jewish chaplain in Marines says so long — but not goodbye](https://www.timesofisrael.com/highest-ranking-jewish-chaplain-in-marines-says-so-long-but-not-goodbye/)** > > Rabbi Irving Elson is retiring from the armed forces, but will continue to serve the troops as the incoming director of the Jewish Welfare Board ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/12 "2016-10-21T15:20:01Z")
Rabbi Harold Robinson is shown reading the Torah without a yod. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chaplains-what-percentage-are-in-front-lines-how-many-pows-wwii-vietnam/768829/13 "2016-10-21T15:34:21Z")
You scared me there for a moment. He is not touching the scroll. Nor is it even clear he is reading it :). ETA: In that photo, the officer in uniform is wearing wings and reads NAVY. As usual, I’m confused about Navy/Marine representations. Is he a Marine? They look like standard Naby camo, but I’m obviously clueless.