# Christian Rep. of TX Leo Berman wants to abolish religious laws (what am I missing?) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 17, 2011, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003 "2011-01-17T22:11:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/21 "2011-01-18T12:43:57Z")
So, the amendment just means “Texas courts may not uphold laws not currently part of the legal code of Texas or the United States,” is that right? -That’s great use of a voter referendum right there. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/22 "2011-01-18T13:01:19Z")
> [@xenophon41](#): > > So, the amendment just means “Texas courts may not uphold laws not currently part of the legal code of Texas or the United States,” is that right? > > -That’s great use of a voter referendum right there. Like I said, it’s not like they ever have anyway. It is a fundamental principle of all court systems that their authority is limited to the laws of the land. But it allows the good Representative to tell his constituents he’s really socking it to them activist judges (wait, aren’t Texas judges elected by Texans?) Abuse of the voter referendum/initiative is by now SOP in many of the states (California being the poster child). Not to mention having the state constitutions ladened with heaps of things that are really not matters of fundamental rights but mere policies that should be subject to ordinary legislation. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/23 "2011-01-18T14:42:36Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > **Simplicio** , they were indeed “pretty uncontroversial” at the time. But I don’t know of anyone today who, looking back, thinks it was a good thing we let them take root and become relatively common back then. > > **RNATB** , Jews and black people weren’t _parties_ to those contracts - they were kept out of neighborhoods by them. They’re not parties _to_ the agreement, but they’re certainly parties affected _by_ it. The religion-based marriage mediation/arbitration stuff we’re talking about affects only the couple themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/24 "2011-01-18T16:06:05Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > They’re not parties _to_ the agreement, but they’re certainly parties affected _by_ it. The religion-based marriage mediation/arbitration stuff we’re talking about affects only the couple themselves. And their children, if any, and arguably their ethnic community, depending on their role in it. My point is that a contract may be void for public-policy reasons even if, as **Simplicio** wrote, “…all parties agree to the terms…” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/25 "2011-01-18T16:11:37Z")
Fair enough, then. And one thing I’ve learned taking contracts this year is that _no_ party ever agrees to all the terms. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2011, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/26 "2011-01-18T16:24:40Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Another component of these types of legislative proposals (didn’t a neighboring state pass one lately, too?) is preventing courts from “using foreign law” which is really just bringing up other legal sources or practices as reference, analogy or example: e.g. quoting the UN Declaration of Rights, making a reference to how every other major developed democracy has approved or repealed X Y or Z, which AFAIK no US court ever uses as an actual _basis for their decisions_ but it still ticks off some people. Yes on the “neighboring state…” portion; Oklahoma ballot initiative that passed regarding international law and Sharia Law (specifically mentioned). The Sharia law portioned has already been challenged and declared unconstitutional in a lower court case ruling. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2011, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/27 "2011-01-19T07:16:56Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Wait a second, if I want to get stoned, I have to commit adultery first? In the presence of four male witnesses! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/28 "2011-01-19T15:32:45Z")
I’m just too shy for that. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2011, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/29 "2011-01-19T15:40:09Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I’m just too shy for that. Fine. You find another lighting and camera crew, then. I’m going home. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2011, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/30 "2011-01-19T17:08:43Z")
> [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](#): > > Fine. You find another lighting and camera crew, then. I’m going home. Just so you know, I’m stopping payment on the check. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2011, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003/31 "2011-01-19T22:26:03Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Just so you know, I’m stopping payment on the check. Wait 'til the union hears about this! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christian-rep-of-tx-leo-berman-wants-to-abolish-religious-laws-what-am-i-missing/568003.md?page=1)