# Christmas a National Holiday? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 15, 2019, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902 "2019-12-15T19:59:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/81 "2019-12-19T04:19:41Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > And yet to me they are both religious, I don’t see any difference. So where do we go from here? Hanukkah Harry?😛 ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/82 "2019-12-19T17:03:30Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I don’t see anyone saying that it _should be your holiday too_. That again is something different from “there is also a secular Christmas.” I feel the same as \*\*Joeu \*\*and \*\*Telemark \*\*here. No, nobody literally says “it should be your holiday, too,” but when I hear nothing but Christmas music at (to give two recent examples) the dentist’s and the gym, it’s like they’re saying “everyone loves this music, and you should, too.” Even though it’s all secular music – no hymns, etc. – it still feels oppressive. And just to get this off my chest – that John Lennon Christmas song is the shittiest thing he ever did. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/83 "2019-12-19T17:11:19Z")
Since some who don’t “celebrate” Christmas aren’t fond of everything being closed (me), maybe we should go to the places that are open and spend a lot to encourage others to open on chirstmas. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/84 "2019-12-19T18:53:50Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > I feel the same as \*\*Joeu \*\*and \*\*Telemark \*\*here. No, nobody literally says “it should be your holiday, too,” but when I hear nothing but Christmas music at (to give two recent examples) the dentist’s and the gym, it’s like they’re saying “everyone loves this music, and you should, too.” They’re saying the opposite. Everyone hates the music they play in the gym and the dentist’s office. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/85 "2019-12-19T19:30:08Z")
My guess is, Christmas is a holiday because it’s not always on a Sunday, whereas, say, Easter is not a holiday because it is, and back when decisions like this were made, all Sundays were pretty much de facto holidays. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/86 "2019-12-19T20:16:56Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > They’re saying the opposite. Everyone hates the music they play in the gym and the dentist’s office. Really? Someone tell the dental assistant who was humming along with “Jingle Bell Rock” while she was cleaning my teeth. #hellisreal ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/87 "2019-12-19T20:52:50Z")
Well, it’s a major religious holiday for the religion that has by far the most adherents in the US, even if some of them are, like me (in the UK) culturally Christian rather than actually being strong believers. Here in London some Muslims do celebrate Christmas Day to an extent. Present giving is the norm among the kids I taught, for example. Muslim kids joined in with the nativity at my daughter’s primary school (it would have impossible to stage one if they hadn’t), and their parents came to watch same as anyone else. Some people might have a tree or if not that then pretty lights. Jesus is a prophet in Islam so it’s not really that weird, and Christmas is relatively secular for the most part here. 1856 doesn’t strike me as relatively recent for a public holiday, because public holidays where the government mandates a day off work, rather than the church or common custom deeming it so for their adherents, are fairly recent. There weren’t any mandated public holidays (which we call bank holidays) in the UK until 1871. Good Friday and Christmas Day were already holidays by custom but the other holidays were religious (hence the name), and didn’t give workers any official right to time off work. > [@septimus](#): > > As others point out, in the religion which considers Easter Sunday significant, it is already a day off because it is … Sunday! (You could argue that the Resurrection is celebrated 52 times a year!) Many businesses gave a half-day off on the Friday preceding Easter. > > What holidays are celebrated by the most countries? New Years (also a stand-in for the winter solstice?) is #1, and Christmas #2, I think. If fixed solar-calendar dates are stipulated then Islamic (lunar-calendar) holidays and the Tet New Year are out, and the First of May (Labor Day) is surely #3. > > But which date is #4 for most-countries holiday? I think the main possibilities are November 1, November 11, December 26, and December 31. What’s the significance of November 1st? All Saints’ Day? I don’t think that’s ever moved beyond being a purely religious festival. I’d definitely agree about May Day. Clicking randomly on the countries in this list: [List of holidays by country - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_holidays_by_country) almost all of the big countries except Japan and Saudi Arabia have May 1st as a national holiday. It’s a holiday in all of Europe, all the former states of the Soviet Union and almost all of the former British, Spanish, French and Portuguese colonies (I’ve found one exception. Tuvalu, but I haven’t checked all the very small countries). None of the other fixed dates seem to me to be common enough to merit being listed as fourth - December 26th is common in Europe but not so much elsewhere, and December 31st and 11th are not public holidays in almost every country on that list. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2019, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/88 "2019-12-19T21:00:17Z")
May 1 is not Labour Day nor a holiday in Canada and the US. Labour Day is the first Monday n September. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/89 "2019-12-20T01:01:28Z")
The true time-honored spirit of Anglo-American Christmas is a lady named Ethyl, you probably know her well. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/90 "2019-12-20T03:30:27Z")
Gppgle shows All Saints Day (November 1) as a public holiday this year in Spain, Italy, Chile, Belgium, Austria, Hungary — and those are just a few I checked. El Salvador and Brazil celebrate it November 2 (All Souls). > [@septimus](#): > > What holidays are celebrated by the most countries? … the First of May (Labor Day) is surely #3. > > But which date is #4 for most-countries holiday? I think the main possibilities are November 1, November 11, December 26, and December 31. > [@SciFiSam](#): > > May 1st [is] a holiday in all of Europe, all the former states of the Soviet Union and almost all of the former British, Spanish, French and Portuguese colonies (I’ve found one exception. Tuvalu, but I haven’t checked all the very small countries). Tuvalu … _and the United States_ Ninja’ed by **Northern Piper** , but … > [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > May 1 is not Labour Day nor a holiday in Canada and the US. Labour Day is the first Monday n September. Nitpick: The U.S. doesn’t have a Labour Day at all. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/91 "2019-12-20T04:00:15Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Gppgle shows All Saints Day (November 1) as a public holiday this year in Spain, Italy, Chile, Belgium, Austria, Hungary — and those are just a few I checked. El Salvador and Brazil celebrate it November 2 (All Souls). > > Tuvalu … _and the United States_ > > Ninja’ed by **Northern Piper** , but … > > Nitpick: The U.S. doesn’t have a Labour Day at all. Correct, May Day is not a holiday in the USA, well any more than say Arbor day. > **[Public holidays in the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_holidays_in_the_United_States#Holidays_most_commonly_celebrated)** > > In the United States, public holidays are set by federal, state, and local governments and are often observed by closing government offices or giving government employees paid time off. The federal government does not require any private business to close or offer paid time off, as is the case for most state local governments, so employers determine which holidays to observe. > Several federal holidays are widely observed by private businesses with paid time off. These include New Year's Day, ... However, Labor day _is_ a holiday, Banks closed usually, and people given the day off. Unless you are being pedantic and rude by saying “Labour” isnt a correct spelling. But I am sure you’re not doing that, as that would be… ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/92 "2019-12-20T04:09:47Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Ninja’ed by **Northern Piper** , but … > > Nitpick: The U.S. doesn’t have a Labour Day at all. Then how do Americans know when to stop wearing white?!? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/93 "2019-12-20T07:21:21Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > The true time-honored spirit of Anglo-American Christmas is a lady named Ethyl, you probably know her well. Uh, what? ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/94 "2019-12-20T15:51:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > They’re saying the opposite. Everyone hates the music they play in the gym and the dentist’s office. > [@Akaj](#): > > Really? Someone tell the dental assistant who was humming along with “Jingle Bell Rock” while she was cleaning my teeth. #hellisreal Not really a counter-example - some of the strongest earworms are songs people hate. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2019, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/95 "2019-12-20T15:55:40Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > And just to get this off my chest – that John Lennon Christmas song is the shittiest thing he ever did. Dude, no! That was the best Christmas song.😛 ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2019, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/96 "2019-12-21T01:42:51Z")
Ethyl with a y, that’s a hint, you can guess her last name, it starts with an A. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2019, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/97 "2019-12-21T01:45:46Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > And just to get this off my chest – that John Lennon Christmas song is the shittiest thing he ever did. No, that was “Imagine”. The Christmas song is certainly a contender, I concede. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2019, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/98 "2019-12-21T02:08:41Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > … > But I’m just a grinch who’s had it up to here with Christmas crap everywhere, and still another week to go. Feel free to ignore my ranting. Six weeks of _Marshmallow World_ and _Walking in a Winter Wonderland_ will do that to you. I feel ya, brother… ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2019, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/99 "2019-12-21T02:13:45Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Around here, major grocery stores are typically open until early afternoon – 2 p.m. or thereabouts. Neither is Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2019, 7:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902/100 "2019-12-21T07:22:08Z")
My hunch is that if a plurality of our country’s merchants made half of the money they made all year in April because of the Feast of St. Walpurgis, that would be a federal holiday, too. In this season of our Lord and Savior, the Benjamins matter too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/christmas-a-national-holiday/844902.md?page=6)