# Children of Parents Who Didn't Use Corporal Punishment. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 8, 2017, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095 "2017-08-08T14:59:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/61 "2017-08-11T22:27:25Z")
I don’t see anyone in this debate attempting to define “spanking”. I occasionally slapped my children’s hands for some infraction, but I would not define that as a “spanking”. For the most part, their mother and I convinced them that it was generally in their own best interests to behave and what few rules we had were clear and unambiguous. They both grew up as honest and decent adults. ---
**Author:** ![etasyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9f8e36/32.png) [@etasyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etasyde)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2017, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/62 "2017-08-12T20:55:31Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Yes, hitting a child is wrong. Is hitting an adult right? No? Then how can hitting a child possibly be right? That’s a kneejerk, unless you think a 5 year old hitting a 7 year old bully in self defense is also wrong. Or that an adult hitting another adult who’s attempting to take their life is wrong. You _quoted_ a passage specifically outlining that there is a spectrum of appropriate use of force with an _absolutist_ position. Absolutist positions almost always utterly fail under even minute scrutiny. Even if you amend to “an adult should never hit a child” or some such variant, you rule out, say, an adult using violent action towards disarming an active shooter who happens to be a child. Once you lose your moral absolute, your entire argument breaks down. Try constructing an argument that isn’t contingent on an arbitrary absolute that utterly fails under cursory examination. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/63 "2017-08-13T08:06:31Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > To clarify, tiers is not about increasing severity and there only needs to be two tiers. Tier two is what happens if the child doesn’t comply with tier one. For example when I was in the industry, tier 1 was timeout and tier 2 was either talking to the parent or sending to the director’s office. That’s not particularly subtle and doesn’t seem to follow the principle of “the punishment must fit the crime”. And it took me 6 years to get over the trauma of being taken to the director’s office because the teacher thought my drawings were too advanced - a bit more subtlety would have been welcome (nobody thought of explaining to me that I’d done nothing wrong). ---
**Author:** ![Lorne\_Armstrong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@Lorne\_Armstrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lorne_Armstrong)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/64 "2017-08-13T11:00:16Z")
Hitting anyone, except in self-defense, is abuse. If you hit your children, you are a child abuser. If your parents hit you while you were growing up, your parents were child abusers. Stop lying to yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Lorne\_Armstrong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@Lorne\_Armstrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lorne_Armstrong)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/65 "2017-08-13T11:02:11Z")
> [@Hermitian](#): > > I am a big believe in spanking, but it really does have to be used in just the right way. > > 1. It has be used with younger children. Spanking older kids 7+ is just stupid, it doesn’t work. > 2. It has be as soon as possible after the infraction. It has to be consistent. Humans are very good at picking up pasterns. If little Timmy know that disobeying Daddy is _always_ swiftly followed with a spanking, he makes the mental connection. > 3. It has to be after the first infraction. If you keep letting the bad behavior continue until YOU CAN’T TAKE IT ANYMORE, you are 1) breaking the mental disobedience-discipline connection and 2) you will be hitting your child in anger. This ties into our last item… > 4. You have to be the calm and loving one of the two people. Spanking in anger in attempt to hurt them is child abuse. I always hug my children after spanking them. They hug me back. We talk about why the spanking happened. > > I have two children, so I know that following all of these 100% of the time is impossible, but we strive to get as close as possible. However, #4 is a requirement, if I am too angry, I just tell them to go to their room until I cool down. > > This is why I don’t trust most “spanking” studies. They group all the people who spank properly with the people who just hit their children. There is a difference between the two and I think most of the people (in the study and overall) just hit their children in anger and expect it to work. No wonder it is always shown not to work. You belong in prison. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2017, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/66 "2017-08-13T17:51:37Z")
I used to have a Facebook friend who constantly posted memes like “My mother carried a wooden spoon around with her to show us who was boss, and it made me who I am today!” (Divorced from three abusive husbands? Really?) If someone has to constantly carry weapons to show small children who’s in charge, they’re not in charge. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2017, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/67 "2017-08-14T00:00:33Z")
I can only describe my experience. Our oldest, a girl, was very well-behaved. We spanked her once and she dissolved in tears, as though to say, how can these people bring pain on me. Then her brother came along and was not well-behaved. It got so we seemed to be spanking him everyday. My wife and I had talked it over and decided to try not spanking him ever. His behavior improved almost immediately and we never spanked him again. When #3 came along, we had already decided that we would not spank him. All three turned out to be wonderful people and have never spanked their own kids (who are also very well-behaved). But I would like to see definitive studies of the question. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/68 "2017-08-14T22:43:08Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I get why some parents get frustrated to the point where they might make the occasional swat out of tough love. Or kicking, pulling hair, etc. :mad: I’ve read about, and been told by, people who work with kids and they can tell when a child is raised with an emphasis on physical punishment. They aren’t better behaved, but they are better at not getting caught. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![ashtayk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e68b1a/32.png) [@ashtayk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ashtayk)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/69 "2017-08-15T14:36:35Z")
For all those people who advocate spanking, please remember you are using pain and humiliation as a behavior modification tool, regardless of whether it is done while being calm and loving. I HATED the few times I was spanked as a child, however many hugs I got afterwards. Today, when my parents see me dealing with my 8 year old, they often say, “We wish we had treated you differently.” I love them, but I still get angry when I hear that. Excuses like “They were different times”, “We didn’t know better” get trotted out. Actually, I am quite mad right now, as I even write this post. Parents - please do NOT spank your child. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/70 "2017-08-15T20:07:28Z")
Hitting young children then immediately hugging them to show them it was done out of love-I can’t think of a better way to indoctrinate them to become, or marry, spousal abusers. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/71 "2017-08-15T20:17:19Z")
> [@etasyde](#): > > That’s a kneejerk, unless you think a 5 year old hitting a 7 year old bully in self defense is also wrong. Or that an adult hitting another adult who’s attempting to take their life is wrong. > > You _quoted_ a passage specifically outlining that there is a spectrum of appropriate use of force with an _absolutist_ position. Absolutist positions almost always utterly fail under even minute scrutiny. > > Even if you amend to “an adult should never hit a child” or some such variant, you rule out, say, an adult using violent action towards disarming an active shooter who happens to be a child. > > Once you lose your moral absolute, your entire argument breaks down. Try constructing an argument that isn’t contingent on an arbitrary absolute that utterly fails under cursory examination. Thanks for clarifying your position on this matter. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/72 "2017-08-15T20:18:22Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Hitting young children then immediately hugging them to show them it was done out of love-I can’t think of a better way to indoctrinate them to become, or marry, spousal abusers. Yeah, but my parents hit me because they loved me! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/73 "2017-08-15T20:31:28Z")
If you are truly hitting your child out of love, why is it usually the _last_ resort? ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/74 "2017-08-15T20:43:18Z")
A parent might turn their kid over to a surgeon for an operation out of love too. That doesn’t mean it would be anything other than a last resort. [For some reason this thread has disintegrated into a series of extremely simplistic remarks by corporal punishment opponents.] ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/75 "2017-08-15T20:49:06Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > A parent might turn their kid over to a surgeon for an operation out of love too. That doesn’t mean it would be anything other than a last resort. > > [For some reason this thread has disintegrated into a series of extremely simplistic remarks by corporal punishment opponents.] A discussion hasn’t “disintegrated” just because it turns against what you believe. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/76 "2017-08-15T20:50:20Z")
Right. It’s the “simplistic” part that I’m commenting on. Your prior two posts are leading examples of this. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/77 "2017-08-15T20:56:26Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Right. It’s the “simplistic” part that I’m commenting on. Your prior two posts are leading examples of this. I see nothing complicated about not hitting young children. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/78 "2017-08-15T20:58:13Z")
Oh. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/79 "2017-08-15T21:05:36Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Oh. I’m sorry-Would it be better if I used one of the preferred euphemisms, like “discipline”, “correct” or “spank”? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095/80 "2017-08-15T21:26:08Z")
Are these links from [_Psychology Today_](https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-me-in-we/201202/how-spanking-harms-the-brain), [The American Psychological Association](http://www.apa.org/monitor/2012/04/spanking.aspx) and [_The Science Explorer_](http://thescienceexplorer.com/brain-and-body/there-difference-between-spanking-and-physical-abuse) too simplistic for this thread, **Fotheringgay-Phipps**? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-of-parents-who-didnt-use-corporal-punishment/793095.md?page=5)