# Chickenhawks at the SDMB **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 19, 2004, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076 "2004-10-19T18:14:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/81 "2004-10-20T14:04:31Z")
This is wonderful. Nothing has shown the absurdity of the term “chickenhawk” like these late examples. Hell, even “hawk” and “dove” are overly simplistic, and belittling of a person’s political and moral convictions. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/82 "2004-10-20T14:13:42Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Hell, even “hawk” and “dove” are overly simplistic, and belittling of a person’s political and moral convictions. Something we can actually agree on. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/83 "2004-10-20T14:37:28Z")
Can I be a swan, or a flamingo, or maybe an egret, if I’m willing to stick out my neck rather far for something I believe is worthwhile? I welcome other suggestions. ---
**Author:** ![Gest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9d8465/32.png) [@Gest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gest)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/84 "2004-10-20T15:42:40Z")
You could have been a quail if you’d joined the National Guard to defend your state during the Vietnam War. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/85 "2004-10-20T15:57:08Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Something we can actually agree on. Ahh, I spy a mated pair of [Tawny Frogmouths](http://www.honoluluzoo.org/tawny_frogmouth.htm) Oom-Oom-OOom! ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/86 "2004-10-20T16:00:54Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Is this some form of joke? People like you would require even The Bible to be published with emoticons. Yellow-breasted Sapsucker, you. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/87 "2004-10-20T16:02:11Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Ahh, I spy a mated pair of [Tawny Frogmouths](http://www.honoluluzoo.org/tawny_frogmouth.htm) > > Oom-Oom-OOom! Looks like **Mr. Moto** is rejecting my advances. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/88 "2004-10-20T16:04:53Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > People like you would require even The Bible to be published with emoticons. > > Yellow-breasted Sapsucker, you. Frankly, you’ve been such an asshole to me in the past, I wasn’t sure if you’re taking a cheap shot, or just making a joke. I’m giving you the benefit of the doubt here, so Hahaha, good one 'ol boy. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/89 "2004-10-20T16:29:16Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > My cite referred also to the US anti-war movement: > > > [@](#): > > > > In 1968 US students burnt their draft cards and over 600,000 were involved in a march on Washington in November 1969. > > > > Student demonstrators were joined by other disaffected groups - including the working class and war veterans. > > > > The anti-war movement declined after President Nixon suspended the draft and began to withdraw US troops in 1971. > > Regards, > Shodan Save your breath. Anti-Vietnam War demonstrations are the Holy Grail of '60s activist types. Pointing out that they were motivated in a large part by a desire not to be drafted and dropped off dramatically after the draft ended is pointless. See, _they were committed, man_. They _believed in opposing an immoral war_, man, and dude, _they changed the world_. For some reason they are ashamed to admit that they acted out of enlightened self interest, not grand nobility. Facts can’t penetrate the 30-some year old shield of false justifications for their imagined glorious crusade that they have built up in their minds. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/90 "2004-10-20T16:55:06Z")
That would explain why, when Joan Baez pointed out that the North Vietnamese victory produced misery in the South, and the boat people, her former lefty friends raked her over the coals. Can’t have reality intrude on our little mental utopias, now. ---
**Author:** ![Amazon\_Floozy\_Goddess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/779978/32.png) [@Amazon\_Floozy\_Goddess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amazon_Floozy_Goddess)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/91 "2004-10-20T17:00:25Z")
Slight hijack… I sometimes wonder if supporters of war actually have a political view on why it should be supported, or if they just like seeing things being blown up. I bet 5 times out of 10 it’s the latter. I can’t think of any good reason why war is a good idea in any situation. Hasn’t it become apparent now that instead of solving problems it creates more? It’s funny how we teach children to talk out their problems instead of trying to resolve them violently, but we don’t practice what we preach. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/92 "2004-10-20T17:20:10Z")
That might be what you teach your children. In this era of bullies, I’m going to teach mine never, ever, to become a target. If that means walking away from confrontation, very well. But if that doesn’t work, there’s nothing shameful about defending yourself if you’re attacked. Different mindsets, I guess. Having been the target of bullies when I was younger, I hope to spare my kids some of the misery I faced. ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/93 "2004-10-20T17:22:01Z")
> [@Amazon Floozy Goddess](#): > > I can’t think of any good reason why war is a good idea in any situation. It’s not that war is ever a “good idea,” it’s that sometimes war is unavoidable. > [@](#): > > _It’s funny how we teach children to talk out their problems instead of trying to resolve them violently, but we don’t practice what we preach._ Yes, children are taught that talking things out is better than fighting them out, and most of the time issues _can_ be resolved that way. Unfortunately, though, not every kid on the playground has been taught the same concept, or is capable of understanding it. So fights happen. They are unfortunate, and sometimes you just want to knock one of the kids upside the head because they didn’t bother even _trying_ to talk it out, but they don’t make a hypocrite out of the kid who didn’t want to fight. ---
**Author:** ![racinchikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@racinchikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racinchikki)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/94 "2004-10-20T17:30:06Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > [An example of such ‘expert’ leadership:](http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/20/international/20war.html?pagewanted=4&ei=5094&en=2e5915215b02806a&hp&ex=1098244800&partner=homepage) I wonder how long our country would have lasted if we held our leaders to deciding only on matters with which they had personal experience. We probably wouldn’t even been able to _form_ a nation with that restriction. Sarcasm, sir or ma’am. P.S. I claim “penguin.” ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/95 "2004-10-20T17:33:06Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > That might be what you teach your children. In this era of bullies, I’m going to teach mine never, ever, to become a target. Make sure you teach him to never get hit by a car or shot either. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/96 "2004-10-20T17:48:11Z")
Sure will, as we all should. Be careful crossing the street, go only with the light. If you’re young, hold a grownup’s hand. Be careful around guns. Treat every firearm as a loaded weapon. If you find a gun, don’t pick it up, and find a grownup to help you. There are things we can do about car accidents and accidental shootings. Similarly, there are things we can do about bullies, too. This notion that we’re powerless to do anything is growing a generation of whining victims, with another class of people shamefully exploiting this group. Could be a bully, could be a fearmongering politician, could be a self-help charlatan. There are plenty of people willing to feast on a nation of sheep. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/97 "2004-10-20T18:02:31Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Could be a bully, could be a fearmongering politician, could be a self-help charlatan. There are plenty of people willing to feast on a nation of sheep. How about a fearmongering president scaring a nation of sheep? ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/98 "2004-10-20T18:19:32Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > How about a fearmongering president scaring a nation of sheep? [Hitch-cock](http://www.posterplanet.net/pictures/ahitchcockbirdphoto.htm)? ---
**Author:** ![Capt\_B.Phart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc29f/32.png) [@Capt\_B.Phart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt_B.Phart)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/99 "2004-10-20T18:26:21Z")
> [@Eva Luna](#): > > Can I be a swan, or a flamingo, or maybe an egret, if I’m willing to stick out my neck rather far for something I believe is worthwhile? I welcome other suggestions. A long necked bird? - how 'bout the [Shag?](http://www.iaglr.org/hot/pr/020624_1.php) ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076/100 "2004-10-20T19:00:33Z")
> [@Capt B. Phart](#): > > A long necked bird? - how 'bout the [Shag?](http://www.iaglr.org/hot/pr/020624_1.php) Boy, that link was geeky. Are you trying to call me an ostrich by another name? Ostrich is some mighty fine eatin’. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chickenhawks-at-the-sdmb/270076.md?page=6)