# Charlie Crist (D) v. Rick Scott (R) (Inc) FL Governor's Race **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 5, 2013, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157 "2013-11-05T16:46:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2014, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/41 "2014-01-08T22:19:36Z")
I don’t even buy the premise - of the 10 states with the worst unemployment 5/10 are Republican; of the 10 states with the best 4/10 are Democratic. That seems pretty even to me. (For the record, the top-10 states with Dems are Vermont, Hawaii, Minn, and NH; the bottom-10 states with Reps are Nevada, Michigan, Mississippi, Tenn, and Florida) Also, the “worst laggards” are not California and Illinois, they are Nevada and Rhode Island. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/42 "2014-01-09T05:41:52Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Because rural residents tend to be conservative, and the current wave of unemployment is hitting urban residents hardest. Got any hard questions? > > And California’s problem isn’t that they raised taxes a lot. Rather, most of California’s problems are due to the fact that they can’t raise taxes as much as they need to, due to idiotic conservative policies that got entrenched in the state constitution. HOw high do they need to raise them? They are already among the highest in the country. And the rural argument is nonsense. How is there a “current wave” of unemployment hitting mainly urban residents, and why is Texas and North Carolina immune? NortH carolina has seen the fastest drop in unemployment in the nation since the GOP won full control of the government there: > **[Bureau of Labor Statistics Data](https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LASST37000003)** 2.1 percentage points in only a year. By comparison, Illinois has dropped 0.3 percentage points, and California 1.3. Florida is down 1.5. When Rick Scott took office, Florida’s unemployment rate was well above the national average. Now it’s well below. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/43 "2014-01-09T05:44:01Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > I don’t even buy the premise - of the 10 states with the worst unemployment 5/10 are Republican; of the 10 states with the best 4/10 are Democratic. That seems pretty even to me. > > (For the record, the top-10 states with Dems are Vermont, Hawaii, Minn, and NH; the bottom-10 states with Reps are Nevada, Michigan, Mississippi, Tenn, and Florida) > > Also, the “worst laggards” are not California and Illinois, they are Nevada and Rhode Island. rhode Island, sure. Nevada has seen a very steep drop in unemployment since Sandoval was elected. Since someone mentioned industrial states, let’s compare Michigan to Illinois: Michigan has dropped from 11% to 8.8% under Rick Snyder. Illinois under Quinn has dropped from 9.4 to 8.7. Job growth is at a snail’s pace in Illinois. Probably because all the REpublican neighboring governors encouraged jobs to move to their states. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/44 "2014-01-09T05:50:38Z")
Taxes are high because we have a higher standard of living. I live in CA, I think Brown’s doing a great job. We need and should raise taxes to pay for things like unemployment and social welfare. I’m happy paying my fair share and I’m happy the all blue CA legislator has total control in order to do that and ignore any budget suggestions from Republicans ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/45 "2014-01-09T06:24:10Z")
I think Brown’s doing great all things considered. He’s his own man, not owned by any of the usual Democratic interests. But no, the inability to raise ever more taxes is not the source of any state’s problems. Eventually you do run out of other people’s money, you know. Or they just go somewhere else. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/46 "2014-01-09T12:30:15Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Michigan to Illinois: Michigan has dropped from 11% to 8.8% under Rick Snyder. Illinois under Quinn has dropped from 9.4 to 8.7. Job growth is at a snail’s pace in Illinois. Probably because all the REpublican neighboring governors encouraged jobs to move to their states. Don’t give Snyder any credit. Michigan is coming back primarily because cars are coming back. And Snyder orchestrated a pretty big tax INCREASE, taxing pension income and virtually eliminating the property tax credit. So much for the theory that tax rates have jack shit to do with economic growth. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/47 "2014-01-09T12:35:55Z")
That’s fair. The feds have been so neck deep in Michigan’s economy they own it. However, to stay mostly on subject, Florida has recovered very nicely under Rick Scott’s watch. When you compare Florida’s performance with that of the other states hit hardest by the housing crisis, we emerged the fastest from the doldrums. That will help him a great deal. Plus people know who he is(even though they don’t like him much). Crist can easily be portrayed as Mitt Romney/John Kerry flip-flopper on steroids. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/48 "2014-01-09T19:22:03Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I think Brown’s doing great all things considered. He’s his own man, not owned by any of the usual Democratic interests. > > But no, the inability to raise ever more taxes is not the source of any state’s problems. Eventually you do run out of other people’s money, you know. Or they just go somewhere else. NOT “all things considered”. He is doing a great job period, no caveats. He’s pulled the state out of a budget hole brought on by the last Republican governor and a number of Republican legislators that denied the Dems their supermajority. With the Dems in total control of the budget, we have solved our financial crisis. And your big mistake is thinking that there is some finite amount of money being swirled about in CA. High taxes is ok, we won’t run out of money because the high taxes fund social networks and create jobs and sustain an environment that people want to live in, thus bringing in a larger tax base and creating opportunities for more wealth. It is not always the solution, but it is often the right solution. In contrast to GOP claims in which it is never the solution. Remember that old saying “never say never”? The GOP needs to, well, is being forced to really, to confront the reality that higher taxes are the solution sometimes and this is one of those times. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/49 "2014-01-10T04:44:22Z")
Taxes lead to prosperity? If they did, California would have less unemployment and poverty than Florida. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/50 "2014-01-10T13:23:53Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > NOT “all things considered”. He is doing a great job period, no caveats. He’s pulled the state out of a budget hole brought on by the last Republican governor and a number of Republican legislators that denied the Dems their supermajority. With the Dems in total control of the budget, we have solved our financial crisis. As I understand, California requires some super-dee-dooper majority to approve any revenue increases. For years, they were unable to raise sufficient revenue to fund the state government because Republicans were refusing to accept the reality of the situation. Now that the Dems have total control, tax increases have restored fiscal sanity and the government functions. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/51 "2014-01-10T13:40:42Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > If governors have little to do with unemployment, how come employment just happens to be doing better in states with Republican governors, while Illinois and California continue to be the worst laggards? Because blue states subsidize red states. Most red states take more in federal spending than they pay in federal taxes. Most Blue states pay more in federal taxes than they get in federal spending. It’s not so hard to show growth when somebody else is footing the bill. > **[Blue State, Red Face: Guess Who Benefits More From Your Taxes?](https://slate.com/business/2012/10/blue-state-red-face-guess-who-benefits-more-from-your-taxes.html)** > > Picking up on yesterday's theme, the fiscal cliff, let's look at the wider context to the argument between left and right over taxes and spending cuts. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/52 "2014-01-10T15:16:09Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Because blue states subsidize red states. Most red states take more in federal spending than they pay in federal taxes. Most Blue states pay more in federal taxes than they get in federal spending. It’s not so hard to show growth when somebody else is footing the bill. > > [Blue state, red face: Guess who benefits more from your taxes?](http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_reckoning/2012/10/25/blue_state_red_face_guess_who_benefits_more_from_your_taxes.html) Because of course growth comes from the government. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/53 "2014-01-10T15:21:03Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Because of course growth comes from the government. Much of it does. If you’re a red state with a military base, those federal paychecks get spent in the local economy and keep it going. Those aircraft carriers employ not only the shipyard workers but those that mine the steel, refine it, make the wiring and the mechanical parts, etc. Those people spend their money around their towns and help drive the economy. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/54 "2014-01-10T15:30:56Z")
Some of it CAN, you mean. If the money is spent on things that create value. Which of course the government is expert at, deciding what creates value. Like bridges that don’t go anywhere and airports no planes use. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/55 "2014-01-10T15:36:33Z")
As opposed to the infallible private sector, creator of New Coke and the Edsel. Even the bridge to nowhere (if it was built) would have provided good construction jobs as well as jobs to the material suppliers and fabricators, which in turn would have been spent in the economy, some of which recycling back to the government in income and sales taxes. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/56 "2014-01-10T15:48:54Z")
Someone remind me which party is behind bridges to nowhere and unused airports. It seems to me that the people who want government to be useless are pretty good at making it so, and the people who want government to do good are pretty good at that, too. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/57 "2014-01-10T15:49:32Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Some of it CAN, you mean. If the money is spent on things that create value. Which of course the government is expert at, deciding what creates value. Like bridges that don’t go anywhere and airports no planes use. I agree, Republicans excel when it comes to funding useless federal projects to protect jobs in their districts: [http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-08/congress-makes-nasa-finish-useless-350-million-structure.html?cmpid=yhoo](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-08/congress-makes-nasa-finish-useless-350-million-structure.html?cmpid=yhoo) But those jobs still grow the state economy, even if it is at the expense of the federal GDP. If I get paid to build a useless bridge, I still spend that money in local stores, which shows up as growth in the state. The point is, red states have more useless bridge dollars per capita than blue states. Republicans love handouts. Republicans are moochers. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/58 "2014-01-10T16:41:53Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > As opposed to the infallible private sector, creator of New Coke and the Edsel. > > Even the bridge to nowhere (if it was built) would have provided good construction jobs as well as jobs to the material suppliers and fabricators, which in turn would have been spent in the economy, some of which recycling back to the government in income and sales taxes. You can provide jobs by having one person dig a hole and the other person fill it. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/59 "2014-01-10T16:42:59Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > The point is, red states have more useless bridge dollars per capita than blue states. Republicans love handouts. Republicans are moochers. I am thrilled to have you as an ally in the quest to reduce federal spending. Let’s cut those moochers off! ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157/60 "2014-01-10T16:46:58Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I am thrilled to have you as an ally in the quest to reduce federal spending. Let’s cut those moochers off! Yeah, let’s. You first. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-crist-d-v-rick-scott-r-inc-fl-governors-race/673157.md?page=4)