# Charlie Kirk is Dead **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 11, 2025, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935 "2025-09-11T07:35:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/61 "2025-09-11T17:34:45Z")
I read his full statement. I believe he was dismissing gang violence because “it doesn’t matter”. He was very good at connotation. I think he was also trying to draw a line between “us” and “them” in general. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/62 "2025-09-11T17:52:51Z")
A very small sampling of the wit and wisdom of Charlie Kirk: “These doctors need to be put in prison quickly. We need to have a Nuremberg-style trial for every gender-affirming clinic doctor.” “If I see a black pilot I am going to be like “Boy, I hope he’s qualified.” “We need armed militias to prevent the diminishing of White demographics.” “LGBTQ is a social contagion.” “I think empathy is a made-up new-age term that does a lot of damage” “It is worth it to have the cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year, so that we can have the Second Amendment to protect our other God-given rights.” ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/63 "2025-09-11T18:15:56Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Charlie Kirk didn’t praise Pelosi’s attacker or call him a patriot. No, he called for a patriot to bail him out so they could talk to him. But the context not being discussed is the conspiracy theory that this guy was Pelosi’s gay lover. _That_ was why Kirk wanted him bailed out and answering questions. > [@](#): > > “Why is the conservative movement to blame for gay schizophrenic nudists that are hemp jewelry makers breaking into someone’s home — or maybe not breaking into someone’s home,” he said, referring to the conspiracy theory — which was retweeted and then deleted by new Twitter owner Musk — that the assailant was actually Paul Pelosi’s gay lover. > > Kirk went on to say, “And by the way, if some amazing patriot out there in San Francisco or the Bay Area wants to really be a midterm hero, someone should go and bail this guy out … Bail him out, and then go ask him some questions.” > **[Turning Point USA Founder Charlie Kirk Encourages Audience to Post Bail for...](https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/turning-point-usa-founder-charlie-211415069.html)** > > David DePape was charged with federal assault and attempted kidnapping by the Department of Justice on Monday Pretty dismissive, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/64 "2025-09-11T18:46:18Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > It has become a common claim on the right that trans people are overrepresented among mass shooters. It’s clear to me that that is what Kirk and his questioner were getting at, and obviously if you want to compare numbers, you would not include the gang shootings. > > It would be the same if you looked at how many mass shooters were motivated by far-right ideology - it makes more sense to use the number of spree killings as denominator rather than all mass shootings. More to the point, Kirk was being an asshole by implying that the number of mass shootings that the questioner was about to give would include gang violence. The fact is, even if we grant the questioner some good faith and assume they’d have cited the number of spree shootings as we would think of them rather than any shooting of 3 or more victims, _the number is way too damn high_. And Kirk knows that, and he knows that he can’t defend that point, because any normal human being is going to hear what the number actually is and say that it’s way too fucking high. Certainly, it’s much higher than _ **5** _. And that mightale people ask why Kirk is so focused on trans shooters, when the vast majority of school shooters are straight white guys with incel tendencies. But Kirk is a really really good debater, at least as long as his opponent is a college kid. Which is why he is pivoting away from answering the question by shifting to a topic where he feels that his position is more popular: gang violence. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/65 "2025-09-11T18:51:27Z")
> **[May All Your Wishes Be Granted: Charlie Kirk and the Curse He Wrote for Himself](https://jillybeanmonet.substack.com/p/may-all-your-wishes-be-granted-charlie)** > > When You Beg for Blood Long Enough, Don’t Whine When You’re the One Bleeding Out. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/66 "2025-09-11T19:01:26Z")
Is it ruled out that the shooter was a right-wing nut that thought that a martyr was just what the right needed at this time? ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/67 "2025-09-11T19:10:33Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Is it ruled out that the shooter was a right-wing nut that thought that a martyr was just what the right needed at this time ? I’d like to believe that since Trump is the major benefactor from the fall out. But it does sound like a nutty conspiracy theory until the shooter is identified. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/68 "2025-09-11T19:11:59Z")
Maybe less nutty than what Trump and others have said on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/69 "2025-09-11T19:16:37Z")
Personally I think a more likely hypothesis is that the shooter is a right-wing nut who’s all-in on the Epstein conspiracy, just like Kirk was until a few weeks ago, which is when Trump said “stop talking about it,” at which point Kirk obediently buttoned up, causing confusion and consternation among the true believers. The possibility that the killer is one of these lunatics feels more plausible to me than the prospect that he’s consciously trying to ignite things with some sort of false flag murder. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/70 "2025-09-11T19:26:46Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > A hero for bailing out a criminal, and as they saw it, getting to the bottom of what happened. Is bail bad now? There are bail projects in many parts of America to raise money to free criminals who can’t afford bail. Bail isn’t given to insane, dangerous hammer attackers. Do you think that should change? ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/71 "2025-09-11T19:30:59Z")
The FBI has released [photos of a suspect](https://apnews.com/article/charlie-kirk-conservative-activist-shot-546165a8151104e0938a5e085be1e8bd), but I can’t make out the graphic on his tee shirt in the photo. I see the US flag. What else is on there? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/72 "2025-09-11T19:32:45Z")
Probably an eagle. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/73 "2025-09-11T19:42:24Z")
It’s been pretty positively identified as a disabled veterans shirt. > **[Pardon Our Interruption...](https://www.ebay.com/itm/404784933535)** ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/74 "2025-09-11T20:27:22Z")
Czarcasm here is quoting Charlie Kirk) > [@Czarcasm](#): > > “If I see a black pilot I am going to be like “Boy, I hope he’s qualified.” In another discussion, some on the right are trying to still say that DEI or other ways to increase the number of minorities **with merit** into the workforce are “woke” or they should be illegal. In reality it is prejudice hiding behind a fig leaf. [The context at that point of the discussion was a paper that was used in the end to help justify discrimination of women and minorities in today’s environment.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cancel-culture-and-canceling-versus-consequences-for-actions/1020644/954) (this was not in the paper conclusions, but right wingers were told that it did). So it was very ugly when the right wing still points at that 2018 issue and [the variability hypotheses](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2025/09/02/trump-bls-nominee-gender-iq/) as if it only the paper had been vetted in its original form that then there would be scientific confirmation that DEI or other Equal Opportunity efforts were evil. I said there: tell it to the Tuskegee Airmen! [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/p402cuRIy8Q/maxresdefault.jpg "The Tuskegee Airmen | US History | WW2") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p402cuRIy8Q&t=0) (Short animated video about how the black aviators not only fought Nazis, but American prejudice. One should notice how the bigoted critics from the past tried to use bigoted “science” and military “study” reports, in an attempt at stopping the Airmen from kicking Nazi butt in WWII) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2025, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/75 "2025-09-11T22:51:44Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > > [@DemonTree](#): > > > > A hero for bailing out a criminal, and as they saw it, getting to the bottom of what happened. Is bail bad now? There are bail projects in many parts of America to raise money to free criminals who can’t afford bail. > > Bail isn’t given to insane, dangerous hammer attackers. Do you think that should change? I have supported a local bail project. The people who would be lent that bail (a lot of it is returned) are in two groups: 1. people i believe are likely innocent 2. people who may have violated laws i don’t support. (Chiefly overly strict applications of immigration law, which may not hold up in court.) The project doesn’t lend bail money to those who are probably violent ax murderers and rapists. If it did, i wouldn’t support it. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2025, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/76 "2025-09-12T01:00:23Z")
Looks like the guy who asked Kirk his last question was part of the Unfuck America Tour, which I’ve mentioned elsewhere on the forum. They’ve been trying to create an organization that matches the kind of mobilization Turning Point USA has had with young people, but for the liberal side. > **[Hunter / Stax on Instagram: "Charlie Kirk"](https://www.instagram.com/reel/DOeMRdLgc1p/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)** > > 4,715 likes, 353 comments - staxioms on September 11, 2025: "Charlie Kirk". In fact, they’re the reason I have been paying attention to Kirk recently. They both highlighted how incredibly impactful his approach has been to the rise of MAGA, and have been doing ng an admirable job of fighting him at his own game. Zee, the lady who created and runs Unfuck America, had a very good response to the shooting, I think. > **[Zee Runs Campaigns on Instagram: "#charliekirk"](https://www.instagram.com/reel/DOeY7iekiaO/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)** > > 1,014 likes, 215 comments - zeetothehill on September 11, 2025: "#charliekirk". ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2025, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/77 "2025-09-12T01:10:50Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > Given this context (without even going into the conspiracy circles that MAGA has descended into), he was clearly at peace with this happening to others **and fought** against measures to control it. All deserve to be brought up now…while we also condemn his murder. Playing devil’s advocate here: he might have been perfectly at peace with this happening to him, too. Did he ever say that other deaths were ok but not his own death? > [@orcenio](#): > > I just want to summarize, this event is a tool to highlight hypocrisy. We shouldn’t allow it to pass without bringing it up. I’m just not sure that he was hypocritical about this. Absolutist gun rights kooks might very well include themselves in with everyone else as possible contributors of blood to water the tree of freedom. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2025, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/78 "2025-09-12T09:25:29Z")
I guess that I doubt he’d be at peace with it happening to himself. I find it much more likely that he assumed that he wouldn’t be one of the many victims of gun violence that he dismissed. Again, I must point out, he was killed the middle of minimizing the impact of gun violence. Right in the middle. It’s far more likely, to me, that he did not think it would’ve happened to him. In Kirk’s mind he was talking about other people and other children, not himself. This is all theoretical now. We cannot ask Herman Cain what he thinks of the covid measures [now that covid killed him](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herman_Cain_Award), nor if Kirk still thinks that large scale gun violence is acceptable while basic gun regulation is unacceptable. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2025, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/79 "2025-09-12T12:46:16Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Pretty dismissive, in my opinion. Yes. Spreading conspiracy theories is a bad thing, and as I said before, he seemed more bothered about people blaming Republicans for the attack than the attack itself. Nevertheless, he did condemn it in that same conversation. Here’s the next section: > [@](#): > > **And why is he still in jail? Why has he not been bailed out? By the way, if some amazing patriot out there in San Francisco or the Bay Area wants to really be a midterm hero, someone should go and bail this guy out. I bet his bail’s like 30 or 40,000 bucks.** **Bail him out, and then go ask him some questions.** I wonder what his bail is? They’re going after him with attempted murder, political assassination, all this sort of stuff. > > **I’m not qualifying it. I think it’s awful. It’s not right. But why is it that in Chicago you’re able to commit murder and be out the next day?** Why is it that you’re able to trespass, second-degree murder, arson, threaten a public official, cashless bail — this happens all over San Francisco. But if you go after the Pelosis, oh, you’re let out immediately. Got it. > **[Charlie Kirk called for an 'amazing patriot' to bail out Paul Pelosi's...](https://uk.news.yahoo.com/fact-check-charlie-kirk-called-210900442.html)** > > Kirk also said he thought the attack was "awful." So yeah, he seemed dismissive about the attack - suggesting bailing out the attacker implies a lack of sympathy for the victim. And he spread conspiracy theories - but he didn’t “love it and praise the assailant”. I can’t find any example of him endorsing political attacks or assassinations. * * * > [@needscoffee](#): > > Bail isn’t given to insane, dangerous hammer attackers. Do you think that should change? Certainly not. If anything, more violent criminals should be denied bail (and those who are allowed bail should not generally have to pay cash. It makes no sense to let someone out of jail or keep them inside based on wealth: it should be based on risk to the public and whether they are likely to return to court.) > [@puzzlegal](#): > > I have supported a local bail project. The people who would be lent that bail (a lot of it is returned) are in two groups: > > 1. people i believe are likely innocent > 2. people who may have violated laws i don’t support. (Chiefly overly strict applications of immigration law, which may not hold up in court.) > > The project doesn’t lend bail money to those who are probably violent ax murderers and rapists. If it did, i wouldn’t support it. I was curious about this yesterday, so I did some googling. Some bail projects do indeed bail out violent offenders: > [@](#): > > In Minneapolis’s Hennepin County, which along with the rest of the state is served by the Minnesota Freedom Fund, CNN discovered at least 65 defendants who were bailed out by the charity after Floyd’s killing while awaiting trial on felony charges involving violence, physical threats or sex crimes. All were convicted. > > According to court documents, they included a woman who fatally stabbed a man for refusing to have sex with her; a convicted felon who shot a man twice in the abdomen in a strip-mall parking lot (the victim survived); a man with a history of violent felony convictions who assaulted a woman with a butcher knife and beer bottle, leaving her with a broken jaw and collarbone; and a man with five prior felonies who stomped on the head of a tourist, causing what paramedics said was a broken jaw, profuse bleeding and a possible concussion. > > In Indiana, over the three years ending in December of 2021, 24% of the roughly 1,000 defendants cut loose by The Bail Project – among the largest charitable bail groups in the United States – had been charged with a crime of violence; 35% were facing felony charges and had a previous charge of at least one crime of violence, according to figures shared by the organization in a lawsuit. > > CNN also found dozens of cases across the country after Floyd’s death in which defendants bailed out by charities were later arrested again for alleged acts of violent crime, including robbery, assault, kidnapping and attempted murder. In at least nine cases, a beneficiary of a bail charity has, after their release from jail, been subsequently arrested on murder charges. > **[Bailed out, arrested again: These charities boomed after the murder of George...](https://edition.cnn.com/2023/03/21/us/bail-reform-bail-charities-invs)** > > In late August of 2021, Minneapolis police responded to a shooting along I-94, where they found a BMW sedan that had crashed into a freeway median. Slumped behind the steering wheel was 38-year-old Luis Damian Martinez Ortiz, who’d suffered a fatal... Nine cases of murder is probably negligible, statistically, but that’s still 9 people who died unnecessarily. I’d assume judges have been setting high bail amounts as a way to effectively deny bail, and the charities have bypassed this safety measure. Time to reform the system so that dangerous criminals can be denied bail entirely, like Paul Pelosi’s attacker was? A lot of people donated to these charities after George Floyd’s death, and the majority of people do not check how their money is used after they give to a good cause. I know I don’t. * * * > [@Babale](#): > > Looks like the guy who asked Kirk his last question was part of the Unfuck America Tour Heh. I bet he was going to give the number of shootings with at least 4 victims, then. It’s a really fucking huge amount of people injured and killed. > [@Babale](#): > > Zee, the lady who created and runs Unfuck America, had a very good response to the shooting, I think. Shame she never got a chance to debate him. That might have been interesting. * * * Meanwhile on Twitter, the US deputy secretary of state is asking users to inform on foreigners celebrating Charlie Kirk’s death, and replying to examples with a meme implying they will be deported: > Fascist, and embarrassingly unprofessional. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2025, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935/80 "2025-09-12T12:53:20Z")
“Glorifying hatred and violence” is kind of the GOP’s brand. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/charlie-kirk-is-dead/1022935.md?page=5)