# Chronos, this is the wrong call **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [August 8, 2021, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251 "2021-08-08T20:41:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/41 "2021-08-09T11:55:05Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > These phrasings are commonly used interchangeably. It is universally understood that if I use the second phrase, I am speaking from my own experience. We have all read these ways of critiguing entertainment being used to describe the same things; it’s so commonplace as to be unnoticeable. I disagree. The second is far stronger, and contains a sneer at anyone who DOES enjoy the movie. Like, if you cook me dinner and I don’t take the mushrooms because “I’m not a fan of mushrooms”, it’s very different than if I tell you “no, those are inedible”. “Unwatchable” is much, much stronger than “dislike” or “don’t watch”. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/42 "2021-08-09T11:59:32Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > The second is far stronger, and contains a sneer at anyone who DOES enjoy the movie. I’ve read five hundred movie reviews calling a movie “unwatchable.” I have never thought it was a sneer at the audience; it’s a sneer at the movie. _Context matters here_. Merely saying “X is unwatchable” is not itself evidence of insult or trolling. I honestly believe “Transformers” is unwatchable garbage and will say so, but in no way is that a shot at people who enjoy those films. I could certainly place that comment in a context whereby I’m using it as part of an insult of the audience but by itself, it’s very common in English to use it as a simple way of expressing the belief that the entertainment is of low quality. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/43 "2021-08-09T12:04:02Z")
You’ve said it yourself: it means you think the material is of low quality, not just that you don’t like it. It’s not exactly the same as “I don’t like that”. Are there fills you dislike that you’d never call “unwatchable”? Saying “women’s sports are unwatchable” is saying they are all of low quality, not just that he doesn’t like them. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/44 "2021-08-09T12:07:58Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Saying “women’s sports are unwatchable” is saying they are all of low quality, not just that he doesn’t like them. And if that’s not a sneer at people who do enjoy watching, I don’t know what is. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Librarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_librarian/32/402_2.png) [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/45 "2021-08-09T12:14:20Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I do not believe there is. > > “I didn’t like watching The Suicide Squad.” > “The Suicide Squad is unwatchable.” compare “I don’t like pineapple on my pizza” to “rocks are inedible” Are those statements equivalent or do words mean shit? ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/46 "2021-08-09T12:21:58Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I do not believe there is. > > “I didn’t like watching The Suicide Squad.” > “The Suicide Squad is unwatchable.” > > These phrasings are commonly used interchangeably. It is universally understood that if I use the second phrase, I am speaking from my own experience. We have all read these ways of critiguing entertainment being used to describe the same things; it’s so commonplace as to be unnoticeable. Almost nothing is universally understood; and to say the phrasing used is unnoticeable in a thread full of people who have noticed it strikes me, to say the least, as very odd. Multiple people in this thread have had no difficulty whatsoever understanding the difference between ‘I don’t want to watch this’ and ‘This is unwatchable.’ The first is a statement about personal preference. The second is a statement that whatever’s being referred to isn’t worth watching by anybody. > [@RickJay](#): > > I’ve read five hundred movie reviews calling a movie “unwatchable.” I have never thought it was a sneer at the audience; it’s a sneer at the movie. Exactly: it’s a sneer at what’s being referred to. And this was a sneer at women playing any sports. I don’t like opera. I have seen very high quality opera, and it inspired in me personally only a desire to giggle (which is the same reaction I personally have, though for different reasons, to football (in the USA sense of the term.)) That’s an entirely different statement than saying that opera (or football) is unwatchable; or that it’s silly. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/47 "2021-08-09T12:40:38Z")
On a whim, I googled NBA attendance compared to WNBA attendance, and found this: “To support this quote, when looking at other statistics from the WSN, they list ticket price for the NBA ($89 USD) compared to the WNBA ($17.42 USD), average viewership for the NBA (2019 NBA Finals 15.14 million) compared to the WNBA (In 2018: 231,000 viewers).” I found very little on the WNHL, but their biggest game attendance ever was 6,000 people. Apparently, a LOT of people feel the same way as the OP about women’s sports compared to men’s sports. Are they all hateful misogynists, or do most of them simply feel it isn’t as good a product? As a woman, I’m not offended at all by that opinion if it is supported with factual reasons and not hate speech. Athletics are primarily a physical endeavor and, let’s face it, men are bigger, stronger, faster, etc, then women. If you like NBA “showtime”, the WNBA is going to leave you with a blah feeling for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/48 "2021-08-09T12:41:06Z")
Another vote in favor of the premise that “unwatchable” is a much stronger criticism than “I don’t like it” for its pretense at an objective standard of good or bad. In the context of athletic competition, it’s synonymous with “worthless.” ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/49 "2021-08-09T12:58:07Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Apparently, a LOT of people feel the same way as the OP about women’s sports compared to men’s sports. Are they all hateful misogynists, or do most of them simply feel it isn’t as good a product? There are a metric shit-ton of things that I don’t watch, the vast majority of which I would never call unwatchable. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/50 "2021-08-09T13:01:06Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Context matters here In many respects, right? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/51 "2021-08-09T13:02:12Z")
Misogyny. Straight up. Clear, precise and unsurprising from this poster. Either the board is serious about addressing misogyny, or it’s not. It doesn’t get a lot clearer than this example, in my humble opinion. To realize it’s taken a very lengthy discussion, (over how long now?), reaching no conclusion, just more waffling, is beyond dispiriting to the women who stuck around and believed we were making slow progress. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/52 "2021-08-09T13:07:26Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > …average viewership for the NBA (2019 NBA Finals 15.14 million) compared to the WNBA (In 2018: 231,000 viewers) There is absolutely a disparity in viewership between the leagues, for all sorts of reasons (although unwatchability isn’t one of them), but why would you compare the finals viewership of one league with the regular season viewership of another? I think you need better sources than WSN. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/53 "2021-08-09T13:10:56Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Apparently, a LOT of people feel the same way as the OP about women’s sports compared to men’s sports. Are they all hateful misogynists, or do most of them simply feel it isn’t as good a product? I’m not sure what you’re expecting here: “Obviously society as a whole is unencumbered by any sort of sexist impulses, especially regarding women in sports, so something else must be the cause of this disparity. Any suggestion that the majority of Americans have any gender bias is ludicrous!” Because I ain’t gonna say that. An appeal to the masses that relies on the masses being free of sexist biases isn’t a very persuasive appeal. ---
**Author:** ![Hellestal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3ab097/32.png) [@Hellestal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hellestal)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/54 "2021-08-09T13:12:58Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I’m not sure what you’re expecting here: “Obviously society as a whole is unencumbered by any sort of sexist impulses, especially regarding women in sports, so something else must be the cause of this disparity. Any suggestion that the majority of Americans have any gender bias is ludicrous!” > > Because I ain’t gonna say that. That isn’t remotely close to what @Jasmine said either. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/55 "2021-08-09T13:17:18Z")
If they prefer men’s sports, that’s not necessarily misogynistic. But asserting that ALL women’s sports are “unwatchable” is very different, and considering the poster’s history, pretty obvious misogyny. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/56 "2021-08-09T13:18:25Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Athletics are primarily a physical endeavor and, let’s face it, men are bigger, stronger, faster, etc, then women. Horses are bigger, stronger, and faster than either; so are cars; so are airplanes; but we don’t say that this makes human racers “unwatchable.” Machinery could put a ball through a basket or across a line faster and more consistently than any human. No weightlifter can match an ordinary forklift, or a gorilla. It’s not about speed or strength in the abstract. It’s about what can be done within the limitations of human bodies. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/57 "2021-08-09T13:18:41Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Either the board is serious about addressing misogyny, or it’s not. > It doesn’t get a lot clearer than this example, in my humble opinion. It’s astonishing and depressing that this even requires a discussion. It’s open and shut. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/58 "2021-08-09T13:21:29Z")
> [@Hellestal](#): > > That isn’t remotely close to what @Jasmine said either. You’re correct, but there’s a massive excluded middle in her implication, and her stats aren’t really relevant. The only way what she wrote is relevant is if she’s expecting us to say something other than anti-women sexism (aka misogyny) is behind the stat disparities she lists. If she’s not going for that conclusion, it has nothing to do with this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Kimera757](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kimera757/32/3765_2.png) [@Kimera757](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimera757)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/60 "2021-08-09T13:27:22Z")
I don’t understand why the thread wasn’t locked until a decision gets made. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2021, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251/61 "2021-08-09T13:28:35Z")
My unsolicited two cents: the post in the OP is not in itself particularly worthy of moderation by its lonesome. OTOH, there’s also the comment about women’s basketball already mentioned as well as the recent thread on Naomi Osaka and potshots against Megan Rapinoe and Gwen Berry. I don’t know if any of that is breaking board rules but it’s certainly starting to look like a trend. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/chronos-this-is-the-wrong-call/948251.md?page=4)