# Children of incestuous relationships? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 9, 2013, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910 "2013-05-09T17:45:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/61 "2013-05-10T20:31:09Z")
I have two cousins who got married and had three children. The creepy part is that their mothers were identical twins, so if they used their own genetic material for conception, their children are genetic half-siblings. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/62 "2013-05-10T20:41:08Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I always read this as the ancient author of the text having his fun at the expense of the contemporary Moabites and Ammonese. 😃 Calling them desert hicks with a tradition of drunken incest. The ancient Israelites weren’t exactly in the congeniality business. But you really want to see some incest-heavy scripture, try this one: [Book of Jubilees, Chapter 4](http://www.pseudepigrapha.com/jubilees/4.htm) (Jubilees, a sort of Parallel Book of Genesis, considered pseudepigrapha in the Western Churches, but Canonical to the Ethiopian Christians) ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/63 "2013-05-10T20:49:54Z")
Actually, for incest, I don’t need scripture - I just read a biography of the Ptolemies. Nobody but nobody committed more incest than they! Life as a Ptolemy must have been very confusing. > [@](#): > > The will also required Ptolemy XI to marry Cleopatra Berenice, who was his stepmother and half-sister (or possibly his natural mother - the ancient sources are unclear). > **[Ptolemy XI Alexander II](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptolemy_XI_Alexander_II)** > > Ptolemy XI Alexander II\[note 1\] (Greek: Î Ï„ÎżÎ»Î”ÎŒÎ±áż–ÎżÏ‚ áŒˆÎ»Î­ÎŸÎ±ÎœÎŽÏÎżÏ‚, PtolemaÄ©os AlĂ©xandros) was a member of the Ptolemaic dynasty who ruled Egypt for a few days in 80 BC. He was a son of Ptolemy X Alexander I and Cleopatra Selene. > Ptolemy XI was born to Ptolemy X Alexander I and supposedly Cleopatra Selene. > His uncle Ptolemy IX Lathryos died in 81 BC or 80 BC, leaving only his sole legitimate daughter as his heir, and so Cleopatra Berenice (= Berenice III) ruled alone for a time. Rome's Sulla wanted a... ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2013, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/64 "2013-05-10T21:00:02Z")
> [@SleuFeets](#): > > considering the fact the poster said that he , and his girlfriend, still would have had threesome with the incest lady, even if he would have known about it, I would say that he wasn’t really bothered. sounds like an endorsement to me
 I assume you’re referring to my post. I wouldn’t say I endorse what she and her father did, but I’m not going to condemn her for it either. If I had never learned that about her, I would have continued to think of her as a well-adjusted, sexually adventurous free spirit. She didn’t appear to have a troubled past, or to be the victim of abuse. My GF had known her since they were kids. We were in our 20’s. She was cute, and normal, and could carry on a conversation about anything. Oh, and by the way, she once had sex with her father. Yeah, it was weird, but it’s not as if she was asking if she could invite him into a foursome with us, or anything. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/65 "2013-05-11T01:28:40Z")
> [@April\_R](#): > > My mom has worked as a social worker in Tennessee for about 14 years. There was a woman she was working with that was trying to get benefits for her child based on the death of the father. The mother and father had never been married yet shared the same last name. My mom having to know the circumstances of why this was the case found out from the woman that the father listed on the birth certificate was her biological brother. This was in East Tennessee and not unheard of. this sounds a bit like how everyone “knows” someone who “knows” a person named “Shithead.” ---
**Author:** ![April\_R](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@April\_R](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/April_R)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/66 "2013-05-11T02:09:32Z")
I know my mom who knows the woman. That is less degrees than Kevin Bacon. I am not getting your point ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/67 "2013-05-11T02:13:29Z")
Well
 I know my mother-in-law who claims to have had a student named Shithead. But I know she’s lying
 Not to say that’s the case for you, just pointing out that even a two-degree story is, to those hearing it, pretty unreliable. ---
**Author:** ![phouka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c5a1d2/32.png) [@phouka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phouka)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/68 "2013-05-11T02:33:31Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > See, I would disagree that he treated her well. I concede that I might be wrong, but imagine how much better it would be if he cared about her, treated her well, and did _not_ have a sexual relationship with her. She clearly had issues with a parent; how could another parent not recognize that? Equally, the father in this case had once chosen the abusive mother and had also (for whatever reason, but let’s say benign ignorance on his part) left his daughter in that situation. No matter how healthy the relationship seemed, he had to know he was in another relationship with a woman who was not healthy, and that he bore some culpability for both aspects. > > I can sort of see where the situation might not be doing any more harm, but I can’t see that it would be helping her become better and healthier in the long run. By “well”, obviously, I’m referring to a certain value of “well”, and not what you or I would consider acceptable. In this instance, the father did not physically harm her. He treated her like a person (though, not a daughter), took her feelings into consideration, and for the most part, she was happy. At least, she was a lot happier than she ever had been before. How long would this relationship have held out, considering that she was in her early 20s, and he was almost certainly in his forties or older? Strangely enough, if he did a good enough job of taking care of her that she was able to heal and become a more whole person, she probably would have left on her own. I don’t know. My mom only mentioned them one time and never again after that. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/69 "2013-05-11T02:34:38Z")
FOAF (friend-of-a-friend) is the technical term. Usually, these cannot be traced back without adding degrees. In this case, it cannot be traced back because of confidentiality. Different degree of plausibility. Now, if it turns out that **April R** ’s mother actually knew the story from a colleague, that would be different. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/70 "2013-05-11T03:11:42Z")
I have first cousins who are married with three kids. We were all surprised to find out that first cousin marriages are legal in MN. ---
**Author:** ![StuffLikeThatThere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc8723/32.png) [@StuffLikeThatThere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StuffLikeThatThere)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/71 "2013-05-11T03:28:19Z")
My mother knew first cousins who married. They were in their 60s and either never married or were both widowed. I can’t remember which. Neither had children. They loved each other and couldn’t think of any reason why they shouldn’t get married, since progeny was a non-issue. It’s not legal in Ohio to marry your first cousin, so they flew to California, got married, and came home. As far as I know, no one batted an eye over it. ---
**Author:** ![April\_R](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@April\_R](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/April_R)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/72 "2013-05-11T04:14:46Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > FOAF (friend-of-a-friend) is the technical term. Usually, these cannot be traced back without adding degrees. In this case, it cannot be traced back because of confidentiality. Different degree of plausibility. Now, if it turns out that **April R** ’s mother actually knew the story from a colleague, that would be different. Exactly. I heard it from my mom who is a licensed social worker who got it from the woman who was filing for benefits. My mom has no reason to make such things up and is not known for exaggeration. She sees enough as a social worker to make truth much stranger than fiction. My husband calls her stoic and brutally honest. I just call her mom 😉 ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/73 "2013-05-11T15:09:51Z")
BTW regarding the OP question – setting aside children of first cousin marriages, of whom I know a few (it may be a major squick in some segments of US society but elsewhere tends to be just unusual and an inconvenience of getting a dispensation from your clergy), no, I cannot say I know any that I can point to with self-reports or with solid evidence for my own or a trusted source’s firsthand knowledge. Just persistent, multisourced hearsay about some people back in the old hometown. However with the disheartening rate at which every so often I read of the arrest of someone for intra-family molestation in that general rural vicinity I would not be surprised if a good number of unreported COIs were growing up around me. ---
**Author:** ![Magicicada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c67d28/32.png) [@Magicicada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magicicada)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/74 "2013-05-11T17:48:17Z")
There was a boy I knew growing up who was maybe a year or two ahead of me in school. Very nice kid, but I remember there were just some things about him that were just a bit
off. He had some odd mannerisms that I’ve never seen in anyone else, mostly in relation to how he walked. While I don’t think he was considered mentally challenged, he was a little bit slow. Also, although it never would have occurred to me to make a connection at the time, physically he had some unusual characteristics, including his head shape. From what I can recall, he was accepted by the other kids at school, just considered a little different. Many years later I learned from someone close to his family that he was born after 2 successive generations of close relative marriages. I don’t remember the exact relationships, but I think it was something like his grandparents had been 1st cousins, and then his parents were an uncle/niece pair from that same marriage (so his grandparents were also his great grandparents). The person who told me this said that there was a genetic problem that became evident with the first marriage. The couple (the cousins) had several children, and apparently most had some type of mental impairment. In fact, the boy I knew may have been the descendant of the only two children who weren’t mentally challenged. Apparently other family members had tried to discourage the uncle/niece marriage, and when the couple married anyway urged them to not have children. The boy I knew was an only child, so they may have had some second thoughts. I was able to learn that he grew up to have a normal adulthood, and is quite cherished within his family, being not only his parent’s only child, but also either the only child born or the only child to survive in that generation of his family. ---
**Author:** ![cmb111100](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/35a633/32.png) [@cmb111100](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmb111100)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/75 "2013-05-12T03:50:15Z")
_I’ve been reading this thread with great interest
And I will take this opportunity to put in my 2 cents, I am the direct offspring of a father ,daughter relationship that from what my mother has told me
was non-consensual! Now, where do I start
lol One head, ten fingers (8 fingers 2 thumbs),ten toes,2 arms,2 legs, 2 eyes no cleft pallet or any other genetic anomalies that I am aware of
 but I do have certain abilities that seem a little odd to most people, my IQ is in the mid 180s, Im ambidextrous with the ability to write different words simultaneously, I am also highly artistic and have a knack for particle and theoretical physics
So I guess its safe to assume that the stereotype of a person such as myself(Inbred) sitting on the front porch of my house in the woods
banjo in hand 
strumming “Dueling Banjos” isn’t one that I conform to
 But for all that
there is this
I didn’t find out about the circumstances that led to my conception until late in life (5 yrs ago)
and its had a profound effect on me and how I view myself
 I wouldn’t wish the way I feel about my situation on my worst enemy
 Feel free to reply or ask questions, this is my attempt at a little self therapy I guess
 Thanks for listening guys_ ---
**Author:** ![HoneyBadgerDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honeybadgerdc/32/1033_2.png) [@HoneyBadgerDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoneyBadgerDC)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/76 "2013-05-12T04:11:59Z")
> [@cmb111100](#): > > _I’ve been reading this thread with great interest
And I will take this opportunity to put in my 2 cents, I am the direct offspring of a father ,daughter relationship that from what my mother has told me
was non-consensual! Now, where do I start
lol One head, ten fingers (8 fingers 2 thumbs),ten toes,2 arms,2 legs, 2 eyes no cleft pallet or any other genetic anomalies that I am aware of
 but I do have certain abilities that seem a little odd to most people, my IQ is in the mid 180s, Im ambidextrous with the ability to write different words simultaneously, I am also highly artistic and have a knack for particle and theoretical physics
So I guess its safe to assume that the stereotype of a person such as myself(Inbred) sitting on the front porch of my house in the woods
banjo in hand 
strumming “Dueling Banjos” isn’t one that I conform to
 But for all that
there is this
I didn’t find out about the circumstances that led to my conception until late in life (5 yrs ago)
and its had a profound effect on me and how I view myself
 I wouldn’t wish the way I feel about my situation on my worst enemy
 Feel free to reply or ask questions, this is my attempt at a little self therapy I guess
 Thanks for listening guys_ It doesn’t matter where you came from, what matters is that you are a whole person and exceptional at that. You had no control over his behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ce7236/32.png) [@Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mona_Lisa_Simpson)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/77 "2013-05-13T19:52:36Z")
A close friend of mine from southern Manitoba grew up in a small town, and as an adult found out that his grandfather had molested several generations of his family, and it is now generally acknowledged that his cousin’s child was fathered by his grandfather. I believe he and his sister, who moved away from the small town to Winnipeg have no contact with that part of his family. (And his sister was never molested by Grandpa because she was too busy being abused by her own parents, and they kept the kids at home and away from everyone else.) ---
**Author:** ![larkinjet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9fc348/32.png) [@larkinjet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/larkinjet)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2016, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/78 "2016-12-07T08:39:27Z")
Do you mean that I spent an hour composing a piece to post and then discover that no one has posted on this thread for 12 years ? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2016, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/79 "2016-12-07T09:27:16Z")
> [@user\_hostile](#): > > Around the time of the second incidence, I found a book on sexual behavior at the library, and with respect to incest, such incidences were “1-in-a-million”. “Wow,” I thought, “What are the odds of running into two unrelated cases like that!” > > By the late 80’s, IIRC, it was pretty clear that incest was vastly underestimated. > > I moved to east TN in the late 90’s. While participating in a woman’s shelter fund-raiser, a social worker told me of a case involving the father and his daughter, granddaughter, and great-granddaughter. My mother’s father (who claimed to have been pimped out by his mother to other women who liked them young) tried with different degrees of success and in different ways to pimp out his daughters, granddaughters and grandsons. With the boys he started when they were about 5yo, with the girls once we started developing. At one point he offered to teach me how to give blowjobs, saying with a bothered look “some people [translate, my grandmother] do not like it when a man goes all the way with his daughters or his granddaughters”. I think the daughter in question will have been my aunt (she’s the most fucked-up and he had better opportunity with her, as she worked for him in his store for several years), but who knows. Asking wouldn’t bring any believable answers: for that side of the family, denial is a way of life. No children of incest that I know of, all of us “kids” have enough physical traits from our fathers’ families to believe they really are our dads, but it’s a very fucked up gang. I remember having Grandpa coming on to me and thinking “this can’t be happening, we’re normal! This doesn’t happen in normal families!” Yeah well, define normal. (My father never knew. He knew he didn’t like his father in law, or trust him half as far as he could throw him, but Mom always smoke-screened everything). **larkinjet** , you may want to check your math. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2016, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910/80 "2016-12-07T11:27:33Z")
> [@larkinjet](#): > > Do you mean that I spent an hour composing a piece to post and then discover that no one has posted on this thread for 12 years ? A bit over three years, actually. Gotta remember to carry the one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-incestuous-relationships/657910.md?page=5)