# Charleston, SC church shooting **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 18, 2015, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823 "2015-06-18T04:15:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/61 "2015-06-18T16:44:47Z")
One of Roof’s high school classmates said in an interview that he didn’t think Roof was a racist. ["The former classmate told The Daily Beast that he didn’t think Roof was a racist so much as a conservative with a lot of “Southern Pride.” “He made a lot of racist jokes, but you don’t really take them seriously like that,” Mullins said. "You don’t really think of it like that.”]([Dylann Roof: Everything We Know About The Charleston Shooting Suspect - TPM – Talking Points Memo](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/dylann-roof-charleston-suspect-facts)) An unfortunately common sentiment, in my experience. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/62 "2015-06-18T16:46:02Z")
One wonders whether South Carolina will lower the confederate flag to half-mast today. ---
**Author:** ![Mithras](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Mithras](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mithras)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/63 "2015-06-18T16:56:48Z")
Mass murderers aren’t like faeries: they don’t disappear when you stop believing in them. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/64 "2015-06-18T16:57:32Z")
Perhaps we could all shut the fuck up with gun control comments and talk about what’s actually going on? Jesus Christ. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/65 "2015-06-18T16:58:03Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > One wonders whether South Carolina will lower the confederate flag to half-mast today. Or lower every flag _but_ the confederate. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/66 "2015-06-18T17:04:12Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Perhaps we could all shut the fuck up with gun control comments and talk about what’s actually going on? Do you think there’s no connection? > [@](#): > > Jesus Christ. Yes, what do _you_ think he’d want us to do? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/67 "2015-06-18T17:05:32Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Candidate Bush had canceled his trip to Charleston. Just announced on HLN. > > Different Bush, same “hide in a hole” gutless mentality. > > “Will this hurt us…?” > “Well, you just lost your bravery bonus.” > “Dang.” That’s unfair. Bush may very well not want to be giving “up-and-at-'em” speeches in a city in mourning. It’s not gutless, it’s just sensible. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/68 "2015-06-18T17:07:49Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > [“You rape our women and you’re taking over our country and you have to go.”](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/charleston-shooter-taking-over-country) > > – Dylann Roof [A photo](https://www.facebook.com/thePolitburoMocksTeabillies/photos/a.357397131053309.1073741829.355162344610121/710410322418653/?type=1&theater) of him sporting the apartheid-era South African flag and the white-rule Rhodesian flag. As if there were any doubt. The Confederate flag stands for the same things, btw. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/69 "2015-06-18T17:12:45Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > That’s unfair. Bush may very well not want to be giving “up-and-at-'em” speeches in a city in mourning. It’s not gutless, it’s just sensible. That’s what I thought. SC has a lot on its plate right now, no need to pile on with a campaign visit like it’s just another day. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/70 "2015-06-18T17:14:59Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > What side are you talking about? No one in here is even advocating for gun rights. The first I’m touching on them is now. That’s the undertext of “Don’t politicize this” and “This isn’t the time”. So yes, they are. > [@](#): > > But even if so, if your goal is to prevent gun deaths, spree shootings are a pretty insignificant blip. Somewhere like an average of 25 gun homicides happen every day in the US. The 8 or 9 we see here isn’t even a full day’s worth. That is not a very good pro-gun-rights argument, as you may realize. > [@](#): > > It’s entirely possible that yesterday was a below-average day for gun deaths. Yes, but doesn’t that mean we finally need to quit pretending there’s no problem? > [@](#): > > Focusing on spree shootings as some sort of epidemic that needs a widespread, extreme solution is ridiculous. They account for roughly 1 percent of 1 percent of gun homicides. Why do you seem to imply that there is some base level of gun homicides, of any type, we should consider normal and acceptable? > [@](#): > > So, then, to think that spree shootings are this massive out of control problem is severely illogical. Good thing nobody’s making that claim, then. > [@](#): > > So, then, why do these incidents always come with new pushes for gun control? Exactly because it has a disproportionate emotional reaction with the public. Yes, because the shock value has some hope of getting through the denialist mindset, while a steady drip-drip of murders has not. > [@](#): > > If you actually want to solve the issue of rampage killings (and it turns to bombs or other weapons when guns aren’t available), then you should stop giving those who perpetrate them the reward they crave. Your claim means that’s the reason they do it, and that they’d be dissuaded if it wasn’t there. But they’re not reasoning or reasonable people at all, are they? Preventing them from killing requires more direct, more realistic measures, doesn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/71 "2015-06-18T17:31:22Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > One of Roof’s high school classmates said in an interview that he didn’t think Roof was a racist. ["The former classmate told The Daily Beast that he didn’t think Roof was a racist so much as a conservative with a lot of “Southern Pride.” > > “He made a lot of racist jokes, but you don’t really take them seriously like that,” Mullins said. "You don’t really think of it like that.”]([http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/dylann-roof-charleston-suspect-facts](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/dylann-roof-charleston-suspect-facts)) > > An unfortunately common sentiment, in my experience. And a sentiment that sadly isn’t limited to the South, regardless of what many think. The racial element of this is what I find deeply disturbing. All the yammering about gun rights and gun control in this thread and in the media misses the larger problem of how deeply ingrained racist attitudes are in this country. The motive is more disturbing to me than the method. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/72 "2015-06-18T17:33:36Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I predict with 99% certainty that somebody will be talking today about how this tragedy could have been prevented if we required all pastors to carry handguns. Meet Bryan Fischer, former director of the American Family Association and conservative talk show host: > [@Gun Nut](#): > > Misguided bans on guns in houses of worship turned this black church in SC into a shooting gallery. Nobody could shoot back. > **[And The First Person To Blame The Charleston Shooting On A Lack Of Guns In...](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bryan-fischer-charleston_n_7612662)** > > And The First Person To Blame The Charleston Shooting On A Lack Of Guns In Church Is... ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/73 "2015-06-18T17:39:50Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [A photo](https://www.facebook.com/thePolitburoMocksTeabillies/photos/a.357397131053309.1073741829.355162344610121/710410322418653/?type=1&theater) of him sporting the apartheid-era South African flag and the white-rule Rhodesian flag. As if there were any doubt. > > The Confederate flag stands for the same things, btw. ↑ ↑ ↑ :smack: :smack: Really? You are going with that? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/74 "2015-06-18T17:42:46Z")
Well, Rhodesia and South Africa didn’t have slavery. So you’re right, the Confederate flag stands for something even worse. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/75 "2015-06-18T17:44:23Z")
> [@GusNSpot](#): > > ↑ ↑ ↑ :smack: :smack: > Really? You are going with that? :dubious: As evidence of his having racist motivations? Sure, why not? ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/76 "2015-06-18T17:44:25Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > You know, if someone shot up, say, a synagogue or a mosque, no-one here would be doubting that it was a racially or religiously motivated attack. People sure said that a few years ago when there was a mass murder at a Gurdwara, which is a Sikh temple. The shooter, who killed himself, did it because he thought they were Muslims. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/77 "2015-06-18T17:46:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Well, Rhodesia and South Africa didn’t have slavery. So you’re right, the Confederate flag stands for something even worse. See also this [photo](http://a5.img.talkingpointsmemo.com/image/upload/w_652/p9vtzvyatej11ybxux1n.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/78 "2015-06-18T17:51:10Z")
Please tell me that’s a still from the upcoming _Napoleon Dynamite_ sequel. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/79 "2015-06-18T17:51:12Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [A photo](https://www.facebook.com/thePolitburoMocksTeabillies/photos/a.357397131053309.1073741829.355162344610121/710410322418653/?type=1&theater) of him sporting the apartheid-era South African flag and the white-rule Rhodesian flag. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/80 "2015-06-18T17:52:06Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > And a sentiment that sadly isn’t limited to the South, regardless of what many think. The racial element of this is what I find deeply disturbing. All the yammering about gun rights and gun control in this thread and in the media misses the larger problem of how deeply ingrained racist attitudes are in this country. The motive is more disturbing to me than the method. Yep. This is a guy whose classmates (some of them, at least) didn’t think was racist despite openly admitting that he made frequent racist jokes. I think there’s this idea that the only sort of racism that is “real” racism is “I hate all black people and they should be exterminated”, and anything that falls short of that is something other than racism. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823.md?page=5)