# Christians: Why does an eternal God care about temporal morality? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 5, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427 "2009-05-05T15:37:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/21 "2009-05-06T13:10:06Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Although the wording is vastly different, your take is, I believe, in tune with mine. I define goodness as that which edifies, and love as that which facilitates goodness. Thus, God is love — the perfect facilitator of goodness. The opposite of love, then, is not hate. Hate is only emotion, like erotic “love”. Rather, the opposite of love is sin, because I define sin as that which obstructs goodness. Love is whatever facilitates goodness. Sin is whatever obstructs it. When you have been good to someone, you have loved them. You have edified them. You have built them up. You have left them feeling better about themselves than they did before you showed up. To me, that’s love. And I sin too much. > > I don’t see love and sin as most Xians do. It isn’t a certain deed or act. If, for example, two men are in love, and they pleasure one another sexually, and edify one another with tenderness and kindness, then there is no way in hell that they are sinning. They are doing good. They are practicing love. I believe we discovered this in a past thread. I see certain states of consciousness as consistently positive {facilitating goodness} while others are consistently negative. In my own terms the positive are those things that promote and recognize the unity of mankind and creation. Kindness, patience, consideration, and others under the umbrella of love. More than that it’s a recognition of reality. We _are_ connected and ultimately harm ourselves when we live as if we aren’t. Another essential part is truthfulness. Sometimes the truth is painful and in the moment it may not seem to be kind, but IMO truth tempered with compassion is consistently positive. In my job that means occasionally people get fired after several warnings. There’s these > [@](#): > > John 16:13 > But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. > > John 8:32 > Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." and other passages about nothing remaining hidden and everything will be revealed. IMO these relate to looking within. How can we be truly moral unless we are consciously aware of what choices we are making and why? Concerning your mention of homosexuality. I have an old friend who belongs to a conservative church that condemns homosexuality as a sin. We were talking one day about God looking into our hearts to judge our true intent and how different that can be from outward appearances. > [@](#): > > John 4:24 > God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth." My question was; If we accept that as true, then how can any physical act be a sin in and of itself? But I digress. To put it another way. IMHO morality relates to states of consciousness that reflect reality or deny it. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/22 "2009-05-06T13:18:18Z")
Cosmosdan, I hope that we can meet one day, and discuss these matters over a game of chess. Or while feeding the koi and watching the cardinals bathe. Or while sitting on the porch rockers or swing. Or while walking around. It is good to have a soulmate. Are you anywhere near the Southern US? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/23 "2009-05-06T13:25:11Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Cosmosdan, I hope that we can meet one day, and discuss these matters over a game of chess. Or while feeding the koi and watching the cardinals bathe. Or while sitting on the porch rockers or swing. Or while walking around. It is good to have a soulmate. Are you anywhere near the Southern US? Originally from the sturdy northeast woods of Maine I now reside in Nashville TN. I don’t think you’d find lots of agreement from others as well on the principles. Sometimes it’s just the terminology that confuses people but with a little communication they discover they’re in agreement. At least that’s been my experience. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/24 "2009-05-06T14:00:43Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > It is my understanding that only in this world does god allow mortals to choose sin or virtue. After death, you cannot repent. This implies you no longer have free will in the afterlife. I was under the impression that the unrighteous do indeed spend all eternity wailing, teeth gnashing, and otherwise expressing their agony of repentence. The thing is, it’s too late for it to do any good. God is no longer listening. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/25 "2009-05-06T15:06:18Z")
To me, discussion of Heaven or Hell and the eternal fate of souls is similar to counting the angels dancing on a pin head. It’s quibbling over details that are unimportant. I believe we should focus on doing God’s will in the here and now. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/26 "2009-05-06T17:37:21Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > I was under the impression that the unrighteous do indeed spend all eternity wailing, teeth gnashing, and otherwise expressing their agony of repentence. I would have thought the lake of fire would occupy their entire attention. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/27 "2009-05-06T17:48:55Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I would have thought the lake of fire would occupy their entire attention. Well, don’t you think they’re screaming “Oh God! It burns!” ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/28 "2009-05-06T19:19:51Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > How can 70, 80, even 120 years of righteous living come close to earning a bilion times that amount of bliss? Contrariwise, how can a mortal lifespan of debauchery and villainy merit an infinite amount of suffering n Hell? By analogy, consider how the decision to graduate from high school or drop out has implications for the entire rest of one’s earthly life. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427/29 "2009-05-06T21:28:49Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I would have thought the lake of fire would occupy their entire attention. Except on Tuesday. That’s Canasta night. Beezelbub cheats. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christians-why-does-an-eternal-god-care-about-temporal-morality/495427.md?page=1)