# Chronos clarification please **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [September 26, 2021, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378 "2021-09-26T16:33:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/21 "2021-09-26T17:28:48Z")
Nevermind. It appears the person in question is exile Ricard Foyé. > **[Is 'Survivor' castaway Ricard Foyé single? Meet his husband and two kids](https://www.sportskeeda.com/pop-culture/is-survivor-castaway-ricard-foye-single-meet-husband-two-kids)** > > Survivor season 41 officially returned to air on Wednesday with a two-hour premiere episode. > “Andy [Ricard’s husband] focused on putting his physical comfort behind his and my desire for our family to grow and carried our children as a **transgender man**.” Presuming @Crane knew the contestent’s husband identified as a transgender man (I don’t know if this would be revealed on the show), it would be textbook misgendering to refer to him as a “male impersonator”. ~Max (ninja’d) ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/22 "2021-09-26T17:31:24Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Denying that a man is a man because of what genitalia he is born with is not conduct allowed on this board per the rules. Thanks for the clarification. It’s an absurdity we have to accept. OK, I can live with that. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/23 "2021-09-26T17:39:14Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > Thanks for the clarification. It’s an absurdity we have to accept. OK, I can live with that. You are entitled to your opinion on the matter of course, and if you feel that it’s an absurdity and need to pretend to go along with it in order to follow the board rules then I personally (as a non-moderator) don’t see the harm in that. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/24 "2021-09-26T17:51:43Z")
Changes in culture and society can be very difficult for some to accept. No doubt that many Americans see the existence of gay marriage, and even interracial marriage, as a similar “absurdity”. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/25 "2021-09-26T18:12:49Z")
I owned and operated an upscale B&B for 10 years. During that time we had numerous same gender couples. The situation was matter of fact and did not arouse comment. Under consideration above is the linguistics appropriate to a pregnant female filling the traditional role of male husband. That is properly described as a female impersonating a male role. The rules of the board are necessary for orderly discourse. That is also proper and acceptable. But the factual basis of a female becoming male simply by desire is a Trumpian absurdity. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/26 "2021-09-26T18:15:23Z")
If you find yourself in a hole… ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/27 "2021-09-26T18:18:32Z")
How so? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/28 "2021-09-26T18:19:46Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > I owned and operated an upscale B&B for 10 years. During that time we had numerous same gender couples. The situation was matter of fact and did not arouse comment. > > Under consideration above is the linguistics appropriate to a pregnant female filling the traditional role of male husband. That is properly described as a female impersonating a male role. The rules of the board are necessary for orderly discourse. That is also proper and acceptable. But the factual basis of a female becoming male simply by desire is a Trumpian absurdity. Your mixing biology and society/culture. Biologically, this transgender man might be female. But “husband” has nothing to do with biology, only society and culture. There’s no such thing as “husband” outside of human society and human culture. Societally, and culturally, this person is a man, and a husband. Biology is irrelevant to this person’s identity in terms of society and culture. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/29 "2021-09-26T18:21:18Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > to a pregnant female filling the traditional role of male husband. You seem highly hung up on the “pregnant” aspect. Do you commonly refer to every transgender man as a “male impersonator” and transwomen as “female impersonators”? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/30 "2021-09-26T18:21:52Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > But the factual basis of a female becoming male simply by desire is a Trumpian absurdity. There isn’t a female becoming “male”, there is a female becoming “a man”. Progressive modern America is abandoning the definitions of man=adult male human and woman=adult female human, therefore allowing there to be male women and female men. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/31 "2021-09-26T18:24:42Z")
This may indeed be the societal trend. In that case the language needs to catch up. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/32 "2021-09-26T18:25:06Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > > [@Atamasama](#): > > > > Denying that a man is a man because of what genitalia he is born with is not conduct allowed on this board per the rules. > > Thanks for the clarification. It’s an absurdity we have to accept. OK, I can live with that. It’s not an absurdity, though. It’s scientifically accurate, based on studies of both sex and gender. Both are a spectrum, and are not binary. And they may not match. The rigid definitions of male and female don’t hold up in real life. The person in question may have been born into a body with XX-chromosomes, but that does not make him female. Clearly his brain was male, or he wouldn’t identify as male. Other parts may also have been male. He has since transitioned, meaning he has changed some of his sex. Unfortunately, however, there is no way currently to change all aspects of one’s sex. One thing he can’t do is get testes or make sperm. So it’s not uncommon for trans men to choose to give birth in order to have a biological son or daughter. In particular, if you are married to a woman without a uterus, it can make sense to use your own. The one thing he’s not doing is an impression of a man. he’s not some crossdresser or drag performer. He’s committed to the gender role of a man, and he’s committed to altering his biological makeup to be more male. And that accusation, that he’s just pretending, has historically been used for oppression. Trans people often face violence and discrimination. So such is just generally not accepted in society anymore, and we got a rule against it. No more misgendering. It’s no different than not being able to say certain things about black people or gay people. It’s not that the thing you said is true, and we want to forbid it. It’s that it’s false and hurts people to say. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/33 "2021-09-26T18:26:33Z")
It’s not just a trend, it’s done. That doesn’t mean that these are the _only_ definitions that people use, but these are definitely definitions used by trans people and trans allies. These are valid usages of these words and phrases. This board has, rightfully IMO, decided to be on the “trans ally” side in terms of this particular question of language use. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/34 "2021-09-26T18:27:59Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > Do you commonly refer to every transgender man as a “male impersonator” and transwomen as “female impersonators”? I have yet to see a clear definition of trans. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/35 "2021-09-26T18:30:55Z")
I linked to where you asked the question 2 years ago. Would you like a direct link to the answer as well (it’s two posts later)? ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/36 "2021-09-26T18:34:41Z")
That doesn’t really answer the question. Do you believe a trans man is pretending to be a man, the way someone pretending to be a cop is impersonating a police officer? ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/37 "2021-09-26T18:37:47Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > allowing there to be male women and female men Thanks - that’s an interesting concept. Makes your wedding night kinda like Christmas morning. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/38 "2021-09-26T18:41:27Z")
That was a good warning. Well done, **Chronos**! ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/39 "2021-09-26T18:42:33Z")
Thanks - followed the link and the answer is: “someone who identifies as a gender other than what they were assigned at birth”. That is clearly role playing - impersonation. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2021, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378/40 "2021-09-26T18:44:25Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > This board has, rightfully IMO, decided to be on the “trans ally” side in terms of this particular question of language use. I believe that is the point [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-clarification-please/951378.md?page=3)