# CIA suicide pills and legal executions **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 21, 2006, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550 "2006-09-21T13:17:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/1 "2006-09-21T13:17:34Z")
This article got me thinking: [http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/09/20/fla.execution.ap/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/09/20/fla.execution.ap/index.html) When Gary Powers, the CIA’s U-2 pilot, got shot down over the Soviet Union in 1960, he had a suicide pill with him that he chose not to take, IIRC. I’ve also read that the Apollo astronauts took suicide pills along with them, just in case they got stranded in space and didn’t want to suffer a prolonged death (maybe it’s just an urban, or space, legend). However, Dr. Kevorkian administered several drugs to kill his “clients,” as I recall. And many executions use the three-drug combination described in this article. Do we really have a single, quick, painless suicide pill? Why don’t we use them for executions? To clarify, I don’t want a debate on either executions or suicide. If I did, this would be in GD. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/2 "2006-09-21T13:39:11Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Do we really have a single, quick, painless suicide pill? Why don’t we use them for executions? [/QUOTE] It’s easier to make sure the stuff actually went in when you inject it into somebody than when you give him a pill? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/3 "2006-09-21T13:46:26Z")
[QUOTE=Steve MB] It’s easier to make sure the stuff actually went in when you inject it into somebody than when you give him a pill? [/QUOTE] But still, if such a pill existed, it should be trivial to just inject whatever that is rather than the current cocktail of anesthetics and poison. ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/4 "2006-09-21T13:57:06Z")
Those in Hitler’s bunker who ended their lives used cyanide pills. Frau Goebbles gave one to each of her children before killing herself in the same fashion. Hitler supposedly bit down on one of them while shooting himself-- just to make really, really sure, I guess. I would imagine if the “suicide pill” exists (and was issued to US personell, it would be a cyanide tablet. As I understand, though, while it may be quick, it’s not exactly painless. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/5 "2006-09-21T14:03:02Z")
The suicide pill probably isn’t a commonly prescribed medicine. The three drugs generally used in lethal injection (Pentothal, Pavulon, and potassium chloride) have legitimate medical uses and are available as pharmaceuticals. It’s probably harder to find suicide pills. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/6 "2006-09-21T14:14:13Z")
[QUOTE=Lissa] I would imagine **if the “suicide pill” exists** (and was issued to US personell, it would be a cyanide tablet. [/QUOTE] 😕 My understanding is that this is not in doubt, and is public knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/7 "2006-09-21T14:18:16Z")
[QUOTE=bordelond] 😕 My understanding is that this is not in doubt, and is public knowledge. [/QUOTE] NASA has always denied that they gave suicide pills to astronauts, and no astronaut has ever admitted it. But lots of smart people, including Carl Sagan, were convinced that it was true. Another smart guy (I forgot who) theorized that NASA puts suicide pills in a secret hidden compartment on the spacecraft, and would only inform the astronauts about them in the event that they were marooned. But I find that a bit dubious. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/8 "2006-09-21T14:23:29Z")
According to this [transcript of an episode of PBS’s _History Detectives_](http://www.pbs.org/opb/historydetectives/pdf/301_suicide.pdf#search=%22suicide%20pin%22), Francis Gary Powers carried not a suicide pill, but some kind of a pin tipped with poison. His Soviet captors discovered the pin on his person, and stuck it into a dog to see whether or not it was a suicide device. The dog was dead in three minutes. ---
**Author:** ![davenportavenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@davenportavenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davenportavenger)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/9 "2006-09-21T14:27:18Z")
[QUOTE=pravnik] The suicide pill probably isn’t a commonly prescribed medicine. The three drugs generally used in lethal injection (Pentothal, Pavulon, and potassium chloride) have legitimate medical uses and are available as pharmaceuticals. It’s probably harder to find suicide pills. [/QUOTE] Along with that, it might be against the Hippocratic oath to administer a known poison like cyanide to someone, whereas a cocktail of nonlethal drugs that become lethal when combined might be okay under some sort of technicality. IANAMD or anything though. Plus, from what I’ve heard, cyanide is incredibly painful and takes a few minutes to work. The current death penalty is not instantaneous but it is not painful either. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/10 "2006-09-21T17:02:42Z")
[QUOTE=davenportavenger] Along with that, it might be against the Hippocratic oath to administer a known poison like cyanide to someone, whereas a cocktail of nonlethal drugs that become lethal when combined might be okay under some sort of technicality. IANAMD or anything though. [/QUOTE] [Doctors do not administer the drugs used in executions](http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=8&did=479): > [@](#): > > Medical ethics preclude doctors from participating in executions. However, a doctor will certify the inmate is dead. This lack of medical participation can be problematic because often injections are performed by inexperienced technicians or orderlies. If a member of the execution team injects the drugs into a muscle instead of a vein, or if the needle becomes clogged, extreme pain can result. Many prisoners have damaged veins resulting from intravenous drug use and it is sometimes difficult to find a usable vein, resulting in long delays while the inmate remains strapped to the gurney. (Ecenbarger, 1994 and Weisberg, 1991) ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/11 "2006-09-21T18:28:28Z")
What **Fear Itself** said. I once asked the warden of the Walls unit in Texas (we’re tight, the warden and me) who administers the injection, and he said it’s contracted out to a private company whose identity is kept secret. Most likely they’re phlebotomists. We had an intersting thread a while back about where they get the drugs from, I’ll see if I can find it. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/12 "2006-09-21T18:36:35Z")
Why would astronauts need a suicide pill? All they would have to do would be to open the door and it would be over pretty quick. Or they could just wait a while until they were overcome by carbon dioxide, which I think is not too bad a way to go. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/13 "2006-09-21T18:37:46Z")
Here we go: [No prescription needed to execute?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=7127450&highlight=phlebot%2A#post7127450) ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/14 "2006-09-21T18:43:44Z")
[QUOTE=Don’t Call Me Shirley] Why would astronauts need a suicide pill? All they would have to do would be to open the door and it would be over pretty quick. [/QUOTE] It still [does not sound pleasant](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_147.html). ---
**Author:** ![audiobottle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc8723/32.png) [@audiobottle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/audiobottle)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/15 "2006-09-21T18:52:32Z")
[QUOTE=Don’t Call Me Shirley] Why would astronauts need a suicide pill? All they would have to do would be to open the door and it would be over pretty quick. Or they could just wait a while until they were overcome by carbon dioxide, which I think is not too bad a way to go. [/QUOTE] I don’t think suffocation sounds very pleasant, personally. Maybe you’re thinking of carbon monoxide? ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/16 "2006-09-21T19:21:09Z")
I don’t think their blood would boil. The blood, being contained entirely within the skin, would not be exposed to the vacuum. I suppose any water in your mouth might boil though. But death would come from a lack of oxygen to the brain, and it would not take very long to go unconcious, after which the time it takes to actually die is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Turek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/turek/32/18782_2.png) [@Turek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turek)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/17 "2006-09-21T20:42:38Z")
[QUOTE=Don’t Call Me Shirley] …after which the time it takes to actually die is irrelevant. [/QUOTE] To _YOU_. If it were me, I’d like something a little cleaner, thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Garfield226](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Garfield226](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garfield226)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/18 "2006-09-21T21:02:51Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] I’ve also read that the Apollo astronauts took suicide pills along with them, just in case they got stranded in space and didn’t want to suffer a prolonged death (maybe it’s just an urban, or space, legend). [/QUOTE] This is untrue according to Jim Lovell in (the novel) ‘Apollo 13.’ ---
**Author:** ![groman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/73ab20/32.png) [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2006, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/19 "2006-09-21T21:13:24Z")
[QUOTE=Don’t Call Me Shirley] Why would astronauts need a suicide pill? All they would have to do would be to open the door and it would be over pretty quick. Or they could just wait a while until they were overcome by carbon dioxide, which I think is not too bad a way to go. [/QUOTE] That’s kind of like drowning but worse in every respect. Why would you choose that over a suicide pill? I mean, worst case astronauts have guns on board, and they’d get to contribute three important factoids to modern scientific knowledge before dying: a) Do guns fire in microgravity b) What happens when they do c) How do the other astranauts react to a rapidly decompressing space ship (exit hole) full of brain fragments and blood. ---
**Author:** ![postcards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8e8cbc/32.png) [@postcards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/postcards)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2006, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550/20 "2006-09-22T01:42:03Z")
[QUOTE=groman] …I mean, worst case astronauts have guns on board… [/QUOTE] :dubious: Cite? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cia-suicide-pills-and-legal-executions/373550.md?page=2)