# Child Prostitution in Cuba -- Round II **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 27, 2003, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797 "2003-06-27T17:39:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/61 "2003-06-30T21:19:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by chula \* > \*\*IDon’t the European and North American johns bear some responsibility in this? Their governments could start prosecuting men who travel abroad for the purpose of having illegal sex with minors. \*\* I can’t speak for the Europeans, but in the case of U.S. johns, prosecuting them would entail the U.S. government cooperating with the Cuban government. As is painfully obvious, that’s something the U.S. government has a history of not doing very well. As a practical matter, how would this even be enforced, especially since the U.S. hasn’t found a way to get a consistent grip on U.S. citizens who travel illegally to Cuba for other purposes which are much more innocent, like simple tourism, or even non-sanctioned humanitarian reasons? ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/62 "2003-06-30T21:38:40Z")
\>\> prosecuting them would entail the U.S. government cooperating with the Cuban government. As is painfully obvious, that’s something the U.S. government has a history of not doing very well. Which proves that when the US government accuses Cuba of not doing enough to prevent child prostitution it is just trying to score propaganda points and not really a sincere effort to prevent it. Just like when it accuses Cuba of not doing enough to prevent illegal immigration to the USA but, at the same time, the USA encourages it by not returning those who make it to the US. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/63 "2003-06-30T21:51:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eva Luna \* > \*\*As a practical matter, how would this even be enforced, especially since the U.S. hasn’t found a way to get a consistent grip on U.S. citizens who travel illegally to Cuba for other purposes which are much more innocent, like simple tourism, or even non-sanctioned humanitarian reasons? \*\* Exactly. Good friends of mine, who are fairly sympathetic to Castro’s government, traveled from California to Cuba a couple of years ago by the simple expedient of bying separate tickets from the US to Mexico and from Mexico to Cuba. I asked my friend whether he and his wife broke any laws, and he was uncertain. Note that if the US ever set up a system to punish sex tourism to Cuba, they might well use that system to punish all tourism to Cuba. I doubt that **sailor** and **chula** would want the US government to impose the kind of controls that would allow them to detect and punish American tourism in Cuba, like my friends’ trip. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/64 "2003-06-30T22:22:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > I doubt that **sailor** and **chula** would want the US government to impose the kind of controls that would allow them to detect and punish American tourism in Cuba, like my friends’ trip. How’s that for irrelevant? What sailor and chula would want is totally irrelevant as to whether your OP has any basis which it does not. But since you bring up a new straw man: The USA is doing all it can to prevent travel to Cuba. It cannot do more as Americans would probably object to being implanted with GPS transmitters. There is no way for the USA to stop its citizens from going to Cuba. OTOH, preventing child prostitution would be better achieved by **cooperating** with the Cuban government and that is what the USA will not do so, in that sense, the USA would bear part of the blame. America is not interested in stopping child prostitution in Cuba or the conditions that encourage it. America is only interested in scoring propaganda points against Cuba. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/65 "2003-06-30T22:53:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bayonet1976 \* > **I’ve already posted this elsewhere but here it goes. The Cuban government will NOT do anything to deter tourism, even if that means that cases like this get no press whatsoever** Internal to Cuba they wouldn’t get press. Externally they do get press. I’d guess that discouraging sex tourism would require spreading the word that you’re cracking down on it to the countries the sex tourists come from. I don’t see much advertisement for my state as a tourist destination, that doesn’t mean my state doesn’t advertise. They just have no need to advertise to the natives.\*\* > [@](#): > > The problem with this attitude is that, as far as Cubans know, these crimes do not exist and are not a problem. That means, among other things, that the populace is not involved in finding out about, and reporting these crimes.\*\* I think this is the part I don’t understand. It may just be a cultural thing, but why would they need to hammer home the idea that sex tourists who abuse minors will be severely punished to the home population? Is it the duty of each Cuban to watch for and report these types of crimes? I would guess it would be the duty of any responsible citizen, but surely it doesn’t take government reminders to the Cuban populace to make them aware that a tourist with a ten year-old on his arm should be reported.\*\* > [@](#): > > But it serves the government’s purposes.\*\* This is kind of cryptic to me. Is it a reference to the propaganda spread by the government to keep Castro in power? A kind of low-level brainwashing that Cuba is a good place without these kinds of problems? I honestly don’t understand this kind of government/people relationship. Any insight you could offer would be appreciated.\*\* > [@](#): > > Which leads me back to my original point, which was that the Cuban government is NOT promoting child prostitution, it is passing stiff laws against it, and in some cases even enforcing those laws, BUT it could certainly be doing a heck of a lot more.\*\* I agree with all of this. I’m just not sure that publicising cases inside Cuba is of value. Like I said, may be a cultural thing. Being a capitalist in a capitalistic society tends to skew the viewpoint a bit. I have no idea what it would be like if I were in a socialistic society. Maybe I would feel I should know these kinds of things and feel more responsible for my fellow man and watching out for them. Is this the kind of sentiment you are advocating?\*\* > [@](#): > > If you think Cubans are served by being kept in the dark about these types of crimes, please give me your reasoning. \*\* Not necessarially served, but I don’t see the benefit in “preaching to the choir”. If one is trying to discourage international visitors from coming in search of underage prostitutes, why would they target messages enforcing the negative consequences of these actions at the people who aren’t doing these things? Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![litost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@litost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/litost)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/66 "2003-07-01T02:52:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Desmostylus \* > \*\*Care to elaborate, **Brutus**? Which statement? Is there a functioning brain behind your keyboard? \*\* No. Many will agree that you are correct. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/67 "2003-07-01T02:57:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eva Luna \* > \*\*I can’t speak for the Europeans, but in the case of U.S. johns, prosecuting them would entail the U.S. government cooperating with the Cuban government. As is painfully obvious, that’s something the U.S. government has a history of not doing very well. > > As a practical matter, how would this even be enforced, especially since the U.S. hasn’t found a way to get a consistent grip on U.S. citizens who travel illegally to Cuba for other purposes which are much more innocent, like simple tourism, or even non-sanctioned humanitarian reasons? \*\* As a practical matter, it would be difficult to enforce, but laws’ usefulness isn’t measured just by how many people go to jail. A lot of these men are otherwise pretty normal, upstanding citizens at home and need to realize that their behavior is not acceptable just because it takes place in another country where child prostitution is so widespread it seems to be normal. Making examples of a few men may have an impact in this case. I’m pretty sure France has started prosecuting sex tourists when they return to France. Mostly, I’m saying that the governments of developed countries have the moral responsibility and the power to take action and shouldn’t put all the blame on the Cuban government. ---
**Author:** ![bayonet1976](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bayonet1976](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bayonet1976)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/68 "2003-07-01T12:48:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by chula \* > \*\*Here are some miscellaneous articles that show the problem of prostitution has received public attention within Cuba: > > [http://www.ratb.org.uk/frfi/146\_prostitution.html](http://www.ratb.org.uk/frfi/146_prostitution.html) > [http://www.walnet.org/csis/news/world\_2003/reuters-030127.html](http://www.walnet.org/csis/news/world_2003/reuters-030127.html) > [http://granmai.cubaweb.com/espanol/2003/junio/mier25/losninos.html](http://granmai.cubaweb.com/espanol/2003/junio/mier25/losninos.html) > [http://www.joven.cu/PRO/introduccion.html](http://www.joven.cu/PRO/introduccion.html) > [http://www.cubanet.org/CNews/y02/jul02/18o2.htm](http://www.cubanet.org/CNews/y02/jul02/18o2.htm) > [http://64.21.33.164/CNews/y99/feb99/16o11.htm](http://64.21.33.164/CNews/y99/feb99/16o11.htm) > [http://www.ain.cubaweb.cu/discursos/fidelp5.htm](http://www.ain.cubaweb.cu/discursos/fidelp5.htm) \*\* Funny thing about those links **chula** , they are either from the international press or international versions of Cuban press, not available to Cubans. But the article from your last link seems to agree with me when it says, in part: > [@](#): > > Hay que educar más, y nuestros medios de comunicación nos pueden ayudar a formar esa conciencia de que hablo y a educar más. Hay derecho a usar esos medios, incluso, para aplicar sanciones morales cuando sea necesario, en realidad, y hacer que algunas personas se avergüencen. Or, “We need to educate more, and our media can help us to form that conscience of which he (Castro), talked about, and educate more. We have the right to use the media, even to apply moral sanctions when necessary, in truth, we need to make some people feel shame” It’s referencing a Castro speech, which was not published or publicized in Cuba but, again, in the foreign press. In a previous post you talk about how people in Cuba would have to be blind to not see the problem of prostitution. Unfortunately unless you live in the capital, or one of the tourist spots, you have no idea what goes on in the capital, traveling is difficult, and as discussed before the media is next to useless. Many of the prostitutes, minor or adult, are from the countryside, and really have no idea of the implications of prostitution, in fact many do not know that it is a problem, until they get to the capital and more or less fall into the profession. This is one of the areas where the Cuban media, and by extension the government, is failing. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/69 "2003-07-01T15:52:30Z")
The problem here **bayonet1976** is that perhaps we need something to firm up your contention that it is all hushed up in Cuba. Can you give us some source that we could peruse that you consider accessible to Cubans or indicates what info Cubans do get? How do you know its not mentioned?(I’m assuming you have some contact with relatives there to get your info, maybe you can point to a recent Cuban immigrants statements about child-prost. coverups?) What kind of media access does the “countryside” have presently to get the message across? As already mentioned, totalitarian owned state papers generally don’t print a lot of home town bad news unless they can blame it on foreign enemies. Since the poverty that breeds child prostitution can be blamed on the US embargo I would be surprised to find that it never comes up. ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/70 "2003-07-01T16:59:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\*So by this logic, if you and I are at a booth in the local McDonalds, and you sell me a vial of cocaine, and we get busted by the cops five seconds later, McDonalds is partially guilty of the crime as well? 😕 Or are you just overexcited at the thought of joining in orgasmic groupthink again? \*\* First, why is it that leftists think that personal insults have the weight of real argument? Is there just something wrong with them? Second, if the McDonalds were ALSO RUN BY THE SAME ENTITY THAT RUNS THE POLICE then YES the McDonalds IS responsible. Guess what, in Cuba, the government runs it all. Thus, the government is responsible. Of course, one must wonder why some people find it so important to sweep child prostitution in Cuba under the rug… ---
**Author:** ![bayonet1976](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bayonet1976](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bayonet1976)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/71 "2003-07-01T17:05:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CarnalK \* > \*\*The problem here **bayonet1976** is that perhaps we need something to firm up your contention that it is all hushed up in Cuba. Can you give us some source that we could peruse that you consider accessible to Cubans or indicates what info Cubans do get? How do you know its not mentioned?(I’m assuming you have some contact with relatives there to get your info, maybe you can point to a recent Cuban immigrants statements about child-prost. coverups?) What kind of media access does the “countryside” have presently to get the message across? > > As already mentioned, totalitarian owned state papers generally don’t print a lot of home town bad news unless they can blame it on foreign enemies. Since the poverty that breeds child prostitution can be blamed on the US embargo I would be surprised to find that it never comes up. \*\* I’d suggest subscribing to Granma, that’s Cuba’s national paper, and see if they’ll send you something other than the international edition, which is not available to Cubans. As for your second point, please explain how Cuba’s poverty can be blamed on the US embargo. And, surprise, surprise, you will never find any claims of poverty in Cuba’s official press. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/72 "2003-07-01T17:22:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CarnalK \* > **Since the poverty that breeds child prostitution can be blamed on the US embargo…** I would second the request for evidence that Cuba’s poverty was caused by the US embargo. After all, Cuba trades with many other countries. It also received financial aid from the USSR for decades. Furthermore, Cuba was one of the most prosperous countries in Latin America in 1959. IMHO Cuban poverty is 100% the fault of its tyrannical, communist governance. A second point is the casual assumption that poverty that breeds child prostitution. No doubt, children who become prostitutes are almost always poor. But, nations differ in how they deal with child prostitution. Furthermore, those who organize child prosititution are often not poor at all. There are moral differences between poor groups. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/73 "2003-07-01T20:13:00Z")
december, I am not going to get into all those tangent points because they are not central to the issue. The issue is that you accuse the government of Cuba of mandating and encouraging and turning a blind eye to child prostitution and your _only_ support is a very vague and unsupported claim by the Dept. of State which itself is hardly neutral. On the other hand there is plenty of evidence cited in this thread and in the previous one contradicting that. There is plenty of evidence that the Cuban government does not in any way condone child prostitution. That is the issue here in this thread. The cause of Cuban poverty and other issues are just distractions. The fact is you have offered NO credible evidence whatsoever which proves or supports your assertions that the government of Cuba mandates, condones, encourages and does not repress child prostitution. The rest is handwaving and trying to confuse the issue. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/74 "2003-07-01T20:31:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bayonet1976 \* > Funny thing about those links **chula** , they are either from the international press or international versions of Cuban press, not available to Cubans. You can’t get the local, print edition of the NY Times online or anywhere outside of New York, but I don’t take that as a sign that the government is censoring my access to information. Of course, newspapers and the internet are not primary sources of news for Cubans. Cubans get their news from the radio, TV (and many have access to international and US broadcasts), the radio, and word of mouth (including foreign visitors). If you really want to hear the news exactly as Cubans hear it, I suggest you get a shortwave radio and tune in to _Radio Habana_. Here’s the link where you can listen to broadcasts (though you’ll assume any information on the internet has been changed for your benefit): [http://www.radiohc.org/](http://www.radiohc.org/) > [@](#): > > Or, “We need to educate more, and our media can help us to form that conscience of which he (Castro), talked about, and educate more. We have the right to use the media, even to apply moral sanctions when necessary, in truth, we need to make some people feel shame” > > It’s referencing a Castro speech, which was not published or publicized in Cuba but, again, in the foreign press. That quote shows that Castro has been speaking to the public about the issue. Do you really think Cubans have trouble hearing Fidel’s speeches? Ha! > [@](#): > > In a previous post you talk about how people in Cuba would have to be blind to not see the problem of prostitution. Unfortunately unless you live in the capital, or one of the tourist spots, you have no idea what goes on in the capital, traveling is difficult, and as discussed before the media is next to useless. Many of the prostitutes, minor or adult, are from the countryside, and really have no idea of the implications of prostitution, in fact many do not know that it is a problem, until they get to the capital and more or less fall into the profession. This is one of the areas where the Cuban media, and by extension the government, is failing. Traveling _is_ kind of a pain, but people are constantly moving between the cities and the countryside. It’s not like the island is so big that there are isolated regions. People in the country get the same news as people in the city, via radio and TV. (And yes, I have been all over the countryside, to towns where foreigners normally never go.) There are a number of ways to combat prostitution, and educating girls who might become prostitutes about the issue is one possible way. It may be that the Cuban government is not making a strong enough effort in this area. On the other hand, this may not be a very effective strategy. (I’m imagining the public education campaign sounding more like an advertisement for girls who want to make money!) The government _is_ doing plenty with respect to enforcement. The piece that I think is missing is going after the johns who go there because of the prostitution, but I can’t say that I know the best way to do this. Some UN human rights committees have suggested that the best strategy is to emphasize AIDS education to reduce the harmful effects of prostitution. (Luckily, Cubans already have easy access to birth control and family planning information, unlike in the rest of Latin America.) The point is, just because the Cuban government’s policies are insufficient does not mean a human rights violation has taken place. In the United States, we have child prostitution, sweatshops, hunger, drug addiction, widespread violent crime, extremely high rates of incarceration, etc. - how does that reflect on the US government’s human rights record? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/75 "2003-07-01T20:36:38Z")
You know after I posted that I thought “Maybe I should have said rightly or wrongly it can be blamed” so I wouldn’t get a bunch of lame-ass nitpickers, but I decided naaah. I’ll agree with good old **december** , the embargo doesn’t affect poverty and poverty doesn’t encourage prostitution. Now **december** can explain his accusations against Castro without blind trust in the stinking State Department. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/76 "2003-07-01T21:07:27Z")
Well that was a little snarky. I just mean to say you are sidestepping the point by asking me to type an economics/criminology essay. He doesn’t have to prove the accusations - some wiould still believe them, thus I would be surprised if he hadn’t tried it. **sailor** already said it nicer-\> why should we believe that Castro considers child prostitution good money. ---
**Author:** ![bayonet1976](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bayonet1976](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bayonet1976)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/77 "2003-07-02T12:27:22Z")
> [@](#): > > You can’t get the local, print edition of the NY Times online or anywhere outside of New York, but I don’t take that as a sign that the government is censoring my access to information. Of course, newspapers and the internet are not primary sources of news for Cubans. Cubans get their news from the radio, TV (and many have access to international and US broadcasts), the radio, and word of mouth (including foreign visitors). If you really want to hear the news exactly as Cubans hear it, I suggest you get a shortwave radio and tune in to Radio Habana. Here’s the link where you can listen to broadcasts (though you’ll assume any information on the internet has been changed for your benefit): [http://www.radiohc.org/](http://www.radiohc.org/) I find your NYT analogy a little disingenous, the only press in Cuba is the official press, a little different from the US, don’t you think? As for Cubans tuning in to foreign broadcasts, besides the fact that this is illegal, many do it, however we’re talking about what the Cuban press, and by extension the Cuban government is doing, not the foreign press. > [@](#): > > That quote shows that Castro has been speaking to the public about the issue. Do you really think Cubans have trouble hearing Fidel’s speeches? Ha! I don’t know if you can read spanish, but the article states that the quote came from a Castro speech in Europe, and it specifically states that the speech was not made available in Cuba. > [@](#): > > Traveling is kind of a pain, but people are constantly moving between the cities and the countryside. It’s not like the island is so big that there are isolated regions. People in the country get the same news as people in the city, via radio and TV. (And yes, I have been all over the countryside, to towns where foreigners normally never go.) Oh I disagree, the island may not be that big, only about the size of the state of Florida, but transportation in Cuba is next to impossible. It takes many hours to travel 50 miles, unless you’re a tourist of course. And the point you make about people in the coutry side getting the same news as those in the city is exactly the point I’m making, they get the same censored news, but unlike the people in the city they have no first hand knowledge of what’s going on outside their town, so as far as they know prostitution is not a problem or a danger. > [@](#): > > Some UN human rights committees have suggested that the best strategy is to emphasize AIDS education to reduce the harmful effects of prostitution. (Luckily, Cubans already have easy access to birth control and family planning information, unlike in the rest of Latin America.) The point is, just because the Cuban government’s policies are insufficient does not mean a human rights violation has taken place. I know we’ve gotten side tracked a few times here, but I am certain I have never claimed that the actions or inactions of the Cuban government constitute a violation of human rights, unlike their treatment of AIDS patients in the 90’s, which included forced internment in concentration camps. As for the family planning, yes you’re right about that, of course the planning is mostly after the fact, which gives Cuba one of the highest rates of abortion anywhere, something like 4 in every 10 pregnancies result in abortion. But I digress. ---
**Author:** ![bayonet1976](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bayonet1976](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bayonet1976)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/78 "2003-07-02T12:28:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CarnalK \* > \*\*Well that was a little snarky. > > I just mean to say you are sidestepping the point by asking me to type an economics/criminology essay. He doesn’t have to prove the accusations - some wiould still believe them, thus I would be surprised if he hadn’t tried it. **sailor** already said it nicer-\> why should we believe that Castro considers child prostitution good money. \*\* To be fair though, you’re the one that brought in the issue of the embargo as the cause of Cuba’s poverty, a poverty that even the Cuban government does not acknowledge. But I agree, that probably belongs in another thread. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/79 "2003-07-03T05:05:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bayonet1976 \* > I find your NYT analogy a little disingenous, the only press in Cuba is the official press, a little different from the US, don’t you think? As for Cubans tuning in to foreign broadcasts, besides the fact that this is illegal, many do it, however we’re talking about what the Cuban press, and by extension the Cuban government is doing, not the foreign press. My point was that nearly every publication produces a slightly different version for the web. There’s no reason why Cuban media should be different. I have provided evidence that the Cuban government is attempting to educate the Cuban public about the problem of prostitution, and you have provided no evidence to support your claims. Anyway, why would the Cuban government be motivated to publicize the problem internationally but not domestically? If anything, they would have the opposite motivation, since they only make the country look bad by emphasizing their social problems. > [@](#): > > I don’t know if you can read spanish, but the article states that the quote came from a Castro speech in Europe, and it specifically states that the speech was not made available in Cuba. It doesn’t say anything of the sort on the page I linked. Are you referring to the quote from a European magazine? > [@](#): > > Oh I disagree, the island may not be that big, only about the size of the state of Florida, but transportation in Cuba is next to impossible. It takes many hours to travel 50 miles, unless you’re a tourist of course. What’s the basis for your assertion? Transportation isn’t exactly convenient, but there were many people out on the highways when I was there. > [@](#): > > I know we’ve gotten side tracked a few times here, but I am certain I have never claimed that the actions or inactions of the Cuban government constitute a violation of human rights, \ That’s the whole point of this thread. If the Cuban government were condoning child prostitution, that would be a human rights violation. > [@](#): > > As for the family planning, yes you’re right about that, of course the planning is mostly after the fact, which gives Cuba one of the highest rates of abortion anywhere, something like 4 in every 10 pregnancies result in abortion. But I digress. A fact that the Cuban government is actively attempting to change, by the way. ---
**Author:** ![bayonet1976](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bayonet1976](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bayonet1976)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2003, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797/80 "2003-07-07T12:41:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by chula \* > \*\*My point was that nearly every publication produces a slightly different version for the web. There’s no reason why Cuban media should be different. \*\* Just a quick response to a couple of your points since this thread seems to be only for you and me. There is a major major difference between the web presence of other media and Cuban media. Web access is strictly controlled in Cuba and for all intents and purposes unavailable to most Cubans, so anything that makes it to the web, but not the locally available press is certainly out of the reach of most Cubans. > [@](#): > > \*\*It doesn’t say anything of the sort on the page I linked. Are you referring to the quote from a European magazine?What’s the basis for your assertion? \*\* You might be missing something then, when the author refers to something Castro said to a european magazine, you can be sure that the magazine was not available in Cuba, or that the quote was not published in any Cuban press, otherwise that’s how it would be quoted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/child-prostitution-in-cuba-round-ii/184797.md?page=3)