# Cheney to be replaced by Rice next year? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 21, 2005, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203 "2005-02-21T17:26:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/21 "2005-02-22T07:27:02Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > What skeletons? Other than the My Lai rumors that have been pretty thoroughly discredited, I’ve never heard anyone claim Powell has “skeletons”. Was he involved with the Iraq “Highway of Death” from the first Gulf War? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/22 "2005-02-22T13:24:10Z")
Even if he was that’s not going to move the electorate. Not now. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/23 "2005-02-22T13:38:38Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > Powell the Democrats’ first choice? He’s their worst nightmare - a candidate they have no chance of beating. Put Powell on the ballot and the Democrats’ campaign slogan will be “we’ll try again in eight years”. That’s not what I meant. I mean that he is a Republican who Democrats like, just like McCain. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/24 "2005-02-22T15:52:09Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > What skeletons? Other than the My Lai rumors that have been pretty thoroughly discredited, I’ve never heard anyone claim Powell has “skeletons”. I’ve always heard that the only thing keeping Powell from running is he’s too intelligent to want the job. Republicans would love to see him run. I’ve heard rumors of extra-marital affairs. I don’t offer that as proof of why he wouldn’t run, but just a possible explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Malodorous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e47774/32.png) [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/25 "2005-02-22T17:12:16Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > Powell the Democrats’ first choice? He’s their worst nightmare - a candidate they have no chance of beating. Put Powell on the ballot and the Democrats’ campaign slogan will be “we’ll try again in eight years”. Condi and Powell were also the two unelected figures most wounded by the lack of WMD in Iraq. Also Powell has been portrayed as largely ineffectual in this admin., a public image that I think would hurt him a lot if he were to run in 2008. He might have been a serious contender in 1996 or 2000, but I think that ship has sailed for him. On the other hand, if he did run, with his involvement in My Lai and the Iraqi war, we could have another election where the focus was on Iraq WMDs and peoples vietnam history. And who doesn’t want another one of those :rolleyes: I’ll also just add the obvious, that of the last 10 presidents, 5 have been former VP’s (and another, Gore won the popular vote in 2000). So while I disagree that Condi will be the person to put in place of Cheney, I do think that it seems odd that the Repubs have not put someone with more presidential potential in the job that seems to be the best stepping stone to the presidency. Of course, Bush does seem comfortable Cheney, so perhaps that’s all the explanation that’s needed. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2005, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/26 "2005-02-22T17:16:42Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Can’t happen. The Constitution states that if the VP leaves office, the speaker of the House takes his/her job. That’s how Ford became the only unelected President of the US. (Nixon’s original VP resigned, Ford lost to Carter in '76.) Uh, I hate to break this to you, but [things have changed](http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.amendmentxxv.html). In fact, this is how Ford took office as VP; it was in place at the time of Watergate. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/27 "2005-02-23T02:17:25Z")
> [@](#): > > I hate to break this to you, but things have changed. In fact, this is how Ford took office as VP; it was in place at the time of Watergate. Things have changed. But in this case, things never were. There was never any law that would have automatically made the Speaker of the House the Vice President. Prior to the passage of the 25th Amendment in 1967, the procedure in case the Vice President died or left office was that we just did without one. Pretty sloppy way to do things, but the Vice Presidency has always been the wisdom teeth of the Constitution - ignored until it creates a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/28 "2005-02-23T02:41:47Z")
Cheney will not step down. After all, he picked himself to be VP. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/29 "2005-02-23T02:59:26Z")
> [@drewbert](#): > > Not quite: > Bush can pick whoever he likes, as long as Congress agrees. > [@Stranger On A Train](#): > > Um, nitpick, but Ford wasn’t “unelected”. He was selected by Nixon and elected by the House of Representatives after Spiro’s resignation. He wasn’t Speaker of the House, either, but minority leader. > > I think that the President can nominate whoever he wants, regardless of office or indeed political affiliation, and as long as that person is confirmed by vote of the House, he’s VP. > > Rice as a VP? I’ll believe it when I see it…but stranger things have happened. > > Damn, I wish Powell would step up to the plate. He’d make an excellent alternative to the bobbleheads who keep running for executive office. > > Stranger > [@Polycarp](#): > > Uh, I hate to break this to you, but [things have changed](http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.amendmentxxv.html). In fact, this is how Ford took office as VP; it was in place at the time of Watergate. Gee, [something](http://www.dailywav.com/1100/memo1.wav) about [this seeems](http://www.dailywav.com/0700/tps1.wav) [strangely](http://www.dailywav.com/0700/tps3.wav) [familiar.](http://www.dailywav.com/0700/memo3.wav) Perhaps I was mistaken in my initial post. And **Stranger** , by your logic, _everyone_ appointed to an office where they have to be approved by Congress is an “elected official,” yet they’re _never_ referred to as such. The simple fact is that Ford is the _only_ person to hold the office of President _without_ being chosen by the population of the US in a general election (you know, using that whole electorial college bit). Ergo, he was “unelected” in the same sense that members of SCOTUS are unelected. IAC, I can’t picture Rice being made VP, given the shake up that’s happened because of all the members of Bush’s cabinent stepping down. Rice switching from Sec of State to VP would screw things up for the State Dept. at a time when they really need a stable environment. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/30 "2005-02-23T03:24:40Z")
So, Gore/Clinton vs. Powell/Rice in '08. That’s a pretty big coin to flip. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/31 "2005-02-23T03:56:13Z")
Thankfully, there’s no chance in a million years we’ll have to flip it. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/32 "2005-02-23T04:14:14Z")
Has Rice ever explicitly declared a position on abortion? I seem to remember that she had pro-choice leanings at one time. There is no way a Republican ticket can be viable if either candidate is anything but strictly anti-abortion. Let us not forget that she is a black woman, and while I’m certain that an overwhelming majority of Republicans don’t care, there are some who would not be comfortable voting for someone who is either of those things. She is, by all accounts, an real intellectual, and she could never pull off that aw-shucks routine that has gotten Bush so far. And as much as I hate to bring it up, her unattached middle-aged woman status has led to rumblings about her sexuality. I think they’re ridiculous, but there’s no way they wouldn’t rise to the surface if she were running for office. (If they can make a decorated veteran into a lying traitor, we can make an unmarried career woman into a lesbian.) So if the Republicans want to put a black pro-choice intellectual dyke on the ticket, I’m not about to stand in their way. Just look out for the stampede toward the third-party Roy Moore/Some Other Nutjob ticket. ---
**Author:** ![Twoflower](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/twoflower/32/22_2.png) [@Twoflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Twoflower)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2005, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/33 "2005-02-23T05:28:15Z")
I just dont’ see Cheney resigning for health reasons. He’s having way too good a time rolling in power w/o being answerable. He’s the administration’s liar-in-chief and gets away with absolutely mind-numbing mendacity. I think there is a fair chance that he will go the way of Sprio Agnew. Eventually there will be a scandal or lie that the media will finally pick up on & his house of lies will collapse. My favorite theory is the name “Halliburton” appearing on the list of companies profitting from the Iraqi oil-for-food scandal during his time there. As for Condi as replacement? She got more ‘no’ votes in the Senate for SecState than anybody in the last 150 years, I believe? No way. If Cheney goes down & the wagons are being circled, it’s gotta be somebody with less baggage. That’s certainly why Ford got the job. ---
**Author:** ![TwoTrouts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@TwoTrouts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwoTrouts)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/34 "2005-02-24T18:21:37Z")
What is the likelihood of Powell switching to the Democratic party? When he left the Bush Cabinet, it almost seemed like a “creative differences” sort of split where he could no longer support the current administration’s policies. If he is so dissaffected, could he switch and run as a Democrat. A Gore/Powell ticket might be what the Dems need to get back in office. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/35 "2005-02-24T20:18:54Z")
> [@TwoTrouts](#): > > What is the likelihood of Powell switching to the Democratic party? I suspect he worries that such a move would make make him an instant target for all the closet racists on the Right. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/36 "2005-02-24T20:59:27Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I suspect he worries that such a move would make make him an instant target for all the closet racists on the Right. Not as much as he worries about having to put up with Democrats. If Powell _were_ willing to switch parties, why didn’t he do it between 1992 and 2000, when the Clinton administration was desperate to have him hold a high-profile job? Or in 1992 when the Democrats were heavily courting him to be the nominee? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/37 "2005-02-24T23:23:25Z")
> [@DoctorJ](#): > > Has Rice ever explicitly declared a position on abortion? I seem to remember that she had pro-choice leanings at one time. There is no way a Republican ticket can be viable if either candidate is anything but strictly anti-abortion. > > Let us not forget that she is a black woman, and while I’m certain that an overwhelming majority of Republicans don’t care, there are some who would not be comfortable voting for someone who is either of those things. She is, by all accounts, an real intellectual, and she could never pull off that aw-shucks routine that has gotten Bush so far. And as much as I hate to bring it up, her unattached middle-aged woman status has led to rumblings about her sexuality. I think they’re ridiculous, but there’s no way they wouldn’t rise to the surface if she were running for office. (If they can make a decorated veteran into a lying traitor, we can make an unmarried career woman into a lesbian.). Hell, when Clinton was in office, they were claiming that Hillary was a lesbian, so it’s not like it matters if Condi’s married or not. Frankly, I hope Condi _is_ a lesbian and that if she tries to run for President, someone leaks some hot girl on girl action shots of her! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/38 "2005-02-25T00:32:43Z")
> [@TwoTrouts](#): > > What is the likelihood of Powell switching to the Democratic party? When he left the Bush Cabinet, it almost seemed like a “creative differences” sort of split where he could no longer support the current administration’s policies. If he is so dissaffected, could he switch and run as a Democrat. A Gore/Powell ticket might be what the Dems need to get back in office. Not likely, and wouldn’t matter anyway. Powell has said quite firmly that he has no intention of running for Pres or VP. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/39 "2005-02-25T11:04:26Z")
> [@Stranger On A Train](#): > > And I believe (though I’ll leave the digging through the Amendments to some wonk who gets excited about this stuff) that whoever he selected _does_ have to be able to legally hold the office of the President. In other words, not Schwartznegger or Mr. Clinton. Article II, Section 1, clause 5 of the [US Constitution](http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?method=4&dsid=1518&dekey=4&gwp=8&curtab=1518_1) indeed rules out Schwarzenegger: > [@](#): > > No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President… However, the [22nd Amendment](http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.amendmentxxii.html), which states: > [@](#): > > No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once. would seem to allow Bill Clinton to be **appointed** VP, unless we assume that the authors of the 22nd were so dense as to not realize the difference between “be elected to” and “be eligible to”. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2005, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203/40 "2005-02-25T17:08:09Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Frankly, I hope Condi _is_ a lesbian and that if she tries to run for President, someone leaks some hot girl on girl action shots of her! 😃 Well, if that happens, the runner-up will have to take on the duties and responsibilities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cheney-to-be-replaced-by-rice-next-year/291203.md?page=3)