# Cigars from Cuba? this can't be legal, can it?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [March 28, 2003, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756 "2003-03-28T10:46:31Z")
**Posts on this page:** 19
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/1 "2003-03-28T10:46:31Z")
Recently I got [THIS](http://www.cigarsfromcuba.net/AuthenticCubanCigars.htm) pop up ad. Now unless these cigars are over 40+ years old, I can think of no way this can be legal. Can anyone enlighten me on this. Maybe I forgot to read something here.
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### Author:  [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/2 "2003-03-28T11:02:20Z")
The company is in Panama, which doesn’t have an embargo, and they are not subject to U.S. laws. They have a disclaimer that says:
> [@](#):
>
> Purchases may be unlawful in some jurisdictions, including California. The customer should check whether purchases are lawful under applicable law. It is the purchasers respronsibility to know the laws concerning cigar purchases in his or her country of domicule.
Which means they plead ignorance as to whether it’s legal where you order from. But then they go on to say
> [@](#):
>
> US. Residents Please Note: We do not customarily ship the original box to the US…just the cigars. So take care when ordering the specialty casings. All other countries will receive cigars in their original boxes with the bands, as they were originally packed. US residents will receive the cigars unmarked and your bands will be sent separately free of charge for your verification of authenticity. We do not guarantee the delivery of your bands.
So they do take precautions to make your order discreet. This is the same as ordering any other illegal product from overseas (be it absinthe, certain weapons, some prescription medicines, etc.): the vendor isn’t at risk since it’s legal in their country, but the buyer sure as hell is if Customs discovers the package.
Long story short (I know, too late), no they aren’t 40+ year old cigars; and yes, it is illegal to order from this company if you live in the US.
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### Author:  [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/3 "2003-03-28T11:04:59Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by peepthis \*
> \*\*and yes, it is illegal to order from this company if you live in the US. \*\*
I thought so!!
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### Author:  [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/4 "2003-03-28T11:31:33Z")
I have read that President Kennedy stocked up on Cuban cigars as soon as he realized that his own supply was about to be shut off.
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### Author:  [@Nanoda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanoda)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/5 "2003-03-28T11:45:14Z")
So don’t order. “Cigars From Cuba delivers prestigious, hard to get Cuban cigars **WORLDWIDE** with most orders shipped from our warehouse within 24 hours.”
and it also says in their
[FAQ](http://www.cigarsfromcuba.net/real_cuban_cigars.htm) “Our warehouse is the central distributing warehouse of cigars in transit out of Cuba **to Europe and Asia**.”
They admit they _try_ shipping to the US, but I don’t see how this is any worse than advertising my fine Amsterdam “coffeeshop”.
Say, does anyone know what I’d be busted for if I was in the US and bought some? The embargo is to prevent trade, so I figure it’s the actual buying. But what if **I** bought some, and had them shipped to pkbites?
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### Author:  [@Eurograff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eurograff)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/6 "2003-03-28T12:13:20Z")
So it may be illegal in the US, but it’s perfectly legal for us Europeans to buy those cigars. That’s certainly big enough a market for them. This ad just pops up to everyone regardless of where they live, but on the other hand we often get ads promoting something interesting, only to find out that “offer valid in US and Canada only”. Same logic is at work here, I think.
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### Author:  [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/7 "2003-03-28T12:18:30Z")
**Nanoda** , here’s what [US Customs has to say about Cuban cigars](http://www.customs.ustreas.gov/xp/cgov/travel/alerts/cuban_cigars.xml):
> [@](#):
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> Only persons returning from Cuba after a licensed visit there are permitted to bring Cuban cigars into the United States, provided the value of such cigars does not exceed $100 US dollars and the cigars are for that individual’s personal use and not for resale. **All other importations of Cuban cigars are illegal**. All offers to buy or sell such cigars in the United States involve cigars that were imported illegally. **Contrary to what many people may believe, it is illegal for travelers to bring into the United States Cuban cigars acquired in third countries (such as Canada, England, or Mexico).**
The bolding is mine. As for penalties:
> [@](#):
>
> It is also illegal for U.S. persons to buy, sell, trade, or otherwise engage in transactions involving illegally-imported Cuban cigars. The penalties for doing so include, in addition to confiscation of the cigars, civil fines of up to $55,000 per violation and in appropriate cases, criminal prosecution which may result in higher fines and/or imprisonment.
I take this to mean that once the cigars hit the US border, you’re in danger of these penalties. You, in Canada, would be safe, but pkbites might be screwed. You can’t bring them to the States no matter where you’re from.
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### Author:  [@QuantGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuantGuy)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/8 "2003-03-28T14:56:45Z")
The joys of being Canadian. If only our dollar wasn’t so low I could afford to buy some.
By the way, when crossing the border, I’ve been asked directly on more than one occasion if I was carrying cigars. They obviously take this seriously.
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### Author:  [@keeper0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeper0)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/9 "2003-03-28T15:01:18Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Only persons returning from Cuba after a licensed visit there are permitted to bring Cuban cigars into the United States
Does this include people returning from Guantanomo?
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### Author:  [@FranticMad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FranticMad)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/10 "2003-03-28T15:04:33Z")
The cigars are probably fakes.
[http://www.cubamall.com/fakes.html](http://www.cubamall.com/fakes.html)
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### Author:  [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/11 "2003-03-28T15:23:09Z")
Some guy supposedly got a hold of a vast stash of [pre-embargo cigars](http://mdcigars.com/Havanablend.htm), which are not illegal. Two years ago, you could buy a 40-year old cigar out of its original box at the cigar shop at Connecticut and M here in DC for about thirty bucks. Now, the same vendor is selling a “blend,” which sounds suspiciously like nasty old cigars mashed up with newer tobacco. It’s still thirty bucks, if I read the sign right yesterday.
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### Author:  [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/12 "2003-03-28T15:24:47Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by FranticMad \*
> \*\*The cigars are probably fakes.
> [http://www.cubamall.com/fakes.html](http://www.cubamall.com/fakes.html) \*\*
Suspect claim, seeing as though this site is trying to sell you _their_ “authentic” Cuban cigars.
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### Author:  [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/13 "2003-03-28T17:43:28Z")
Sounds like you need to take a trip north and buy some non-functional vibrators to ship back home.
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### Author:  [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/14 "2003-03-28T18:42:48Z")
**FranticMad** , I had a look at your link, but it doesn’t seem to be very informative on fakes.
A lot of the cigar smokers I know point to [this site](http://www.cigarnexus.com/counsel/counterfeit/index.html) as one of the Web’s best primers on spotting fake Cuban cigars. Everything you need to know, and then some–and the fellow who posted it is not in the business of selling cigars, so he has no interest in trying to get you to buy from him.
**Pkbites** , I don’t know if you’re thinking of ordering, but it might be an interesting exercise to see how your Panamanian advertiser addresses some of the issues raised in the primer that I linked to. I’d be wary, for example, if I was ordering unboxed cigars, and was thus unable to examine the stamps and seals for myself.
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### Author:  [@Jonas\_Marainen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonas_Marainen)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/15 "2003-03-28T20:54:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by peepthis \*
> **This is the same as ordering any other illegal product from overseas (be it absinthe, certain weapons, some prescription medicines, etc.): the vendor isn’t at risk since it’s legal in their country, but the buyer sure as hell is if Customs discovers the package.**
You are technically correct, but let’s be realistic. The buyer is really only at risk if Customs discovers the package AND can demonstrate that the buyer arranged to have the package shipped. Contraband in a package being shipped to you is not sufficient reason to issue a fine or convict you of any crime.
If it was, imagine how easy it would be to get other people in trouble. Just drop some illegal drugs in an envelope, mail it to your adversary, and make an anonymous tip to the police…
Customs may very well have good reasons to suspect that you knew about the package, but in order to try to get you in trouble, they would have to subpoena your telephone records or your financial records to seek to demonstrate that you had placed an order for the contraband, or at least knew about the contraband.
It goes without saying that Customs does not start that sort of costly and lenghtly process because of a few Cuban cigars. In fact, a lot of small quantities of drugs that are intercepted in the mail are simply confiscated without any follow-up. The customs agents empties the package and sends the empty box on to you with a note saying that the contents were seized and that you are welcome to contact Customes if you want to dispute the confiscation. (I imagine that disputing the confiscation would be a bad idea.)
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### Author:  [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/16 "2003-03-28T22:13:39Z")
You may also be interested to know that while Barbados has a modest reputation for making very fine cigars, you would be [hard pressed](http://www5.who.int/tobacco/repository/stp84/table-b.pdf) to find an actual tobacco farmer on the island.
They procure their raw tobacco from… other sources… and cure it there on the island.
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### Author:  [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/17 "2003-03-28T22:47:17Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by keeper0 \*
> \*\*Does this include people returning from Guantanomo? \*\*
Having been to Gitmo many times, I’d guess that Cuban cigars aren’t even available there, although to be honest, I never checked for them. The only stores are US Navy and Marine stores, and I’d doubt seriously that they are authorized. There is a standard US Navy Exchange complex with a McD’s and commissary, and a Marine Corp exchange up the hill. I could be wrong, though. We always got our Cubans in the Domrep and Bahamas.
Ooops! Did I say that out loud?:eek:
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### Author:  [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)
#### Post date: [March 29, 2003, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/18 "2003-03-29T00:32:10Z")
it sounds like the old definition game to me. the company is named ‘cigars from cuba’…when i looked at the ad i thot it was a description. they could be sending you their ‘authentic cuban cigars’ model of their ‘el crapo’ line. let’s be real…this ‘we won’t send them in the original box but we’ll send you the bands later, but we don’t guarantee that we will send them’…it sounds like the old scam where the black guy goes to some white boys with his trunk raised and sells a glitzy watch for ‘only 20 dollars’ when he could have bought it himself for $9.
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### Author:  [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)
#### Post date: [March 29, 2003, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cigars-from-cuba-this-cant-be-legal-can-it/164756/19 "2003-03-29T08:47:51Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by handsomeharry \*
> \*\*it sounds like the old scam where the black guy goes to some white boys with his trunk raised and sells a glitzy watch for ‘only 20 dollars’ when he could have bought it himself for $9. \*\*
😕