# China to destroy universe **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 2, 2018, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027 "2018-02-02T13:57:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/1 "2018-02-02T13:57:05Z")
China is working on a laser system called “[Station of Extreme Light](http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/01/physicists-are-planning-build-lasers-so-powerful-they-could-rip-apart-empty-space)”, capable of creating pulses of 10 million billion watts. It is expected to concentrate enough energy in a small area to generate electron-positron pairs from the vacuum. This will of course lead to a [collapse of the false vacuum](https://cosmosmagazine.com/physics/vacuum-decay-ultimate-catastrophe), destroying the universe. Just giving a heads-up. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/2 "2018-02-02T14:25:00Z")
From the cite: > [@](#): > > Largely missing from the fray are U.S. scientists, who have fallen behind in the race to high powers, according to a study published last month by a National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine group that was chaired by Bucksbaum. The study calls on the Department of Energy to plan for at least one high-power laser facility, and that gives hope to researchers at the University of Rochester in New York, who are developing plans for a 75-PW laser, the Optical Parametric Amplifier Line (OPAL). It would take advantage of beamlines at OMEGA-EP, one of the country’s most powerful lasers. “The [Academies] report is encouraging,” says Jonathan Zuegel, who heads the OPAL. Yeah – the Laboratory for Laser Energetics’ _Omega_ laser system was the first thing I thought of when reading that. The Omega system at the LLE was the East Coast laser fusion facility (pictured in the article) which was building an ultrafast ultrapowerful laser system in order to generate inertial confinement fusion. If I wanted to scale up a US facility in a hurry to compete with other groups, I’d go to them or to Livermore. I used to live behind that lab, in Whipple Park. I have to admit that I’m not entirely clear on what this is to accomplish, aside from Going Where No One Has Ever Gone Before and seeing what happens. if you want to agonize over powerful Chinese lasers, by the way, you might want to consider the Silent Hunter laser they demonstrated at an arms show in Dubai last year. > **[Laser weapon 'Silent Hunter' that can slice MISSILES unveiled](https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/774268/Defence-China-US-Laser-Weapon-Tank-Slicing-Defence-Abu-Dhabi)** > > A LASER weapon called The Silent Hunter that can carve up a tank from a kilometre away has been unveiled in the United Arab Emirates. > **[Zerohedge](https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-03-01/meet-silent-hunter-chinas-new-armored-vehicle-slicing-laser-gun)** > > ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero It produces a measley (by comparison) 70-100 kW of output, but it has a demonstrated capability of cutting up missiles, and it’s field-deployable. Its claimed output is greater than the declared output of US military lasers. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/3 "2018-02-02T14:39:58Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I used to live behind that lab, in Whipple Park. Is it protected by a series of walls? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/4 "2018-02-02T14:55:42Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Is it protected by a series of walls? Nope. Just trees. Lotsa trees ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/5 "2018-02-02T17:07:16Z")
I’ve never understood the “accelerators are going to destroy the…” as there are more powerful events going on all the time than anything we can hope to replicate. If I were to be nervous about something man made destroying the universe, it would be our quest to get ever colder and closer to absolute zero. Removing that much energy from a system seems more likely to cause it to fall to a lower energy state than adding a bunch of energy to a system. There is also the fact that there are not many place in the universe that would reach those temperatures, so you can’t use the same reasoning about high energy events. Note: I am not saying that I think it is likely that the universe will be destroyed because someone turned down the thermostat a bit too far, but if I had to pick one to be concerned about, it would not be accelerators. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/6 "2018-02-02T18:35:19Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > building an ultrafast ultrapowerful laser system Ultra…_fast?_ Isn’t there, like, a speed limit on lasers? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/7 "2018-02-02T18:52:33Z")
At last! After two thousand years of work, the Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator! ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/8 "2018-02-02T19:05:05Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Ultra…_fast?_ Isn’t there, like, a speed limit on lasers? Fast as in short pulses. The limit (femtoseconds? attoseconds?) should depend on exactly how you construct the laser. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/9 "2018-02-02T19:06:59Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Ultra…_fast?_ Isn’t there, like, a speed limit on lasers? A power limit. The proposed one uses a thousand times more power than all the world’s power grids combined, but the pulse last less than a trillionth of a second. Let’s say that it makes one pulse per second–it would have only to store one billionth of the world’s power capacity for that one second and then fire it. So it _has_ to run for an extremely short time for the whole world to have enough energy to power it. (Plus, even if there was miraculously enough energy to power it, it’d probably melt in an eyeblink.) ---
**Author:** ![edwards\_beard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@edwards\_beard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwards_beard)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/10 "2018-02-02T19:23:13Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > A power limit. The proposed one uses a thousand times more power than all the world’s power grids combined, but the pulse last less than a trillionth of a second. Let’s say that it makes one pulse per second–it would have only to store one billionth of the world’s power capacity for that one second and then fire it. So it _has_ to run for an extremely short time for the whole world to have enough energy to power it. (Plus, even if there was miraculously enough energy to power it, it’d probably melt in an eyeblink.) Of all the movie plots I’d like to see come true…Real Genius wasn’t on the top of my list. Looking forward to Dr Hathaway’s house being full of Popcorn again. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/11 "2018-02-02T21:38:23Z")
From Cal Meacham: > [@](#): > > The study calls on the Department of Energy to plan for at least one high-power laser facility, and that gives hope to researchers at the University of Rochester in New York, who are developing plans for a 75-PW laser, the Optical Parametric Amplifier Line (OPAL). It would take advantage of beamlines at OMEGA-EP, one of the country’s most powerful lasers. “The [Academies] report is encouraging,” says Jonathan Zuegel, who heads the OPAL. Hi, OPAL! ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/12 "2018-02-02T21:53:40Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > China is working on a laser system called “[Station of Extreme Light](http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/01/physicists-are-planning-build-lasers-so-powerful-they-could-rip-apart-empty-space)”, capable of creating pulses of 10 million billion watts. It is expected to concentrate enough energy in a small area to generate electron-positron pairs from the vacuum. > > This will of course lead to a [collapse of the false vacuum](https://cosmosmagazine.com/physics/vacuum-decay-ultimate-catastrophe), destroying the universe. > > Just giving a heads-up. You can’t scare me. I’ve read enough Spider Robinson to know that the collapse of the false vacuum can be thwarted by a crusty old piano player, a lanky practical joker, a talking dog, the immortal Tesla, the spirit of the Internet, a bar-tender, a bass player and a genius toddler, all in telepathic communion. But first, some puns! ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/13 "2018-02-02T22:00:05Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > You can’t scare me. I’ve read enough Spider Robinson to know that the collapse of the false vacuum can be thwarted by a crusty old piano player, a lanky practical joker, a talking dog, the immortal Tesla, the spirit of the Internet, a bar-tender, a bass player and a genius toddler, all in telepathic communion. Okay, then go read Greg Egan’s [_Schild’s Ladder_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schild%27s_Ladder). Then I can scare you. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/14 "2018-02-02T22:09:17Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Okay, then go read Greg Egan’s [_Schild’s Ladder_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schild%27s_Ladder). Then I can scare you. Sensible people already existing in computational form can easily evade a 1/2-c collapse, and recreate their whole planet at their leisure somewhere else, and who knows, the post-false-vacuum-collapse universe might be absolutely full of intelligent life, not just on a few planets, but actually throughout the whole volume, composed of new kinds of physical structures that the collapse has made possible (Greg Egan is awesome!). ---
**Author:** ![SigMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@SigMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SigMan)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/15 "2018-02-03T01:25:52Z")
Don’t worry, the aliens won’t let it happen. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/16 "2018-02-03T04:10:24Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > 10 million billion watts Dude, is there some reason we can’t just say “10 quadrillion watts”? ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/17 "2018-02-03T04:36:09Z")
Wait – now here’s the good news. This is strong evidence, if not proof, that there is no significantly higher intellect anywhere in the universe. If there were, they would have reached this point and destroyed the false vacuum and reduced to universe to a whimpering sop… ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/18 "2018-02-03T04:42:08Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > This is strong evidence, if not proof, that there is no significantly higher intellect anywhere in the universe. If there were, they would have reached this point and destroyed the false vacuum and reduced to universe to a whimpering sop… You’d think so, wouldn’t you? However, since the vacuum collapse propogates at the speed of light, it’s entirely possible that it’s already happened, but just hasn’t reached us yet. Perhaps there is (was) a hyper-intelligent race of beings 10,000,000 light years away, who destroyed the false vacuum 9,999,999.95 years ago… ---
**Author:** ![Fugazi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f08c70/32.png) [@Fugazi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fugazi)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/19 "2018-02-03T05:59:35Z")
From _Restaurant at the end of the Universe_ > [@Douglas Adams](#): > > There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. > There is another which states that this has already happened ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027/20 "2018-02-03T06:30:32Z")
Perhaps we should consult with the Tralfamadorans as to whether this is the correct time to destroy the universe or should we just wait for them to do it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/china-to-destroy-universe/808027.md?page=2)