# Cheating on the Texas Lottery **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 20, 2025, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255 "2025-04-20T11:53:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/21 "2025-04-20T14:55:08Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > And of course, the instant the lottery commission is working with a single wealthy buyer, the corruption opportunities and more importantly corruption likelihood skyrocket. That buyer will quickly “capture” the commission just like major players in any industry “capture” their regulators. But if the lottery commission works with several big buyers, to allow then _each_ to purchase 26 million tickets, and does so without letting each one know this is happening, so they are all very surprised by the 6-way share, is that mendacious, or essentially the way any casino behaves? The entertainment value may go on… ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/22 "2025-04-20T15:04:59Z")
Now I’m picturing several Yosemite Sam-like characters stompin’ around mutterin’ about dirty low-down double-crossin’ scallawags or sumptin’. Then shooting off their pistols. Into somebody who works there. This _is_ modern Texas after all. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/23 "2025-04-20T15:10:51Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > several Yosemite Sam-like characters stompin’ around mutterin’ about dirty low-down double-crossin’ scallawags With a final cutaway to a diminishing circle around Bugs Bunny cheerfully counting wads of cash in the state lottery office. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/24 "2025-04-20T15:14:34Z")
Others have alluded to this. If someone else shares a winning ticket with them, they are splitting a much larger pot. I’m not about to try the math but it might not be that big of a screw job. The syndicate also won a ton of smaller prizes which has to be considered. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/25 "2025-04-20T15:18:32Z")
I wonder… If Texas is ok with this sort of gaming the system then why not just skip all the fuss? Calculate what it costs to buy all possible numbers such that a win is guaranteed. Then, just write a check to the state of Texas for that amount of money and take as a given that you won. As long as the payday (after taxes and whatnot) is more than the check you wrote you make money. The only question mark is if someone else also has a winning ticket (which I am sure the odds of that can be calculated to know that when the jackpot exceeds a certain amount they will make money overall even if losing some when splitting the winnings on occasion). Streamlines the whole process. Also highlights (I think) why doing this is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/26 "2025-04-20T15:34:58Z")
The expected net payout per winner depends on the number of tickets sold. Which is not known in advance. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/27 "2025-04-20T15:44:42Z")
Not known to the dollar in advance. But known in general ballpark. Every lottery ticket I’ve ever bought includes something about the “estimated jackpot”. Which usually turns out to have been a pretty darn good estimate of the actual total jackpot on those draws which draw a winner(s). IOW, the lottery has plenty of experience about their own sales patterns and how they change when the jackpot is e.g. ~$20M versus ~$200M. Permitting them to make pretty good estimates. The idea of there being a built-in logistically simple mechanism for wealthy entities to be able to “corner” the jackpot adds a huge wildcard to this calculation though. Which might have been the point you were working towards that I didn’t quite catch. IMO the big confounder to trying to make money cornering the lottery is the potential for players other than you to also get _a_ (not _the_) winning ticket. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/28 "2025-04-20T15:47:21Z")
It certainly could be calculated for that specific lottery which already happened ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/29 "2025-04-20T15:49:59Z")
I would say it’s cheating for Texas to offer special opportunities to some ticket buyers that it isn’t offering to all potential buyers. That said, the lottery system could have made an open offer that it would set up special terminals for anyone who would commit to buying one million of more tickets, aware that only one group would take them up on the offer. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/30 "2025-04-20T15:50:17Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > IMO the big confounder to trying to make money cornering the lottery is the potential for players other than you to also get _a_ (not _the_) winning ticket. But that’s just how casinos work, isn’t it? A casino knows they will lose money here and there but, overall, they know the odds and know that, over time, those odds are in their favor and they make money. Certainly cornering the lottery would not just be making $1 more. They can calculate the odds they will have to split the winnings and they would lose money on that draw. But, over time, they know they will win more than they lose. They can figure where that line is drawn. As soon as the jackpot crosses that line (with some extra cushion) then buy all the tickets. ETA: I think the real problem comes when other investors want to get in on that action and now you have two or three or more all trying to do the same thing to corner the lottery. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/31 "2025-04-20T15:52:55Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > IIRC taxes are taken at time of payment. In other words, the winner does not get all the money and then later write a check back to the state. The state just takes it right off the top of the winnings and hands you what’s left over. Maybe you could file a tax return and get a refund later but I am dubious that would work. Is this true in Texas? Texas doesn’t have a state income tax. So would the ninety-five million dollar prize be considered income? Or is there a special state tax on lottery winnings? Or does the IRS step in and withhold federal taxes on a state lottery prize? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/32 "2025-04-20T15:53:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Or does the IRS step in and withhold federal taxes on a state lottery prize? Yes .. ---
**Author:** ![Seanette](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/seanette/32/9139_2.png) [@Seanette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seanette)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/33 "2025-04-20T15:54:11Z")
Interesting definition of “rigging” the sensationalist headline writer must have been using. This group did not in any way alter WHICH numbers came out, just spent an absurd amount of money buying tickets in hopes of turning a profit. Seems like a silly way to make money to me, but it’s their money. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/34 "2025-04-20T15:55:51Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Not known to the dollar in advance. But known in general ballpark. You don’t know how many tickets will be sold. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/35 "2025-04-20T15:56:48Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Or does the IRS step in and withhold federal taxes on a state lottery prize? It seems you are right about Texas. [The Feds will take 24% off the top though (winnings over $5,000).](https://www.fox7austin.com/news/mega-millions-winnings-after-taxes-texas-12-27-2024) Although it makes me wonder why Texas would have a lottery? It costs money to run a lottery and I thought states make sure only they can run one is to make extra money. It would seem Texas would lose money running a lottery. I must be missing something. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/36 "2025-04-20T15:59:12Z")
I don’t understand why you think Texas would lose money. It’s not as if the full price of a ticket goes into the prize fund. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/37 "2025-04-20T16:00:24Z")
It costs money to make it all happen. Presumably some state government workers oversee this whole thing and they get paid a salary. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/38 "2025-04-20T16:00:48Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > > [@LSLGuy](#): > > > > Not known to the dollar in advance. But known in general ballpark. > > You don’t know how many tickets will be sold. I do not follow what your objection is. Please elaborate. Or not as you choose. > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Although it makes me wonder why Texas would have a lottery? It costs money to run a lottery and I thought states make sure only they can run one is to make extra money. It would seem Texas would lose money running a lottery. I must be missing something. How do you think _any_ lottery works? They sell umpteen million dollars worth of tickets. They pay out _much_ less than that amount in prizes. And keep the overage as their revenue. Which, less their much smaller costs, is profit to the organization running the lottery. Which org is a branch of the government. The feds taking taxes out of the prize as it’s being given to the winner, costs the lottery itself exactly $0. The winner is out the e.g. 24%, not the lottery. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/39 "2025-04-20T16:02:21Z")
Yes , but if 40% of the proceeds go into the prize fund ( which is what it is in NY) that leaves 60% for overhead - state employees, office rent, payments to retailers etc. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2025, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255/40 "2025-04-20T16:04:58Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > They sell umpteen million dollars worth of tickets. They pay out _much_ less than that much in prizes. and keep the overage as their revenue. So…every dollar paid into the lottery does not go into the prize pool? Do they advertise that only some money goes into the prize pool and they pocket some? It may happen but I have never seen it mentioned. I thought the state made their money on the taxes. The cut off the top for a single payout versus and annuity payout is covering inflation over 20 years (a dollar today is worth more than one in 20 years). Is that how they make money? Seems weird but I guess so…they can spend the more valuable money today. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheating-on-the-texas-lottery/1017255.md?page=3)