# Cheney says he alone can decide which of his records go to National Archives **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 19, 2008, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932 "2008-12-19T17:13:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2008, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/41 "2008-12-21T17:52:42Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > He can’t know both at once, it’s a corollary to the Heisenberg Principle. It’s well in line with Orwellian doublethinking, though. ---
**Author:** ![Xan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ac8455/32.png) [@Xan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xan)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2008, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/42 "2008-12-21T18:08:30Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > Nope - the law says the archivist has the final say - so he’s out of luck there. > > I am intrigued, though - lawmakers that have insisted on executive branch openness through this legislation haven’t seemed to impose it upon themselves. Congressmen retain their papers upon retirement or loss of office, and can dispose of such as they see fit. > > [Cite.](http://www.archives.gov/legislative/guide/senate/chapter-01-other-sources.html) > > Now - it is certainly true that the archives of presidential administrations are invaluable to historians - but I think that can be said about congressional papers as well. So I wonder why it is not mandated that these be archived in a similar way. > > Thoughts? Congress should be held to the same standard. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2008, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/43 "2008-12-21T22:08:28Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > I wonder why it is not mandated that these be archived in a similar way. I wonder whether you’ll ever use your first post in a politically embarrassing thread to do anything other than attempt to change the subject. ---
**Author:** ![drewbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drewbert/32/15890_2.png) [@drewbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewbert)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2008, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/44 "2008-12-21T22:19:23Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > I’m intrigued by the quantic theory. Does it mean that when Cheney knows which branch he’s in, he cannot know how fast (and loose) he’s playing with the law ? He can do both if he’s in his Undisclosed Location. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2008, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/45 "2008-12-21T23:51:57Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I wonder whether you’ll ever use your first post in a politically embarrassing thread to do anything other than attempt to change the subject. Look, I have disagreed with Cheney many times on these boards - you can look that up if you like. And I don’t think he has much of a leg to stand on here. I did find that somewhat of an interesting double standard, though, and I mentioned it because I found it such. We used to regard a president’s papers as his until modern notions made that untenable - why should Congress continue to regard their papers in a similarly outdated fashion? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/46 "2008-12-22T01:22:29Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > Look, I have disagreed with Cheney many times on these boards - you can look that up if you like. And I don’t think he has much of a leg to stand on here. > > I did find that somewhat of an interesting double standard, though, and I mentioned it because I found it such. We used to regard a president’s papers as his until modern notions made that untenable - why should Congress continue to regard their papers in a similarly outdated fashion? I have no problem with the idea of requiring Congresscritters to turn their papers over to the Archives – but that, as **Cervaise** pointed out in post #43, is decidely and pointlessly off-topic. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/47 "2008-12-22T01:33:07Z")
No posting that points out the hypocrisy and double-standards of the lefties is pointless, or off topic. That is the point, and it is the topic. Do try and pay attention, won’t you, **BG**? ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/48 "2008-12-22T02:16:01Z")
Blow Job! I ween! ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/49 "2008-12-22T02:46:11Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > No posting that points out the hypocrisy and double-standards of the lefties is pointless, or off topic. That is the point, and it is the topic. Do try and pay attention, won’t you, **BG**? And, what posting would that be? (Are you actually equating “lefties” with Congress as a whole?) > [@SteveG1](#): > > But is he always there, or only when he is observed to be there? That whole Schrodinger thing. Maybe that accounts for the U.S. Naval Observatory being all blurred on Google Earth – maybe it really looks like that because of the uncertainty of Cheney’s location. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/50 "2008-12-22T02:54:32Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > And, what posting would that be? (Are you actually equating “lefties” with Congress as a whole?) **Mr. Moto,** at any rate, appears to be subtly hinting at exactly that. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/51 "2008-12-22T03:18:53Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > the law says the archivist has the final say Who retired on Friday. Will Bush/Cheney appoint a lapdog, or will the deputy hang in there for the duration? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/52 "2008-12-22T04:12:17Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > Now - it is certainly true that the archives of presidential administrations are invaluable to historians - but I think that can be said about congressional papers as well. So I wonder why it is not mandated that these be archived in a similar way. > > Thoughts? How about because you’d have to archive 535 times as much stuff? And an individual congressperson isn’t as important as VP Dick. And this is just bullshit reflexive obfuscation on your part because your ideology is morally bankrupt. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/53 "2008-12-22T05:47:11Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > How about because you’d have to archive 535 times as much stuff? So? Do you really think this is beyond our capacity to achieve? Here’s a newsflash - most of that material is already archived by various research collections and university libraries. This would just formalize a process already largely in place and ensure such archives are more complete than they would otherwise have been. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/54 "2008-12-22T06:56:20Z")
> [@](#): > > …because your ideology is morally bankrupt. Or he simply has a true historians passion for detail and citation. Knowing that Sen Throckmorton had a luncheon with representatives of the Mother’s March Against Cognitive Dissonance at 11:15 am, April 19, 2007, for instance, might prove to be of vital significance. Someday. Hey, it could happen! Now, we may think that the day to day activities of Cheney the Impaler are of more interest, but we can’t actually\* know\* that, now can we? I propose we drop this whole silly subject of Dick Cheney’s secret crush diaries, and put our attention to the truly important question of Congressional archiving. I only hope we can all keep our tempers in check, given a question fraught with such significance. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/55 "2008-12-22T07:30:05Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Or he simply has a true historians passion for detail and citation. Knowing that Sen Throckmorton had a luncheon with representatives of the Mother’s March Against Cognitive Dissonance at 11:15 am, April 19, 2007, for instance, might prove to be of vital significance. Someday. Hey, it could happen! > > Now, we may think that the day to day activities of Cheney the Impaler are of more interest, but we can’t actually\* know\* that, now can we? > > I propose we drop this whole silly subject of Dick Cheney’s secret crush diaries, and put our attention to the truly important question of Congressional archiving. I only hope we can all keep our tempers in check, given a question fraught with such significance. Hopefully those brave historians of the future have a complete copy of the internet. So they can find out that the reason they have such a tremendous amount of banal data to sift through is because of our own Mr. Moron, the sopping wet minge-apologist for all republican wrongs. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/56 "2008-12-22T17:00:16Z")
Not quite fair, **Lobo**. He is simply pointing out the duplicitous double standards and hypocrisy of the left. Again. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/57 "2008-12-22T17:16:07Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > How about because you’d have to archive 535 times as much …bullshit … The stench will be ovewhelming. I think we are over-piling on poor Mr Moto. Yes it’s beside the point what Congress has to do, but at least it’s non-partisan. Pubs have been in control of Congress most of the last decade. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2008, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932/58 "2008-12-22T18:10:29Z")
I see this as a delay/negotiating tactic on Cheney’s part. He’s got to know that the law is pretty darn clear on this subject, but what’s he got to lose by throwing a wrench in the works? His approval rating is about as low as it can get already. As for Congress, well, the Republicans controlled Congress for much of Bush’s term, so if they wanted to hit themselves up with an archive law to match the presidential one, then they should’ve done it while they had a majority. But of course that’ll never happen, as I doubt either party wants to put that burden on itself. Touch luck for the P and VP that Congress saddled them with the archive law. Life ain’t fair, and when you throw in politics, that’s even more so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-says-he-alone-can-decide-which-of-his-records-go-to-national-archives/477932.md?page=2)