# Chastity programs in schools **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 31, 2002, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chastity-programs-in-schools/101031 "2002-03-31T05:45:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2002, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chastity-programs-in-schools/101031/41 "2002-04-07T21:58:55Z")
> [@](#): > > We also recognize that there comes a time when kids can judge for themselves whether that black-diamond slope is within their abilities. And because some kids will misjudge but still go snowboarding anyway, it’s best to start with safety lessons from the beginning, rather than telling them “promise me you won’t go up to 49 Degrees with your friends until you’re 18” and leaving it there. I agree with you here, but I still think it’s a good idea to intersperse the safety lessons with frequent reminders to stay on the lower slops for now: sure, there are kids who will disregard the advice, but there are other kids who will heed the warning–or, if nothing else, be glad to have concrete reasons to give to justify the fact that they don’t want to try those black-diamond slopes quite yet… > [@](#): > > Are any sex ed classes doing that? I don’t think so, no, but that was the original point of my statement: My ideal high school. Sex ed today seems divided into two camps, the “Only sluts have sex before a church wedding” camp and the “give them information on contraception but make no judgements” camp. I think that there is a middle ground: I think that there are good and sufficient **non-religious** reasons for a sixteen year old to avoid intercourse. I think that it would be responsible for a sex-ed program to bring these reasons to the attention of students, and to present waiting until legal adulthood/graduation not only as a valid choice, but as the **best** choice. I do not think there is any good **non-religious** reason for an un-married 27 year old to avoid having intercourse, so I don’t think school sex ed programs should be teaching that. > [@](#): > > I have no problem with an instructor saying “here are the dangers of unprotected sex, here’s how you can prevent them, but please wait until you’re older,” where the facts are presented without bias and the teacher says “based on these facts, because of these risks, the safest thing to do is wait.” This is pretty much what I am in favor of. > [@](#): > > But my understanding is that in schools with these chastity programs, the students are held to some kind of standard, and students who fail to keep their ‘vows’ (or don’t take the vows in the first place) will attract suspicion, pressure, or punishment. Is that correct? The only one I have seen up close had a lot of balderdash about “remaining sexually pure” until marrige, and the kids giving the presentation (it’s a canned presentation you buy and give a team of kids to do) steadfastly refused to define “sexually pure” when asked by a student. Contracts were passed around and picked back up again, and htere was some talk of an inscribed plaque: if that part ever happened, or if it was ever displayed, I don’t know. To the best of my knowledge this program was administered once in the beginning of ninth grade and there was no folow up at all. > [@](#): > > Even if the contract is given out as something for kids to look over for themselves, and is never returned to the school or brought up again, I still don’t think the school should be implying a ‘correct’ answer to subjective moral questions. I think this is the only point where we disagree, really: I think it is legitimate for a school to teach that the **best** choice is to wait til you are eighteen, and that everything after that is a private matter. > [@](#): > > Maybe if they provided an opposing viewpoint… “I promise to make my own decisions about sex, drugs, and alcohol. I realize that although my friends, parents, teachers, and other authorities may try to persuade me one way or the other, what I do with my body is up to me. I will not be pressured into action or scared into inaction.” My problem with this suggestion is that it is too vauge: as I said up above, I think that the only thing the school can provide is a calm atmosphere and the information needed to make these decisions. I think that it’s important to actually make these decisions in that calm, information rich atmosphere: to actually think to yourself "If I had a boyfriend/girlfriend, would I want to have sex with them? Would I be OK with kissing? With 2nd base? Third? What sort of birth control would be “good enough?” Kids (and adults) actually need to think these things out and not make a decision at a time when they are overcome with hormones and (possibly) the pressure of someone they love and respect. If you put people on the spot, they make bad choices: ask any salesman. I also like the idea of presenting these choices as good for a period of time: i.e. , when you say “I will not drink alcohol this year, becasue the punishments I would recieve if I got caught are not worth the pleasure.” (or whatever) you are not committing to never doing the thing, but to waiting. It’s with the understanding that you can change your mind, but that you can’t change it in the heat of the moment. I think we laregely agree here, and it’s certainly an interesting discussion. ---
**Author:** ![jacksen9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ce73a5/32.png) [@jacksen9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jacksen9)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2002, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chastity-programs-in-schools/101031/42 "2002-04-08T00:07:23Z")
\*\*The government has almost totally violated the domain of the parent, and I for one will not cooperate with any further infringement whatsoever. \*\* If in fact parents have discussed these difficult issues with their children, having a block of instruction related to the topic, sexuality, shouldn’t shake these"entrenched" values. I believe statistics show that teens are becoming infected with HIV in greater numbers than any other group in the U.S. So…IMHO schools have an obligation to present information to teens on this subject. Abstinence should be discussed as well as other options. If parents do not want their kid to hear a lecture about safe sex, birth control, abstinence, etc…they should have that option.Maybe that student could complete an alternative assignment. I believe that if you survey a group of 30 students, fewer than 10 would be able to demonstrate their knowledge of fundamental sexuality (sex ed) issues - STDs, birth control, etc. Many of them have never discussed these issues with parents. Most of them know only what other teens tell them, and manyof these teens are already sexually active. They have these desires, act on them, and then feel guilty about it. This is a dangerous combination. They don’t know, they are active, secretive, guilty, and seek information from unreliable sources. So…schools should ignore this? I disagree. None of our business? Government violation? Hmmmm. ---
**Author:** ![andygirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a9adbd/32.png) [@andygirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andygirl)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2002, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chastity-programs-in-schools/101031/43 "2002-04-08T18:47:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Joe\_Cool \* > **I absolutely disagree. Schools have no business whatsoever teaching values or morals. Schools are for education, not socialization and indoctrination. The job of imbuing children with morals and values belongs to the PARENTS, and nobody else. No sexual education belongs in schools at ALL, beyond biology. I mean no sex education/condom distribution programs. I equally mean no abstinence course. The government has almost totally violated the domain of the parent, and I for one will not cooperate with any further infringement whatsoever.** The problem with this is that there’s no Universal Parenting Standard ™. Parenting is a job where the only qualification is the ability to reproduce, and for the most part failures in parenting are not punishable. If someone fails to teach their children about sex ed- and many parents, to their own detriment and foolishness do not- they will learn it from schoolyard whispers or when they start having sex themselves, which is happening at increasingly early ages. Schools are very much for socialization, though- it’s where a child’s peer group comes from. Many kids spend more time interacting with peers and teachers than they do their parents. And nowadays teachers are expected to be social workers and psychologists and are being held more and more accountable for individual students performances, a concept which has gone far beyond logical absurdity in practice. Teachers didn’t want this. What is the domain of the parent, anyway? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chastity-programs-in-schools/101031.md?page=2)