# Children saying "sir" and "ma'am": Asshole parents? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 26, 2010, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775 "2010-05-26T01:10:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2010, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/81 "2010-05-26T21:36:14Z")
Absolutely not. I’d assume they were actually raising their kids with some all too rare semblance of respect for their elders. When I was growing up (rural northern Indiana father/SW Tennessee mother in NW Ohio), we were raised that our parents could be, “Sir/Ma’am, Mom/Dad, etc.” Other adults were to be addressed as, “Sir/Ma’am or Mr./Mrs./Ms. Last Name” unless and until they gave us permission to call them by their first names. Aunts and Uncles were either, “Ma’am/Sir or Aunt/Uncle First Name” until we were teenagers, then first names were acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![capybara](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/capybara/32/202_2.png) [@capybara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capybara)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2010, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/82 "2010-05-26T22:19:34Z")
I’d think “southern”. My folks are from the deep south, and while I and the other younger kids in the family were born and raised way out west and north and call mom and dad. . . “mom” and “dad”, our older siblings, who were born and lived in the south until they were 6 or 7, always did and still use “sir” and “ma’am”. Not sure why it never came up with us younger kids-- perhaps the older kids were influenced not just by our folks but by the larger environmental norm, or the parents consciously dropped the expectation when they headed west. ---
**Author:** ![Hockey\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a183cd/32.png) [@Hockey\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hockey_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2010, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/83 "2010-05-26T23:44:54Z")
No, I would think they were good parents teaching their children manners and respect. Something that’s missing from a whooooole lot of parental lesson plans these days as far as I’m concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/84 "2010-05-27T00:28:59Z")
Do the parents call the kids “sir” and “ma’am”? ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/85 "2010-05-27T00:34:13Z")
Everyone should go read **ivan** ’s post again. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/86 "2010-05-27T01:41:17Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > Everyone should go read **ivan** ’s post again. Linkety-link-link? ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/87 "2010-05-27T01:42:20Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Do the parents call the kids “sir” and “ma’am”? Yes. This has been mentioned in several posts in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/88 "2010-05-27T01:47:04Z")
> [@NinetyWt](#): > > Linkety-link-link? > [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > You don’t have to raise children to respect people, just not to disrespect them. Given the right example, they are quite capable themselves of determining who merits “respect”. I know, I was one myself. Unquestioning respect is not a trait we should be indoctrinating children with. Also: I’m not doubting that it happens, but as alien as kids calling their parents “sir” and “ma’am” is to me, the parents calling the children “sir” and “ma’am” is even more alien and I doubt that that’s the norm among parents who make their children do it. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/89 "2010-05-27T02:31:00Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > I doubt that that’s the norm among parents who make their children do it. _sigh_ I am 50 years old and yes, I have heard people “ma’am” and “sir” their children all my life. Just because you live in a place where it doesn’t happen doesn’t make you correct. But thanks for linking to the post you were talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/90 "2010-05-27T03:07:49Z")
> [@NinetyWt](#): > > Yes. This has been mentioned in several posts in this thread. Should it be considered the case for the poll? ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/91 "2010-05-27T03:08:51Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Should it be considered the case for the poll? I’m sorry, I don’t follow you. Do you mean, should it have been part of the question in the OP? ---
**Author:** ![BetsQ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/fbc32d/32.png) [@BetsQ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BetsQ)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/92 "2010-05-27T04:17:21Z")
Sir and ma’am are customer service language to me. I would definitely raise an eyebrow if I overheard a kid say to his/her mother, “Ma’am, may I please have a juice box?” or “Will you help my tie my shoes, ma’am?” That would seem like very stilted and formal language for what should be a very close relationship. I do say, “Yes, ma’am” or “No, sir!” to my kids occasionally, but they should take it as a hint that they’re being way the heck too bossy. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/93 "2010-05-27T04:34:47Z")
> [@BetsQ](#): > > Sir and ma’am are customer service language to me. I would definitely raise an eyebrow if I overheard a kid say to his/her mother, “Ma’am, may I please have a juice box?” or “Will you help my tie my shoes, ma’am?” That would seem like very stilted and formal language for what should be a very close relationship. And “sir” and “ma’am” aren’t used in those contexts. “Mama” would be used there. “Sir” and “Ma’am” are used when responding to questions or instructions. ---
**Author:** ![kenner116](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecb155/32.png) [@kenner116](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenner116)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/94 "2010-05-27T04:58:41Z")
It sounds overly formal and submissive, so I would feel odd calling my dad “sir” or my mom “ma’am”. Upon reading the thread title I imagined an authoritarian/conservative father trying to run his family like it was the army. It has nothing to do with manners or being courteous. As for “respect”, there is a big difference between showing common respect towards people, and having a person demand “respect” from others with an implied threat of punishment. ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Matata)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/95 "2010-05-27T06:06:51Z")
I’m a native of the very Deep South, and “yes, sir/no ma’am” language is as normal as breathing around here. In fact, I guess I’m one of those asshole parents, because I expect my children to use “sir” and “ma’am,” for the same reason that I expect them to say “please” or “thank you,” and to keep their elbows off the dinner table. It’s just considered proper manners around here. And I don’t see the usage as overly formal or distant, even in a close relationship. Is it overly formal to say “please” or “thanks” to the people you live with and love? As many have noted, this may be a regional thing, but I’ve never had anyone react badly when I use the same polite language at work. I deal with lots of guests from Canada (particularly Quebec and Ontario,) New England, and other upper Atlantic states, the midwest, etc., and I ALWAYS use sir and ma’am, and refer to all clients as “Mr. Smith” or “Ms. Jones” - never their given names (unless they have requested that I do so.) No one even blinks. Maybe they just expect it because they ARE in the southern US? I don’t necessarily think it’s a religious thing, though (unless you think that being Southern is a religion. Some do.) My husband and I are about as irreligious as they come, but we both use these forms of address, and expect it of our kids. Maybe y’all are conflating the two, since Southerners seem to be more religious than the rest of the country? As for saying ma’am/sir to a child, I can think of five major contexts in which I would commonly do so. (1-4 aren’t all-the-time things, but they certainly aren’t uncommon. 1-3 are mostly playful.) 1 ~ Kid trying to get my attention: “Mom?” Me, acknowledging: “Yes ma’am?” 2 ~ My son pops up on my caller ID. I answer phone: “Yes sir?” (Possibly a subset of #1.) 3 ~ Emphatic agreement: “Yes ma’am!” = “You betcha!” or “Absolutely!” 4 ~ (Kid says or does something he shouldn’t.) Me: “Excuse me sir?!” (Similar to using kid’s first, middle, and last name. He’s in trouble, and he knows it!) 5 ~ Reminder: (Kid forgets to use “ma’am” when addressing someone) Me: “Yes, ma’am?” Kid: “Oh! yes, ma’am.!” ---
**Author:** ![grimpixie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@grimpixie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grimpixie)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/96 "2010-05-27T08:07:42Z")
Not Assholes per se, but strange… ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/97 "2010-05-27T09:04:42Z")
If I heard this, I’d assume firstly the parents were Americans. \*Then \*assholes. No causal link there, it’d just \*first \*stand out as an Americanism. Then, when I thought about it a second or two, the “kids as property” element would get to me, and I’d think “assholes”. Unless they were obviously Amish, in which case, I’d just think “weirdos” ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/98 "2010-05-27T09:25:33Z")
> [@Wolverine](#): > > But you do respect others in certain situations. I’m sure you say “Please” and “Thank you” to strangers. If someone’s arms are full, you probably move a little bit to the side to help clear their path. You even use proper grammar and spelling on the Internet. This is respect, not just avoiding disrespect. Sounds more like “common courtesy” to me. Respect and disrespect are both things that should be earned, not just given as a matter of course and without thought. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/99 "2010-05-27T10:01:23Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Do the parents call the kids “sir” and “ma’am”? No, but we were treated with respect just the same. They were of the ‘praise in public correct in private’ mindset as well. We just had a fairly polite formal type of raising. Respect is not abusive. ---
**Author:** ![Chicagojeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b19c9b/32.png) [@Chicagojeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicagojeff)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775/100 "2010-05-27T13:54:56Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Sounds more like “common courtesy” to me. Respect and disrespect are both things that should be earned, not just given as a matter of course and without thought. I would have to disagree with you. I’ve found in my line of work when I’m dealing with a particularly reprehensible person.. (gang banger.. child molester) instead of showing them the disdain and disrespect they so utterly deserve I totally disarm them with respect and courtesy. It reminds me that the extension of this is thru ME and not contingent upon the character of the receiver. For example during a traffic stop I was referred to in multiple racial slurs. I kept my cool by responding forcibly yet courteous. I’ve taught both of my youngin’s that everyone may not DESERVE your respect.. but you need to extend it as a practice. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/children-saying-sir-and-maam-asshole-parents/540775.md?page=6)