# Charleston, SC church shooting **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 18, 2015, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823 "2015-06-18T04:15:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/121 "2015-06-18T21:43:58Z")
[Dylann Roof’s roommate said he was planning this for six months, and he was hoping to start a civil war.](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/dylann-roof-plan-charleston-shooting) So why didn’t the roommate tell anybody? In that photo of Roof with the racist flags on his jacket, can anybody tell what the symbol on the other side of the jacket is? ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/122 "2015-06-18T22:26:07Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > To be fair, the Confederate flag is on such a short pole that if they half-staffed it people would probably be trying to set it on fire. > > Maybe this is going to embarrass them so much they finally take the damned thing down? (No, probably they’ll let that debate consume the whole thing so nothing important gets done about any of it.) > > ETA - **Euphonious Polemic** , may I introduce you to [Black Santa](http://www.vindy.com/news/2002/apr/18/man-wearing-santa-suit-burns-confederate-flag/?print), one of our (sadly) late local characters? Local hero! [My post from 2002](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=110090). The late Emmett Rufus Eddy Jr., bricklayer by trade, activist Rev. E. Slave when the bricklaying was slow. [ETA: Of course, you almost certainly already knew all that. 😃] ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/123 "2015-06-18T22:45:16Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > [Dylann Roof’s roommate said he was planning this for six months, and he was hoping to start a civil war.](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/dylann-roof-plan-charleston-shooting) > > So why didn’t the roommate tell anybody? > > In that photo of Roof with the racist flags on his jacket, can anybody tell what the symbol on the other side of the jacket is? I think one is the South African apartheid flag, and the other was for the white Rhodesian government. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/124 "2015-06-18T22:49:02Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Super duper more important than the thousands of other people murdered today. Let’s talk about nothing but this for 2 weeks. Don’t threadshit again. If you don’t care about the topic, you don’t have to post. Don’t post in this thread again if all you’re going to do is question why it’s talked about or a big deal. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/125 "2015-06-18T22:56:08Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I think one is the South African apartheid flag, and the other was for the white Rhodesian government. No, the thing on the other side of the jacket. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/126 "2015-06-18T23:16:38Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > [The Tsarnaev brothers were born in Kyrgyzstan and their families later moved to the Republic of Dagestan before coming to the United States.](http://www.biography.com/people/dzhokhar-tsarnaev-21196765) > > [Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is a United States citizen. He was naturalized on Sept 11. 2012.](http://abcnews.go.com/US/boston-marathon-bombing-suspected-tsarnaev-brothers/story?id=19000426) > > [Tamerlan was a permanent resident and his application for citizenship was pending review.](http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/01/justice/boston-marathon-bombing-tsarnaev/) And they weren’t even Russian, at that – they were originally from Chechnya. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/127 "2015-06-18T23:37:43Z")
And rightfully so. I guess he knew the Senator. > [@bup](#): > > Yep, he was talking about Christians. :smack: Well, to be fair, they are _kinda_ rapey. ---
**Author:** ![jimbuff314](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c57346/32.png) [@jimbuff314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimbuff314)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/128 "2015-06-18T23:38:41Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [A photo](https://www.facebook.com/thePolitburoMocksTeabillies/photos/a.357397131053309.1073741829.355162344610121/710410322418653/?type=1&theater) of him sporting the apartheid-era South African flag and the white-rule Rhodesian flag. As if there were any doubt. > > The Confederate flag stands for the same things, btw. Looks like that Facebook photo has been disappeared. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/129 "2015-06-18T23:44:32Z")
Somewhere on the interwebs, some crazy people are talking about _Rhodesia_?! ---
**Author:** ![WolfpackJeep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpackjeep/32/2921_2.png) [@WolfpackJeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WolfpackJeep)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/130 "2015-06-18T23:44:50Z")
The whole Facebook account has been ‘disappeared’…not too surprised at that though. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/131 "2015-06-19T00:00:29Z")
Wow, so apparently, the cops didn’t even use handcuffs on the guy when they arrested him? Some see this as incredibly dismissive of the victims, and I’m quite sympathetic to that… ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/132 "2015-06-19T00:15:49Z")
Seriously, the confederate flag shit here is pissing me right the fuck off. And the fox news spin that this is not racial, but religious. I can’t say the things I want to say, out of respect for the forum rules outside of the pit. Why does evolution take so long?? ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/133 "2015-06-19T00:18:36Z")
[Here’s another copy](http://conservativetribune.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Screen-Shot-2015-06-18-at-10.23.46-AM.png) of Roof in his racism jacket. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/134 "2015-06-19T01:47:29Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > [Apparently](http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20150618/PC16/150619374), South Carolina in its infinite wisdom put into law that the confederate flag cannot be lowered without legislative approval. So while all other flags were lowered today, that one was flying high. > > Pretty fitting, really. Seeing as that’s the type of law that can’t be enforced (like other flag laws), why didn’t the U.S. flag code take precedence, which says that flags of other countries cannot be flown higher than the U.S. flag? ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/135 "2015-06-19T02:04:20Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Seeing as that’s the type of law that can’t be enforced (like other flag laws), why didn’t the U.S. flag code take precedence, which says that flags of other countries cannot be flown higher than the U.S. flag? The U.S. flag code is considered advisory, because it does not have any punishment for violation. So it does not affect whether a state may pass a contrary law. Some such state laws would be a First Amendment violation, but not when they only regulate the conduct of the state itself. So a South Carolina employee in charge of lowering flags would be subject to a federal government suggestion and a state law, assuming the reporting is correct. I don’t know if the South Carolina law has also been found to be advisory, but there’s no logical or legal reason why it would have to be. ---
**Author:** ![bubba001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f17d59/32.png) [@bubba001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bubba001)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/136 "2015-06-19T02:19:50Z")
I just read that Roof dropped out of school after the 9th grade. The guy is like a character in a bad movie, white, unemployed, no education, drug addled, racist idiot. And “daddy” gives him a 45 Glock for his birthday!!! I put “daddy” in quotes because I’m sure that’s what his stupid son called him. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/137 "2015-06-19T02:24:03Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Seeing as that’s the type of law that can’t be enforced (like other flag laws), why didn’t the U.S. flag code take precedence, which says that flags of other countries cannot be flown higher than the U.S. flag? Could be that the confederate flag is already flying lower than the half-mast US flag? From the pictures I have seen, that flat pole is not huge. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/138 "2015-06-19T02:29:43Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Seriously, the confederate flag shit here is pissing me right the fuck off. And the fox news spin that this is not racial, but religious. > I can’t say the things I want to say, out of respect for the forum rules outside of the pit. > Why does evolution take so long?? Fiox was on at the airport bar this afternoon, the guy I heard made a big deal out of saying “of course this attack was racist.” On the other hand, He also criticised Hillary for politicizing the event. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/139 "2015-06-19T02:52:48Z")
Here’s the transcript from the video I posted earlier: > [@](#): > > Elizabeth Hasselback: A horrifying attack on faith killing 9 people, including a famed pastor. So, if we’re not safe in our own churches, then where are we safe? > Steve Doocy: Joining us right now is Senior Pastor of Hope Christian Church, Bishop E.W. Jackson. Good morning. > > Jackson: Good morning. > > Doocy: Your thoughts this morning? > > Jackson: Well, first of all, I’m pastor of the Fall Church in Chesapeake, Virginia, but…We had a prayer vigil this morning at 6am, praying for the people of Charleston, South Carolina. We are urging people, wait for the facts, don’t jump to conclusions. But, I have to tell you that I am deeply concerned this gunman chose to go into a church, because there does seem to be a rising hostility against Christians across this country because of our biblical views. And, I just think it’s something we have to be aware of and not create an atmosphere where people take out their violent intentions against Christians. And I would mention one other thing very quickly and that is, I would urge pastors and men in these churches to prepare to defend themselves. It’s sad, but I think that we’ve got to arm ourselves. At least have some people in the church who are prepared to defend the church when women and children are attacked. (Fox News hosts mumbling in agreement) > > Brian Kilmeade: Do you think that is something that would fly inside a church? To have a pastor with a gun? To have security with a gun? > > E.W. Jackson: Look, I’m a pastor. (Hasselbeck voicing her approval) If someone comes into hurt my church members I have an absolute obligation to defend them, to protect them. (Doocy interrupts with “of course”). Look, 9 people dead, I think that people understand that it’s sad but this is the world we live in. > > Brian Kilmeade: Hey, I understand it. I’m just, from a pastor perspective, I want to know if that’s something you would do. > > E.W. Jackson: Well, I’m gonna, as a pastor, it’s absolutely something I would do to protect the people whom God has given me charge over. > > Elizabeth Hasselbeck: You protect and shepherd your flock in anyway that you can, in faith and in practicality. > > E.W. Jackson: Amen. > > Elizabeth Hasselbeck: When you are speaking now, we saw prayer circles forming immediately after, at that church, through the night saying—it doesn’t matter what religion we are, we need God’s protection right now, we pray for peace. When you see this, Emmanuel means “God with us.” There are people out there who say—well, evil was there as well, the man who is still on the loose. Do you say to churches—close our doors? Keep them open? What’s your message right now to churches across the states? > > E.W. Jackson: We have to keep our doors open. But, what we have to be discerning. There are evil people out there and they want to hurt and kill and destroy. But, no, we have to love people and invite people. Look, being a Christian means taking a risk. Because it means loving the unloveable. It means helping people who maybe want to hurt you. And we have to keep doing that. But, on the other hand we also have to be prepared to defend those innocent people against these kinds of vicious attacks. > > Steve Doocy: Uhhh, it was released earlier—and extraordinarily they called it a hate crime—uhhh, and some look at it, because it was a white guy, apparently, and a black church, uhh, but you made a great point just a moment ago about the hostility towards Christians, so—and it was a church! So, maybe that’s what their talking about. They haven’t explained it to us. > > E.W. Jackson: Well, yeah, I don’t know whether to—most people jump to conclusions about race. I long for the day when we stop doing that in our country (Kilmeade jumps in to agree). But, we don’t know why he went into a church, but he didn’t choose a bar. He didn’t choose a basketball court. He chose a church. And we need to be looking at that very closely. > > Elizabeth Hasselbeck: Absolutely. And reports are saying he was sitting there for about an hour and then decided to kill all 9 people that he shot dead. (Kilmeade says “sick”) > > E.W. Jackson: Which is an amazing thing, that somebody would come in like they’re peaceful and intent on receiving what’s being taught and then they turn and attack people, I mean it’s just, it’s just a tragedy beyond human comprehension. We pray for those people down there, but yes, I think churches have got to be a lot more vigilant, perhaps more than we’ve ever been before. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823/140 "2015-06-19T02:56:40Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > No, the thing on the other side of the jacket. The image in the center seems to me to be a pup tent. It looks like a standard camp or camper merit badge type patch that would be sewn on your jacket. None of the text is legible enough to make out what it says and I’ve been doing everything I know to enhance that part of the picture. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charleston-sc-church-shooting/722823.md?page=8)