# Christianity 101 Questions from an Ex-Mormon **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 23, 2019, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932 "2019-04-23T12:53:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/41 "2019-04-24T12:25:14Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > Mormons believe that everyone will be physically resurrected. That everybody’s soul reunited with their body. Is that also another “quirky” Mormon belief or do other sects also believe that? In my experience, the average Christian doesn’t hear much about it or think much about it, but it’s [in the Bible](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Corinthians+15&version=NIV) that people will be resurrected in a “spiritual body”: > [@Paul](#): > > But someone will ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?” … When you sow, you do not plant the body that will be, but just a seed … So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/42 "2019-04-24T12:38:28Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Because they’re not just hypothetical. Metaphoricing away the Satan/Hell part may come from kindness and magnanimity but it’s the tiny crack in the window that slowly spreads. As much as I love a slippery slope argument, we’re engaging in a journey toward spiritual truth and the nature of God, not attempting to be disingenuous in an effort to shore up other’s faiths. > [@](#): > > While the will to administer a rhetorical beating is common (and I have felt it and fallen for it), I see this place as less of a boxing ring and more of a forum. I’m speaking in general. How a statement impacts the apologetics is not a priority for progressive Christians. > [@](#): > > I don’t know what that means. > > I get the impression that, in practice, it’s largely covered by the “serve humanity” part that immediately follows. To draw closer means to more fully be aligned with God’s will and interests. Serving humanity and creation is certainly part of it, since God created it, loves it and called it good, but it involves loving God and loving ourselves as well. > [@](#): > > The part you quote says that both faith and deeds are required. Yet you see to be saying that deeds alone are sufficient, which sounds like non-Orthodox Judaism. > > Verse 26 of same chapter says: “As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.” = deeds without faith is as dead as faith without deeds. I wouldn’t go that far. Faith without works is dead, but works can be dead as well. I’m talking about mistaken belief which is different than no belief. There are about half a billion Christian denominations with mutually exclusive claims. Now maybe, the ‘First Self Righteous Church of Truth and Prosperity of Columbus, Ohio LLC’ has it right and all the rest of us are wrong, but I would like to think that God cares a lot more about our faith in action rather than whether Job was a real guy that happened to have friends who were very faithful about dictating his words or just a metaphor for how we should respond to suffering. > [@](#): > > I get a gold star? Why? Do you want one? If you’re concerned about the rewards or lack thereof, then you’re missing the point. You do good because it is the right thing to do. You want to be in God’s will because by definition his will is good. Now maybe there’s a reward at the end and maybe there isn’t. If you find it fun to speculate and the thought of heaven is what gets you through the day, then have at it, but if gold stars are the only reason you’re doing it, I’m not calling you heretical or anything, but you might want to ponder the matter further. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/43 "2019-04-24T12:42:39Z")
Note that the idea of “[fallen angels](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallen_angel)” (and a/the Satan being part thereof) is not Biblical. Most of that folklore comes from the _Book of Enoch_. So calling such a belief “Christian” is a misnomer. Sure a lot of sects are okay with this belief but it is not universal nor necessarily dogmatic. ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/44 "2019-04-24T13:26:30Z")
Since I said I would: The Trinity is complex. It hinges on the statement that God is 3 persons of one essence(or nature, substance or being.) The usual terms used are hypostases (persons) and ousia(substance) - although it’s interesting to note that hypostases comes from Plato and essentially is a synonym with ousia which comes from Aristotle and both designate underlying substance, but the neoPlatonic use of hypostases to divide a person into three underlying beings (the soul, the intellect and the underlying nature of reality) that likely led to it being used as persons, but I digress. The bottom line is that there is a singular essence or being that is God. It is not a conglomeration of three beings, but a singular nature. That singular essence has three distinct persons both within it and as it. Think of a “person” (hypostasis) as a consciousness, but one that shares a singular underlying reality (ousia). I’m not sure that analogies are all that useful since we tend to think of things in physicalist terms, but there are two that I like, though I’m not sure they truly capture the essence of the statement. The first is a hydra, the three headed beast of Greek mythology. The heads are all independent with presumably their own minds and they are distinct from one another, but they are still the same being that acts with the same will. They are not fighting over which head gets to move the left foreleg, nor do they debate the efficacy of eating Hercules. Of course, comparing God to a monster is problematic, but it is what it is. The other analogy I like is that of a person. A person is a body, a mind and a soul (or if you’re a physicalist, we can say a body and a consciousness.) These are distinct things. My consciousness is not my body and vice versa. Yet we are certainly the same being. My body possesses its own will (Eat the Twinkies, senoy!) that my consciousness will sometimes act independently of (Put the Twinkie down, fatso!), but they are the same essence and being. We might be able to vaguely say “There are two persons in me, but I am the same being.” It’s a slightly problematic analogy because one could argue that consciousness is an emanation of the body, but a spirit does not necessarily have that problem. ---
**Author:** ![MeanJoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanjoe/32/5693_2.png) [@MeanJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanJoe)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/45 "2019-04-24T13:36:46Z")
> [@senoy](#): > > I would say progressive Christians as a general rule aren’t particularly interested in apologetics. They let atheists and fundamentalists worry about such things. Why is it necessary to come up with responses to hypothetical objections? The purpose of living in Christ is not to browbeat others via debate, what kind of faith can possibly come from being beaten in debate? As said before, we are a practical people. God gives meaning to life and provides a template to live a life outside of ourselves. If Heaven is a metaphor, then what of it? Our concern is how to better serve God in the here and now. If someone wants to conceive of God as a metaphor, does that bring them closer to God and make them a better servant of others and therefore God Himself? If so, then why would I be on their case? Again, it’s atheists and fundamentalists that are tied up in strict beliefs, why would progressives care? This isn’t to say that all beliefs are equal. If your beliefs are leading you to walk farther from the path that Christ has set for you, they need to be reevaluated. If you believe firmly in God, but that belief is causing you to hurt others and hurt God, then what good is your belief? “The devil believes and trembles,” no? **If you struggle with believing in God, but attempt to draw closer to Him and serve humanity, then your struggle is valuable and I would say God is pleased with the effort**. I want to just say thank you for posting this and so clearly explaining something that I struggle with regularly. From 7 until 18 I was raised in a fundamentalist church and school. Strict beliefs based upon a literal interpretation of the Bible. I have not really been involved in any denomination or religious activity since (I’m now 50) but for many years after high school struggled mightily with the version of Christianity I was taught/indoctrinated into vs. my personal feelings and observations about the world, faith, and God. Your post… it’s hard to explain… put into words things I’ve come to believe but struggled to resolve against how I was raised in those formative years. I bolded the last part because I think this is where I landed in my faith (or lack of faith) but reading it is so reaffirming. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/46 "2019-04-24T13:40:17Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > I’m familiar with the Trinity, but Mormonism teaches that there are three separate individuals. I can understand the Mormon concept because of the simplicity, but the Trinity seems less clear on an intuitive level. Is this just because I grew up believing something else and if I had grown up in a more mainstream sect then it would also seem intuitive, or is this a mystery and people don’t care so much? Sorry, growing up with the concept of the Trinity doesn’t help. It is explicitly defined as beyond human understanding. People don’t care as much now as they seem to have done back in the early church - Arianism vs. Athanasianism vs. Nestorianism vs. other doctrines I have forgotten about. I was mildly upset to discover that my understanding (such as it was) of the Trinity was officially condemned as heretical back in the seventh century AD. (It is [Modal Monarchianism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modalistic_Monarchianism)). But I was comforted by the fact that I couldn’t understand the difference between that, and the orthodox belief. The [Athanasian Creed](https://www.ccel.org/creeds/athanasian.creed.html) goes on and on about the Trinity, but it doesn’t help. The finite mind cannot comprehend the full nature of the Infinite. I get that part. Therefore, I (and most of my co-religionists, at least IME) don’t worry about it. In our better moments at least, we are focusing on what **senoy** has been talking about. > [@Mark 12:28-31](#): > > And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him, “Which commandment is the most important of all?” Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” After that, no one dared to ask Jesus any more questions. If you want a précis of Christianity, it is love God with all you have, and love your neighbor as you love yourself. Why? Because Jesus said so. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/47 "2019-04-24T13:45:12Z")
Some really religious fundamentalist Christians I’ve talked to believe that all one has to do to go to heaven is accept Jesus as a personal savior before they die. Yes, even Charles Manson and Timothy McVeigh could be in heaven right now, long as they accepted Jesus two seconds before they died. OTHO, someone whose biggest sin was taking pens home from work is going to hell for not accepting Jesus. One such rah-rah protests outside the local women’s health center, with a sign that says “Everything Hitler did was legal.” I told him he should stand outside the local synagogue with that sign. He also believes that people who don’t accept Jesus are “of the devil.” I guess that includes all Jews, Muslims and atheists. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/48 "2019-04-24T13:57:47Z")
IANAC, but I was raised in a churchgoing family of the Christian/Protestant/Methodist variety. Methodists aren’t much for the whole ephemeral mystical theological stuff. They’re on board with life after death, and jesus rose from the dead, but they’d much rather talk about the virtue of visiting people in prison today and how to be a good Christian in the parking lot. \*\*1. Where do souls/spirits come from? \*\* They don’t “come from” anywhere so much as they always were. No details though. **2. Where does Satan come from?** Assuming there IS an actual Satan (you won’t find Methodist consensus on this) (alternatives include that he is a metaphorical stand-in representing the absence of God, or represents the darkness which in turn simply means lack of understanding)… some would say God created Satan specifically _as_ Satan, some would say he represents one of the inevitable outcomes of creating entities with free will – that to varying degrees they’ll exercise it in ways antithetical to how you’d want them to, with Satan representing the extreme case of full-on adversarial opposition. **3. After a person died, what happens to them while waiting for the resurrection?** Methodists mostly think you go straight to heaven when you die. There’s no resurrection to wait for. No one talks about the Rapture or anything. **4. Does everyone get resurrected at the Second Coming? When are people judged?** See above. No one discusses a literal Second Coming, and everyone is judged individually when they die. When “second coming” is discussed at all, it’s usually in terms of a metaphor for a hypothetical time in which things on earth are done as they are in heaven. **5. What sort of people go to hell, and is it forever?** Methodists aren’t much for hell either. When hell is described, it’s usually a place you condemn _yourself_ to by turning away from God, not the Divine Penitentiary into which the judge of mankind gives you an eternal-life sentence from his throne. This may be somewhat dated; me and the church went separate ways when I reached adulthood. I’m under the vague impression that the Methodist church veered towards a more literal belief system than they displayed when I was in attendance. ---
**Author:** ![MeanJoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanjoe/32/5693_2.png) [@MeanJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanJoe)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/49 "2019-04-24T13:59:03Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Some really religious fundamentalist Christians I’ve talked to believe that all one has to do to go to heaven is accept Jesus as a personal savior before they die. Yes, even Charles Manson and Timothy McVeigh could be in heaven right now, long as they accepted Jesus two seconds before they died. > > OTHO, someone whose biggest sin was taking pens home from work is going to hell for not accepting Jesus. > > One such rah-rah protests outside the local women’s health center, with a sign that says “Everything Hitler did was legal.” I told him he should stand outside the local synagogue with that sign. He also believes that people who don’t accept Jesus are “of the devil.” I guess that includes all Jews, Muslims and atheists. These are the type of people that were a part of the church and school I was raised in that I mentioned in my earlier post. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/50 "2019-04-24T14:12:47Z")
Oh, and Catholicism does have the concept of “age of accountability”, below which a child is insufficiently aware of their actions to be accountable for sin. But while there are rough guidelines for when that age is, there’s no hard and fast line, and it’s understood that different children will probably reach that age at different times. And a child with sufficient understanding to make the argument that they’re below the line, is probably above the line. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/51 "2019-04-24T14:20:17Z")
More than probably, I’d say provenly 🙂 If you’re old enough to rules-lawyer, you can’t claim you didn’t understand the rule. ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/52 "2019-04-24T14:50:18Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > This may be somewhat dated; me and the church went separate ways when I reached adulthood. I’m under the vague impression that the Methodist church veered towards a more literal belief system than they displayed when I was in attendance. The church hasn’t changed. It is just big tent. There are very literal United Methodists and very non-literal ones. My mom’s church is practically Pentecostal and there are some that are one step away from atheist. United Methodists are generally live and let live. (The biggest change that we really see is that the church in the US is dying and the global church is starting to exert control and take it in a more fundamentalist direction. The probable outcome of this is that the United Methodist Church is going to split into a small American fundamentalist church allied with Africa and a larger moderate and liberal American church allied with Europe.) ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/53 "2019-04-24T14:56:04Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > 1. Where do souls/spirits come from? > > The Mormon belief is that there are things called “intelligences” which have existed from the beginning of time. God and a Heavenly Mother make spirits from that. All of us existed as spirits in the pre-existence and we needed to come down to Earth for receive our bodies. > > What is the mainstream Christian beliefs on where people’s spirits comes from. Does God create them? If so, when? > > God created everything, as I understand it soul is the individual life essence of a person while Spirit is the Spirit of God. This came from the breath of God into Adam, and passed down from the blood of the mother to the child (life is in the blood, life in in the breath). > > Soul is usually used in a unconnected state, Spirit in connected state. Soul and Spirit are become one through the process of accepting the Holy Spirit. However their are other spirits as well that one can join their soul with, such as demons. A soul unconnected to God at the time of death is ‘lost’ in many types of christianity. > > > [@](#): > > > > 1. Where does Satan come from? > > > > The Mormon belief is that Satan is one of the children of God, e.g., one of our spirit brothers, just as Jesus is also a spiritual brother. Satan went bad and took one third of the spirits with him. Those of us who have come to the Earth as humans are among those who either fought on God’s side or were neutral. > > Sort of the same, Satan in Job is put in the category with the ‘son’s of God’ in Job, which seems to refer to the arch angels. Satan went bad, wanting to be God, and didn’t like man because of the glory God gives to man. > > > [@](#): > > > > 1. After a person died, what happens to them while waiting for the resurrection? > > > > The Mormon belief is that there is are two places for the spirits to go while waiting for the resurrection. Paradise where the baptized members in good standing go and spirit prison for everyone else. > > > > Does a person’s soul wait with the body? Go someplace? Sleep? Be conscious? > > For the believer there seems to be 2 answers given by Paul, some will be taken into heaven at the point of death, and no suffer death, to be with the Lord, some others fall asleep, but are awake enough to ask questions of the Lord and get answers (like how much longer will we sleep). > > > [@](#): > > > > 1. Does everyone get resurrected at the Second Coming? When are people judged? > > > > The Mormon belief is that the good Mormons do, and then temple work (where dead people can become Mormons) is required for other people to be resurrected. > > > > The Second Coming ushers in a Millennium and by the end of the 1,000 years all people will have been resurrected. > > According to Revelation Death and Hates will release their captives and everyone will be judged. In that judgement the heart is judged, not the acts themselves. Does this person love the Lord (if so good works will come out of it, but God is the one to make those actions good, because God is living in this person and their acts, which are flesh and God together needs a father God to correct the errors of the flesh). In other words the acts themselves can not be used to determine goodness of the heart. > > > [@](#): > > > > 1. What sort of people go to hell, and is it forever? > > > > We were taught that other churches believe that people who were not baptized Christian can’t go to Heaven. > > Different denominations teach different things (what sort of people and for how long, and what is Hell). Jesus was baptized and believed (which we are told is all that is required for salvation), but Jesus still had to spend time in Hell. So Jesus is one of the sort of person who went to Hell. Jesus raised people from the dead and gave that power to us, and took the keys of death. It seems like it’s not a place any one is stuck in anymore, with Jesus holding the keys and Jesus’ willingness to forgive. > > How universal is (or was) that belief? Once in hell, are you there forever? The Mormon belief is that there are four places you can wind up. The celestial kingdom, the terrestrial kingdom and the telestial kingdom, ranked from best to worst. Those within the highest degree in the celestial kingdom go on the become gods and goddesses themselves, which is definitely not mainstream. Then there is “outer darkness” where Satan, his followers from the preexistence and a certain number of people will go. Other questions may follow. [/QUOTE] Answered above about Hell, but another ‘bad’ place, ‘outside into the darkness’ or ‘outer darkness’ is a bit worse, basically nothingness, but pain and conscientious coldness and loneliness. Hell is a vacation compared to that. As for the good places, the New Earth, or for some the heavens. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/54 "2019-04-24T15:08:34Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > … > 2. Where does Satan come from? > > … > > 1. After a person died, what happens to them while waiting for the resurrection? > > … > > … > > 1. What sort of people go to hell, and is it forever? > > … Satan is a Fallen Angel. Or maybe just the Adversary, whose job is literally the devil’s Advocate, He may be doing a job for God. Mostly straight to the afterlife. Hell has dozens of answers. Many view it as a place where you realize that\* your \*actions have sent you there. You realize that YOU sent yourself there, not God. You are turned from the Grace of God, that is your punishment. Some sects believe that it isn’t forever, it is until you _truly_ realize and repent. Any other punishment is beside the point. Some say that only a few truly evil people, people who believe that their evil actions were justified and thus will never repent are the only ones who are forever. Hitler, eg. So Hell is a place of Purgatory also. Virtuous Pagans are not punished. Some OT and NT writings indicate that some will burn- it appears in the OT that “Kings” who lead others into wrongdoing are singled out for special fire & brimstone punishment. Hitler, eg. Some sects think that only those who accept Jesus go to Heaven, others think that the Jews, ect either go to Heaven or perhaps their heaven. Much variation on hell. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/55 "2019-04-24T15:55:54Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Some really religious fundamentalist Christians I’ve talked to believe that all one has to do to go to heaven is accept Jesus as a personal savior before they die. Yes, even Charles Manson and Timothy McVeigh could be in heaven right now, long as they accepted Jesus two seconds before they died. Yes, Deathbed Conversions are [a](https://jamesbradfordpate.wordpress.com/2015/03/13/gods-not-dead-2-joshs-risk-and-professor-radissons-conversion/) [big](https://crossexamined.org/are-deathbed-conversions-fair/) [thing](https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-fantasy-of-the-deathbed-conversion) for Evangelicals. Especially in spreading lies about one of their big enemies converting just before death. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2019, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/56 "2019-04-24T15:58:50Z")
> [@senoy](#): > > The probable outcome of this is that the United Methodist Church is going to split into a small American fundamentalist church allied with Africa and a larger moderate and liberal American church allied with Europe.) Someone needs to call dibs on the name Somewhat Less United Methodist Church. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/57 "2019-04-25T00:16:16Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > **TokyoBayer** , now you know why I found Christianity the hardest religion to teach in high school world religions units\*. About 20% of my students were LDS, and the rest were mostly split up between various Christian denominations. Trying to find common ground without offending or contradicting any of the denominations was tougher than you might think–until reading this thread, that is. For instance, **Shodan** mentioned disbelief in the Holy Spirit as grounds for damnation, but neither the LDS nor Jehovah’s Witnesses are trinitarians. > > And in fact, not all Christian denominations consider all other Christian denominations to _be_ Christian, which can make discussions even trickier. I’m sure that it can be difficult. It’s much easier to teach something where people have no vested interests. I remember back when I was a young Mormon and more interested in proving we were right rather than learning the specifics of what was different. > [@senoy](#): > > Tokyo. Since you’re an ex-Mormon, we can be frank. (If you are Mormon, then you may stop reading here. My intent is to not to insult your beliefs, but simply to have a frank discussion.) The difference between Mormonism and the rest of Christianity is that the rest of us don’t believe that God has a divine mouthpiece that cannot be questioned. As such, answers about the nature of divinity must subject themselves to scrutiny and frequently fundamental disagreement. If Russ Nelson woke up tomorrow and communicated that God said the color red was a sinful color and must not be worn, then so mote it be. If the leaders of any other denomination tried that, they’d be laughed off the dais (except Catholics who would likely form a political bloc to stem the abuse of power.) As such, it’s very easy for Mormonism to provide the answers. It just says them and if those answers prove unpopular, God has a tendency to change his mind when necessary. Other denominations change as well, but largely they admit that they don’t have all the answers and sometimes they’re just wrong about things. I am an ex-Mormon and an atheist but I have absolutely zero interest in debating the validity of beliefs, rather, I would like to know the differences. As someone who grew up with one set of extreme beliefs, I am simply curious as to what do other Christian sects believe. My experience with religion is so different, and I realized that other Christians just don’t have the same set of beliefs. I sincerely hope to keep this well within the GQ scope and not get into GD. Your point about Mormons is spot on. Recently, the LDS church reversed a policy concerning the children of LGBT couples, where they had not been permitted to be baptized. The policy is only a couple of years old, but both the initial policy banning the baptism and the recent reversal are both seen to be inspired by God, most active Mormons do not see this as contradictory, and there isn’t any further explanation for the policy reversal. Another is the recent declaration that the term “Mormon” in not only undesired but also a tool of the Devil, yet the Mormon church itself was using that term, even promoting on television a few years back. There is a lot of pressure within the Mormon church to unquestioningly follow the prophet’s guidance and to not express doubts publicly or privately. I want to walk back my earlier statement about Mormonism having lot of answers. It has the answers to many of the burning questions which were the subjects of debates around the time it was founded, but many subsequent questions are left unanswered. Consequently, while Mormonism can answer the exact age of accountability, it doesn’t follow up on the claim of a Heavenly Mother. Mormon doctrine is that there is one (or possibly more) but nothing further is known. > [@](#): > > To get to the Trinity, it’s important to note that while Joseph Smith was likely well-read for the time, he was in essence a frontier conman. As such, his theology and thus the theology of the LDS church is largely what you would expect a frontier conman to come up with. I’ve got to go to work now, but I’ll try to follow up more later. Smith’s theology concerning the Godhood evolved considerably during his life. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/58 "2019-04-25T02:25:45Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > [John Shelby Spong](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Shelby_Spong) _might_ be an example of an “atheist Christian”—I’m not sure. [Gretta Vosper](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gretta_Vosper), of the United Church of Canada, is an example of an “atheist Christian.” And I \*am \*sure. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/59 "2019-04-25T06:42:11Z")
The Credo, or fundamental statement of Christian belief, has hardly been mentioned. It is a brief statement of the basic essentials of Christian belief. It originated in the 3rd century, a version was agreed at the Council of Nicaea, and amended later in the 4th century. Different versions with subtle variations (much argued over) are still used by many Christian denominations. The Catholic version, used for over 1500 years: [Text](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credo#Text) [Best musical setting](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4uTMzk-7XI) ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2019, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932/60 "2019-04-25T12:10:25Z")
The [Apostles’ Creed](https://www.catholic.org/prayers/prayer.php?p=220) is also used by the RCC and others. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christianity-101-questions-from-an-ex-mormon/832932.md?page=4)