# Civil Trial: Trump v E. Jean Carroll (Carroll wins, awarded $5 million, plus 83.3 million) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [April 17, 2023, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820 "2023-04-17T21:59:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/41 "2023-05-03T02:40:28Z")
> [@dougrb](#): > > [Donald Trump arrives in Scotland to visit golf course amid slew of lawsuits | The Independent](https://www.independent.co.uk/independentpremium/uk-news/trump-scotland-golf-lawsuits-aberdeen-b2330090.html) Non paywalled version via Yahoo: > **[Trump says ‘it’s great to be home’ as he arrives in Scotland amid slew of...](https://news.yahoo.com/donald-trump-says-great-home-174040047.html)** > > The former US president has said he will be opening a ‘spectacular’ second golf course in Aberdeen I think this may be his first trip outside the US since leaving office; I don’t know how I’d check that. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/42 "2023-05-03T03:19:49Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > on the grounds that he simply could not get a fair trial from a biased state system. According to this NYT article, the trial already is in Federal Court; Judge Kaplan is on the federal District Court: > **[Who is Lewis Kaplan, Judge in Carroll Case Against Trump?](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/27/nyregion/who-is-lewis-kaplan-judge-in-carroll-case-against-trump.html)** > > The federal judge is renowned for his command of the courtroom. I assume it would be diversity jurisdiction, since Trump is now a resident of Florida? The Court will be applying New York state law of defamation and sexual assault, including the recent waiver of limitation periods for civil claims relating to sexual assault. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/43 "2023-05-03T03:21:45Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I’m surprised the judge did not laugh out loud when he denied their request to exclude. > > “Your honor, this recording of my client saying he loves to rob banks, has robbed banks in the past and gets away with robbing banks has no relevance to the charge that he robbed this bank.” Actually, past bad conduct normally is excluded in a civil case, unless it comes within an exception to the rules of evidence. Here, the judge accepted Carroll’s argument that there is a specific evidentiary exception relating to sexual assault claims. It’s dealt with in the article cited above by @Jimmy_Chitwood . ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/44 "2023-05-03T03:57:06Z")
If he loses this, his brownshirts will never, ever let it go. There will never be hard, physical evidence to show them. They’ll never go for a he said she said. But boo hoo, they’ll forget all about it after Jack, or Tish, or Alvin, get through with him. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/45 "2023-05-03T12:51:03Z")
Yes, that’s right. I should have said in a city that’s (allegedly) biased against him. Without reading the linked article (not a subscriber so hopefully it’s addressed in there), the headline is a bit of a groaner. He’s renowned for his command of the courtroom in that he’s renowned for taking the law into his own hands, famously assigning a private prosecutor on behalf of Chevron to run Steven Donzinger out on a rail. ---
**Author:** ![Rebo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rebo/32/13005_2.png) [@Rebo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rebo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/46 "2023-05-03T17:48:33Z")
Ignorant question here. Carroll says he raped her. Stormy Daniels says he has a tiny pee-pee. Did he actually penetrate her with his mushroom? Can rape be assault with no penetration? I don’t know the details of what happened in the dressing room. Are they public yet? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/47 "2023-05-03T17:51:17Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > He’s renowned for his command of the courtroom in that he’s renowned for taking the law into his own hands, famously assigning a private prosecutor on behalf of Chevron to run Steven Donzinger out on a rail. Yes, he’s quite an notorious judge. He’ll get the result he wants, one way or another. The only question is what result he wants. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/48 "2023-05-03T17:59:30Z")
The details are the subject of the trial, so none of us actually know. He says he wasn’t even there. But the allegations are definitely known, and yes, it’s rape. She alleges he forcibly penetrated her. Trump and Stormy Daniels definitely had sexual intercourse, but I don’t think that’s relevant here. ---
**Author:** ![Rebo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rebo/32/13005_2.png) [@Rebo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rebo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/49 "2023-05-03T18:02:55Z")
Thank you for the info! ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/50 "2023-05-03T18:41:49Z")
Tiny pecker, all their clothes on, upright, and her not cooperating should make actual penetration difficult. The guy must’ve had a lot of practice 😠 😠 😠 ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/51 "2023-05-03T18:42:37Z")
Keep in mind that wether (or not) Trump actually raped Mrs. Carrol is irrelevant to the case. He is being sued for defamation. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/52 "2023-05-03T18:44:16Z")
No, she’s also suing for rape, under a special NY statute that waived limitation periods for certain civil suits alleging sexual assault. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/53 "2023-05-03T18:47:35Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Tiny pecker Tiny or not, he has fathered children. The proof being that they are douchbags like their dad. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/54 "2023-05-03T18:52:38Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Keep in mind that wether (or not) Trump actually raped Mrs. Carrol is irrelevant to the case. He is being sued for defamation. The defamation being that she is lying about the rape. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/55 "2023-05-03T19:25:49Z")
That among other statements for sure - > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > As I understand it, the initial lawsuit by Carroll was for defamation, based on remarks Trump made against her. She then upgraded the lawsuit in November last year, accusing him of rape, after New York State’s Adult Survivor’s Act temporarily lifted the state’s usual deadlines for suing over sexual assault. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/56 "2023-05-03T19:30:23Z")
There are two lawsuits. The first is for defamation for saying she made it up when she published her book in 2019, and isn’t the one in this thread. The second is for the actual rape itself, and for defamation for a Truth Social post saying she made it up. That’s this one. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2023, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/57 "2023-05-03T20:49:09Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Keep in mind that wether (or not) Trump actually raped Mrs. Carrol is irrelevant to the case. He is being sued for defamation. In the first place, she’s suing for rape AND libel. In the second place, of course the rape is relevant to the libel. If he didn’t rape her, then she’s lying. If she’s lying, then it isn’t libel to call her a liar. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2023, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/58 "2023-05-04T01:35:08Z")
Rape doesn’t have to be penetration with a penis. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2023, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/59 "2023-05-04T03:42:43Z")
True, there was the case a few years back where some high school football players in Maryland were charged with rape using a broomstick. ---
**Author:** ![StraightTalk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straighttalk/32/9982_2.png) [@StraightTalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StraightTalk)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2023, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/60 "2023-05-04T03:51:33Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Rape doesn’t have to be penetration with a penis. That’s what I was wondering. Legally, is “rape” penetration with anything? Fingers perhaps? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820.md?page=4)