# Chicken & Egg situation vis a vis rock FM and "Classic Rock" and guitar-based rock is dead **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [April 13, 2024, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236 "2024-04-13T17:30:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/1 "2024-04-13T17:30:38Z")
This is something that has bugged me for some time. Until the very early 2000s I could hear on FM rock radio stations new releases of current rock. Then, to me anyway, it’s like someone passed some global edict that FM rock station shall never again play new rock music and that they shalt be Classic Rock, where you go to hear “Stairway to Heaven” and various things by the Beatles as often as necessary. And everything else plays variations of hip-hop, dance music, and pop a la Madonna, Justin Bieber, Michael Jackson, Celine Dion and their ilk. I have also heard (no cites, sorry) that guitar-based music is dead and so on. However, the likes of Judas Priest, Pearl Jam, Alice in Chains, and Iron Maiden are continuing to release new material, and there are new bands such as Greta van Fleet. Additionally, online, I’ve discovered a zillion young hard rock, stoner rock and metal bands who perform to young audiences. So my “chicken or egg” question is: did peoples’ tastes change so quickly and drastically that FM rock stations **had** to change, or was there some business decision that someone will make more money if they direct their respective (non-independent) FM stations to start playing the hip-hop, Madonna etc stuff? I personally believe the latter, and the only time I listen to FM radio is when I’m driving and running errands, otherwise I listen to a grunge internet radio station or Youtube stoner rock and metal. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/2 "2024-04-13T17:48:29Z")
Boomers are the largest generation in human history, there is a lot more money catering to things they like than any generation after them. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/3 "2024-04-13T18:13:51Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > Then, to me anyway, it’s like someone passed some global edict that FM rock station shall never again play new rock music and that they shalt be Classic Rock, where you go to hear “Stairway to Heaven” and various things by the Beatles as often as necessary. I think most of the “classic” rock stations around here have moved to a 70s/80s/90s format where you (almost?) never hear the Beatles. So more catering to Gen X rather than the Boomers. Do young people even listen to the radio nowadays (as opposed to streaming services)? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/4 "2024-04-13T18:26:33Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > So my “chicken or egg” question is: did peoples’ tastes change so quickly and drastically that FM rock stations **had** to change, or was there some business decision that someone will make more money if they direct their respective (non-independent) FM stations to start playing the hip-hop, Madonna etc stuff? Mostly the latter, I suspect. Newer rock releases (particularly not those from older groups) tend to not get airplay on pop stations, and the “classic rock” format nearly always excludes anything that’s less than 30 years old, _even_ if it’s from an artist for which the station plays their older stuff. Most FM stations are run by one of a handful of companies (iHeartMedia, Audacy, Cumulus), and they typically tightly control formats and playlists. In the case of classic rock stations, it’s nearly always a tightly-curated list of artists and songs, which are always going to be familiar to the target audience. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/5 "2024-04-13T18:29:52Z")
I concur that contemporary radio is dominated by “variations of hip-hop, dance music, and pop”. I blame marketing: they’re trying to be “inclusive” in a way carefully calculated to be blandly appealing to the broadest demographic. Hard rock, stoner and metal is… well, too white. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/6 "2024-04-13T19:10:09Z")
Do young people even know what radio is? ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/7 "2024-04-13T19:14:14Z")
Guitar rock isn’t remotely dead, but the radio is dead. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/8 "2024-04-13T19:43:27Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Do young people even know what radio is? I think that most likely _do_, but for many of them, radio probably is up there with cable TV, music CDs, and land-line phones, as “technology that was/is relevant to my parents, but not to me.” ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/9 "2024-04-13T21:21:34Z")
Fortunately, yes, especially in cars. It’s where kids listen to oldies like Radiohead and Britney. But they do tune around and seem to absorb quite a lot of classic rock, not unlike myself when I was their age. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/10 "2024-04-13T22:23:13Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > Guitar rock isn’t remotely dead, but the radio is dead. After all, video killed the radio star. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/W8r-tXRLazs/maxresdefault.jpg "The Buggles - Video Killed The Radio Star (Official Music Video)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8r-tXRLazs) ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/11 "2024-04-13T22:39:57Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > So my “chicken or egg” question is: did peoples’ tastes change so quickly and drastically that FM rock stations **had** to change, or was there some business decision that someone will make more money if they direct their respective (non-independent) FM stations to start playing the hip-hop, Madonna etc stuff? The creative dead-end that post-grunge represented was certainly one factor, since 25 years ago there were plenty of Modern Rock stations, but the biggest sellers were stuff like Creed or Coldplay, which had very little cultural staying power. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/12 "2024-04-13T22:51:21Z")
i think that also the music business had changed a lot by then … there were no more “singles” to be launched, albums were m/l introduced - but no longer was there a “launch event” … that might have played into this shift … and tbh … I cannot (off the top of my head) think of important or significant contemporary rock albums in the 00s and 2010s - but that might say more about me than the overall market … ---
**Author:** ![Toxylon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f05b48/32.png) [@Toxylon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxylon)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/13 "2024-04-13T22:54:09Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > However, the likes of Judas Priest, Pearl Jam, Alice in Chains, and Iron Maiden are continuing to release new material You asked about a global edict. The FM rock stations around here (Northern Europe) play a mixture of Classic Rock and new Rock music by any established act such as above, as well as Rock music by new acts. Nothing too fringe-y or extreme, though. There are firm, invisible boundaries as to what is considered generic enough, which is a travesty. ---
**Author:** ![XOldiesJock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ec9cab/32.png) [@XOldiesJock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XOldiesJock)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/14 "2024-04-13T23:09:10Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > _Boomers are the largest generation in human history, there is a lot more money catering to things they like than any generation after them._ The last Baby Boomers were born in 1964 and are now 60 years old. With a few exceptions, commercial radio stations aren’t interested in listeners over 50, because advertisers don’t want them. That’s why there are very few traditional 60s-based Oldies stations on the air anymore. Classic Rock stations are in the same boat and play very few songs from the 60s and 70s. This can vary market-to-market, however. Your local “Rock” station, which emphasizes music from the 90s forward, really shouldn’t be playing much of anything before that with the exception of a few nuggets from the 80s that still fit the sound. There is a belief that guitar-based Rock music has one foot in the grave, killed off by the way the record industry has changed over the years and the unwillingness of record labels to produce music that is not the same as what came before, music that listeners have already shown they like. Rick Beato and a friend discuss it on his YouTube channel. Look for a video titled “How Corruption and Greed Led to the Downfall of Rock Music.” It’d quite enlightening. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2024, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/15 "2024-04-13T23:56:06Z")
I’m not sure what you mean by “very little cultural staying power.” Coldplay had one of the highest grossing tours of the year, in 2022: > **[2022 Year-End Boxscore Charts](https://www.billboard.com/2022-year-end-boxscore-charts/)** > > Top 40 Tours Top 25 Boxscores Top 5 Stadiums Top 25 Venues (cap 15,001 or more) Top 10 Venues (cap 10,001 to 15,000) Top 10 Venues (cap 5,001 to 10,000) Top 10 Venues (cap 5,000 or less) Top 10 Promoters Top Tours by Genre Back to All Year-End Charts... ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2024, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/16 "2024-04-14T00:01:21Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > I’m not sure what you mean by “very little cultural staying power.” Coldplay had one of the highest grossing tours of the year, in 2022: > > [2022 Year-End Boxscore Charts](https://www.billboard.com/2022-year-end-boxscore-charts/) Tours are what bands have instead of retirement plans. 20+ years after their heyday, when their fans are all middle aged and have disposable income, that’s when they cash in. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2024, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/17 "2024-04-14T00:12:04Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Tours are what bands have instead of retirement plans. 20+ years after their heyday, when their fans are all middle aged and have disposable income, that’s when they cash in. To that end: Coldplay have released only two albums in the past nine years, neither of which sold nearly as well in the US (or UK) as their previous albums. They did have two singles reach the top 10 in the US in the last seven years, but both were collaborations with newer artists. ---
**Author:** ![Banksiaman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banksiaman/32/3334_2.png) [@Banksiaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banksiaman)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2024, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/18 "2024-04-14T00:43:14Z")
A person I met who created playlists for their community radio station explained to me that once they had the core ‘sound’ - a combination of era / demographic / bands - then that covered 95% of their playlist. If they needed to add ‘different’ content, then rather than adding new bands or extending the genre, they would choose earlier or later work by bands. His example was the Police and the tight set of hit singles - they’d just every so often throw in Roxanne or a less-played song from those albums, so that people would not get too frightened by the shock of the new. ---
**Author:** ![Section\_Maker\_Jupe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/section_maker_jupe/32/1424_2.png) [@Section\_Maker\_Jupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Section_Maker_Jupe)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2024, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/19 "2024-04-14T00:48:55Z")
Our local Santa Barbara classic rock station, still around since 1973. New owners I believe, but songs pretty much the same, Led Zeppelin, Eagles, Hendrix, ACDC etc etc…very strong signal for 3 counties. Seems to be doing OK… ([https://www.ktyd.com/](https://www.ktyd.com/)) I listen to the radio when driving and also use a FM headset, as it lasts much longer than phone batteries. My neighborhood has very poor cell coverage as well, so radio much better option. NIMBY in Montecito. Latin “classic” radio stations also VERY popular with local workers. Lots of Banda music!!! No problem!! ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2024, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236/20 "2024-04-14T08:39:42Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > Fortunately, yes, especially in cars. Not in our cars - my kids and their friends listen to streaming channels, or downloaded playlists that were streamed. As do I. My wife does listen to the radio, but not for music. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chicken-egg-situation-vis-a-vis-rock-fm-and-classic-rock-and-guitar-based-rock-is-dead/1000236.md?page=2)