# Check out this technicality on eBay: Illegal, immoral, or an example of Buyer Beware? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 30, 2001, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439 "2001-01-30T19:50:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/21 "2001-01-30T22:55:06Z")
Yes, many PSX2 auctions begin around $10.00 Seller was cancelled. [ebay.com](http://ebay.com) said that since a receipt was part of the deal there was reasonable enough information that a PSX2 was in the box. It was a girl who bought it. If you read that feedback closely, the guy called that girl a liar when she said the box was empty. This implies that there was a PSX2 in the box, see? duh. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Cynical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ee59a6/32.png) [@Mr.Cynical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Cynical)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/22 "2001-01-30T22:56:09Z")
The term “Playstation Box” could easily be construed as to mean the item itself. It is computer industry jargon. Buyer beware, certainly, but in this case, the seller was intentionally vague, and clearly looking to make a profit over someone’s misunderstanding. The inclusion of the receipt with the box lends authenticity to the contents. Typically, a shipping container in a sold seperately transaction will not be accompanied by a receipt for the contents therein. This seller is a crook, but will likely get away with it. Were I the victim, I’d have a plane ticket in hand. ---
**Author:** ![Scarlett67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlett67/32/7387_2.png) [@Scarlett67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlett67)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/23 "2001-01-30T22:59:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by IJGrieve \* > I’m with the seller here. He/she hasn’t done anything _wrong_. \ > > \*\*Don’t you wish _you_’d **thought of it.** I know I do. \*\* (bold/asterisk emphasis in quote is mine) So you’re saying that you think the seller **deliberately** gave a misleading description, knowing it would bring a higher price if anyone fell for it, and you think that’s morally OK? And you would do the same? Don’t try to sell **me** anything. ---
**Author:** ![bluecanary](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bluecanary/32/3614_2.png) [@bluecanary](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bluecanary)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/24 "2001-01-30T23:29:52Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by handy_ > **If you read that feedback closely, the guy called that girl > a liar when she said the box was empty. This implies that there was a PSX2 in the box, see? duh.** No, it doesn’t. It says he sent what was promised in the auction–a box and receipt. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Scarlett67_ > Don’t try to sell me anything. Well, if you were stupid enough to buy it… ---
**Author:** ![Gozu\_Tashoya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7993a0/32.png) [@Gozu\_Tashoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu_Tashoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/25 "2001-01-30T23:32:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by IJGrieve \* > \*\*I’m with the seller here. He/she hasn’t done anything _wrong_. Like **Jodi** says, what other category could it have gone in? > > Don’t you wish _you_’d thought of it. I know I do. \*\* By wrong, do you mean illegal? Or do you mean immoral? Because the syntax of the item description and listing is highly mimetic of legitimate PS2 auctions, to the point where one must assume (unless pleading from a point of ignorance) that the resemblence was deliberate and intended to imply a legitimate PS2 auction. And while I’m not the most morally upright person in the world, even I feel that this is immoral, and therefore wrong. (Disclaimer: Assuming, of course, that immorality is wrong, yada yada.) And FTR, I **have** thought about it, though I would’ve at least sent the cables and documentation (as in, “included: AV cables, documentation”) as well. I guess some of us are just slower than others, and some of us more immoral. \ ---
**Author:** ![Jadis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@Jadis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jadis)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/26 "2001-01-30T23:36:51Z")
It seems fairly obvious to me, especially considering the seller’s snide response to the negative feedback, that the seller intended to defraud someone with the vague listing. If the situation hasn’t already been remedied by ebay, I would think that the buyer would have a strong case in court. I don’t think there’s a judge on earth who isn’t going to see through the seller’s scam…it is not reasonable for the seller to claim to believe that **anyone** bidding several hundred dollars actually believed that they were bidding on the box alone. As has been pointed out, the description **could** have been interpreted as the “box” being a reference to the game system itself, in the same manner that a computer’s CPU is sometimes referred to as such. If this went to court, the seller would be lucky, IMO, to get off with simply being required to return the buyer’s money…couldn’t this whole situation be considered mail fraud?? That’s a federal offense. ---
**Author:** ![bluecanary](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bluecanary/32/3614_2.png) [@bluecanary](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bluecanary)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2001, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/27 "2001-01-30T23:43:06Z")
By _wrong_ I meant illegal. Whther it was immoral or not, probably, but talk about stupid!! ---
**Author:** ![Geek\_Mecha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecae2f/32.png) [@Geek\_Mecha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geek_Mecha)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/28 "2001-01-31T00:01:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by handy \* > \*\*Seller was cancelled. > > [ebay.com](http://ebay.com) said that since a receipt was part of the deal there was reasonable enough information that a PSX2 was in the box. > > It was a girl who bought it.\*\* **handy** , how do you know this? Just curious… ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/29 "2001-01-31T02:03:11Z")
BTW, notice the only positive feedback was from SELLERS, who this person bought FROM. And the one comment that reccomended the scam artist isn’t registered either…hmmmm ---
**Author:** ![Geek\_Mecha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecae2f/32.png) [@Geek\_Mecha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geek_Mecha)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/30 "2001-01-31T02:21:34Z")
**KKB** sent me [this link](http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=493812630) to a similar auction. Not sure if this one’s legit, but notice in the bid history that two bidders have already retracted their bids, citing the misleading title. I wonder how many sellers have tried this trick. ---
**Author:** ![Survey1215](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecb155/32.png) [@Survey1215](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Survey1215)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/31 "2001-01-31T04:42:59Z")
When my boss saw that auction, and after we had figured out it was just a box for sale, he thought that whoever was buying the box was doing it to help cover for a stolen PSXII unit, so they’d have the receipt, etc. Longshot theory, but interesting. Maybe there is another thread on this (I’ll search right after I finish this post), but has anyone else heard about Iraq supposedly buying up PSXII’s in massive quantities in order to get the processors contained within? Or is the a total Urban Legend? ---
**Author:** ![Blunt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Blunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blunt)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/32 "2001-01-31T04:46:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by frogstein \* > \*\*Blunt, I’m guessing you’ve never sold anything on eBay. They don’t choose the category, the seller does. The only time a category get changed is if either the seller changes it on her own before bidding starts, or if someone complains and an eBay admin moves it. So I can’t see how eBay would be held responsible. That’s like holding a newspaper responsible because you got scammed by a company that advertised in their publication. In fact, it’s worse, because an ad in a newspaper would at least have to clear an editor; eBay has no such restrictions. \*\* Yes, I haven’t even bought anything on ebay, much less sold something, and I had an incorrect idea of how the auctons are handled. Now that I know how the process really works, I can’t hold ebay responsible for incorrectly categorizing this product, and I guess it just makes the case againt the seller that much stronger since he intentionally listed his auction in the wrong category. I still think ebay should be responsible enough to monitor thier auctons to avoid intentionally misleading product descriptions, but I don’t know if they can be held to that responsibility legally. I guess all I can say for sure is that this case will make me that much less likely to ever use ebay. ---
**Author:** ![Elkman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Elkman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elkman)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/33 "2001-01-31T05:39:35Z")
I’ve been doing Ebay for close to a year now, and I have run across this situation several times. It is up to you, as a buyer, to read the ad carefully. As soon as I saw the thread I was pretty sure what it referred to as I checked out this item myself. To me, the ad was pretty self explanatory; I thought the bids seemed ridiculous, but you assume the bidder knows what he/she is doing. If the unit itself was included it would have read PSX2, WITH original box and receipt. Unfortunately, too many sellers try to “shortcut” their ads by cutting out words; they want to have a short, snappy title. In fact, looking back I can see 1 or 2 of my own auctions could have been potentially misleading. Another tipoff to me was the free shipping, and no mention of insurance. a PSX2 is’t light, and would cost considerable to ship. Also, who in their right mind would offer to ship a high-dollar item like that without insurance? Sorry, but that alone would trigger my alarm bells. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/34 "2001-01-31T05:58:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by AudreyK \* > \*\ ***KKB** sent me [this link](http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=493812630) to a similar auction. Not sure if this one’s legit, but notice in the bid history that two bidders have already retracted their bids, citing the misleading title. I wonder how many sellers have tried this trick. \*\* Don’t you find the user name of the person from this listing so ironic? ---
**Author:** ![Scarlett67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlett67/32/7387_2.png) [@Scarlett67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlett67)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/35 "2001-01-31T13:12:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by IJGrieve \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > _Originally posted by Scarlett67_ > > Don’t try to sell me anything. > > Well, if you were stupid enough to buy it…\*\* Oh, NOW I understand . . . if someone’s stupid then it’s OK to deliberately cheat them, as long as you can find a technically legal way to do it. Thanks for clearing that up. (Note to self: Write to Cecil about getting the site’s motto changed to “Taking Advantage of Ignorance”) ---
**Author:** ![Commander\_Fortune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Commander\_Fortune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Commander_Fortune)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/36 "2001-01-31T13:16:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Nanook of the North Shore \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by AudreyK \* > > \*\ ***KKB** sent me [this link](http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=493812630) to a similar auction. Not sure if this one’s legit, but notice in the bid history that two bidders have already retracted their bids, citing the misleading title. I wonder how many sellers have tried this trick. \*\* > > Don’t you find the user name of the person from this listing so ironic? \*\* aaaiiieeee!!! Wasn’t that the name of an old troll? 1 word - Escrow Service Ok - so that’s 2 words That’s why it’s there folks - ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/37 "2001-01-31T13:37:47Z")
Is the deal legit? Here’s a little test. Would _you_ make this deal to a police officer in person? ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/38 "2001-01-31T13:40:05Z")
For those of you who credit the seller for cleverness, or otherwise are not so sure if something wrong was committed here, let me ask this. When you buy a boxed item in a store, do you not assume that the box contains the item? I mean, if you want to get technical, if you never _open_ the box to make sure, I guess the store could say, “Hey, we put a box on the shelf and you were dumb enough to buy it. We never came out and actually _told_ you the correct item was in the box. You just _assumed_ that. Tough luck.” I think there is no question fraud would be the charge. In our retail society, the “original” box is assumed to contain the merchandise in question. If a store should be held responsible for this type of scam, why shouldn’t a person? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Mermaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@The\_Mermaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Mermaid)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/39 "2001-01-31T15:20:49Z")
I’ve got an idea, maybe I should list Gateway Essential pc,scanner, printer all original boxes less than one year old. Any bidders? ---
**Author:** ![BoBettie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4af34b/32.png) [@BoBettie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoBettie)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2001, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439/40 "2001-01-31T17:29:48Z")
The thing about the description is that it’s written in the same “short hand” that many e-bay items are written in. What I mean is, you can’t make an item description that says: “Brand New Sony Playstation- in original box with reciept!!” because you’re only allowed so many characters. It’s not unusual to see something like: "Playstation 2 Original Box And Receipt which means (in E-bay speak) “Playstation 2 {system including}Original Box and receipt” People don’t generally use punctuation in thier listing titles, and frequently don’t use punctuation in their descriptions, either. This person was a fraud, although you have to wonder about anyone who sends off $450 to someone on E-bay with 2 prior feedbacks to their name. Anyway, buyer beware. Never send more money then you can afford to lose, and for Gods sake, use the E-bay Escrow service for large purchases. Zette [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/check-out-this-technicality-on-ebay-illegal-immoral-or-an-example-of-buyer-beware/52439.md?page=3)