# Chess training game between glee and NAF1138 - comments etc **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** chess\ **Created:** [January 31, 2020, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289 "2020-01-31T13:26:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2020, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/21 "2020-02-06T07:44:00Z")
I’m not tense, I’m enjoying it being somebody else’s problem :). I like c5, it gives you the options of either opening the c file or, perhaps, shutting in White’s bishop with c4. Then Ba6 isn’t essential and you can continue developing pieces. Though it’s maybe a bit passive - I don’t know what the long term plan would be from there. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/22 "2020-02-06T15:40:49Z")
It’s amusing that neither of us want to move our White-squared bishops - both hoping to save a move before those bishops are exchanged. Also can I emphasise that starting a game with so many pawn moves is incredibly rare! (I feel much better now that the audience has now seen me develop two pieces. 🙂 ) I note that Dead Cat has suggested a possible . …c4. Although this takes a square away from the bishop on f1, it really blocks in the bishop on c8 - so not advisable. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2020, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/23 "2020-02-06T15:49:28Z")
> [@glee](#): > > It’s amusing that neither of us want to move our White-squared bishops - both hoping to save a move before those bishops are exchanged. I agree! I didn’t have any more useful moves but typically I wait for the Whites light square bishop to move before I make the exchange. Since you knew what I was up to right away I just delayed as long as I could, but I can’t hold off any longer. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2020, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/24 "2020-02-06T21:44:57Z")
Ok all my major opening ideas are more or less exhausted. Now I’m in a position that I feel pretty comfortable in but a lot is going to depend on what glee decides to do from here. This is more or less when I am expecting things to go south for me pretty quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/25 "2020-02-07T20:15:16Z")
Nah, it will probably just go south slowly, like in my game :). Like a good anaesthetist putting you under. I think I can see merit in white playing c4, possibly prefaced with b3. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/26 "2020-02-08T11:09:41Z")
NAF has played sensibly in the opening and I only have a slight advantage. :eek: I decided to play 11. dxc5 for a couple of reasons: - it takes one of my pawns off a black square, which gives my black-squared bishop more room - it opens the centre a bit, allowing for future tactics My last game prediction didn’t fare too well ☹ , so let’s try again. 11. … bxc5 12. OO Nc6 13. Rd1 Be7 14. c4 OO 15. Nc3 ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/27 "2020-02-08T15:04:12Z")
Ok, I have a plan, I’m not sure if it’s a good one but I at least think I know where I am heading for my next few moves. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2020, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/28 "2020-02-09T10:22:03Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > Ok, I have a plan, I’m not sure if it’s a good one but I at least think I know where I am heading for my next few moves. I always found that when I could predict the next few moves for both sides, I really understood the position. So far we’re following my last (spoilered) prediction, so that’s helpful. And my understanding of the position is (wait for it…): - I have a slight lead in development - NAF will soon have a couple of decisions to make (see spoiler below) - I am better (but only slightly) Here’s a comment for the kibitzers: [spoiler] A lot will depend on which side NAF castles and how he reacts to my c4 plan. If he goes Kingside (which I expect), there will be some positional play (although I might get a sneaky Kingside attack due to my space advantage there.) If he goes Queenside, then there will be attacks on both sides of the board against the enemy King - with hopefully some tactics. If NAF plays …dxc4, his c-pawn should become weak. If NAF plays …d4, he will have a strong passed pawn, but I intend to plonk a Knight on d3 to blockade it. If he leaves his pawn on d5, I hope to pressurise it. [/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2020, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/29 "2020-02-09T19:26:42Z")
::Mr. Kubrick briefly hovers over, wonders about the 11. dxc5, then spirits away again:: ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2020, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/30 "2020-02-09T22:45:00Z")
A little heads up for everyone. I’m on vacation for the next few days which doesn’t mean I will stop making moves but might slow down my thought process a touch. Also, I am second guessing my plan right now and so I am running over a couple of scenarios. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/31 "2020-02-12T16:56:29Z")
> [@Dead\_Cat](#): > > Nah, it will probably just go south slowly, like in my game :). Like a good anaesthetist putting you under. In our game, the Queens came off early and so it was reasonable to play for a better endgame. Here there are still plenty of pieces left - therefore middle game plans and tactic will be important. > [@Dead\_Cat](#): > > I think I can see merit in white playing c4, possibly prefaced with b3. I have indeed played c4 (see my Spoiler from 5 posts ago), but didn’t need b3 first as Black’s pawn on d5 is pinned against his Queen. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/32 "2020-02-12T19:07:38Z")
Boy I am very uncertain about this move. I have spent the last half hour counting potential responses to it and I just don’t know. Could be my undoing. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/33 "2020-02-12T20:28:42Z")
I wonder whether……Black may be able to free his position a bit with …f6? If exf6, the black-squared bishop gets more scope, on a choice of diagonals, whereas if White instead replies Ne4 (I move I assume he would like to play at some point), …f5 harasses the knight. But then I saw that Nd6+ Bxd6 exd6 Na6 doesn’t look great. On the other hand, perhaps …fxe5 Nxe5 Nxe5 Bxe5 O-O is playable? White’s minor pieces are much better placed than Black’s in this position, but at some point White will have to try and deal with Black’s central pawns. Hang on - Qg4 might be crushing here, Black’s bishop has no good square to go to - on f6 or d6 it is lost to the knight, on g5 White exchanges it for the knight and then wins a pawn, and on d8 the c-pawn falls. So Black must defend with …Rf7, I think. That might give enough time to play Ne8-f6 before White can gather more pieces into the attack. If Black can exchange off a few of the White pieces his central passed pawn might come to the fore. What say you, glee? ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/34 "2020-02-12T23:50:40Z")
Dead Cat’s (Spoilered) idea above is one of several that Black has to consider. [spoiler] If 15. …f6, I would reply 16. exf6\*. Now if 16. …Bxf6 17. Bxc7 Qxc7 18. Qxe6+ wins a pawn. However 16. …gxf6 is complcated (I can consider 17. Bxc7 or 17. Ng6.) \*partly as it’s a forcing continuation and also because Black could have played 15. …f5, when 16. exf6 en passant transposes. [/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/35 "2020-02-13T01:39:16Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > Boy I am very uncertain about this move. I have spent the last half hour counting potential responses to it and I just don’t know. Could be my undoing. Request: Could y’all be more explicit with your descriptions of “this move,” “now,” and “from here”? Reading this two days after it’s posted, I have no clue was move you’re talking about, when “now” was, and where “here” was when you posted it. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/36 "2020-02-13T01:49:55Z")
After 15. Nc3… [spoiler] I don’t see how White can only claim a small advantage. It seem obvious to me that the backward c pawn is a liability. After Ne4 and Ne1-d3, there’s no useful regrouping of the black knights that compensate for the firepower pointed at that pawn, not to mention the lack of light square control caused by the exchange of bishops on a6. Not to mention easy access to the passed d6 outpost. I smell calamari. Consider also: 15…O-O 16. Ne4 Rfd8 17. Nd1 Rb8 18. Qg4 with a sneaky threat. For instance …Rxb2 19. Nf6+ Bxf6 20. exf6 Ne8 21. Bxh6 Ne5 22. Qg3 Nxc4 23. Bxg7 and watch that h pawn be the hero.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/37 "2020-02-13T08:47:50Z")
I agree that Black’s knights are a problem and he’d probably like to reposition/exchange at least one of them ASAP. I also agree that the light squares are weak. However, there’s no clear win available to White at the moment, so I think 'small advantage" is a fair description. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/38 "2020-02-13T09:57:26Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > Boy I am very uncertain about this move. I have spent the last half hour counting potential responses to it and I just don’t know. Could be my undoing. Cheer up - that was the move I was expecting 🙂 (see spoiler in post 29.) You have a strongly supported central passed pawn. I will need to heed Nimzowitsch’s advice: “the passed pawn is a criminal who must be kept under lock and key” “first restrain, then blockade, lastly destroy” So controlling d3 will be important (to stop the pawn advancing.) Also my pawn on c4 takes away squares from your Knight on c7. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/39 "2020-02-13T10:00:27Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Request: Could y’all be more explicit with your descriptions of “this move,” “now,” and “from here”? Reading this two days after it’s posted, I have no clue was move you’re talking about, when “now” was, and where “here” was when you posted it. When NAF1138 posted ‘Boy I am very uncertain about this move. I have spent the last half hour counting potential responses to it and I just don’t know. Could be my undoing’, he was referring to 14. …d4 ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289/40 "2020-02-13T10:08:34Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > After 15. Nc3… You make good points, but I still sense only a small advantage. The backward c-pawn is potentially weak and I was looking forward (as you suggest) to getting my Knights on e4 and d3 to attack it. (The Knight on d3 is an ideal blocker of the d4 passed pawn, as it can still attack ‘over’ the pawn.) I also agree that White has some hopes of attack on white squares (due to my pawn on h5 plus playing 11. dxc5 and 14. c4.) However Black does have a strong passed pawn and only one weakness so far… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chess-training-game-between-glee-and-naf1138-comments-etc/847289.md?page=3)