# Civil Trial: Trump v E. Jean Carroll (Carroll wins, awarded $5 million, plus 83.3 million) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [April 17, 2023, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820 "2023-04-17T21:59:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 52
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1021 "2024-02-21T16:13:08Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Why not work from the top down? > > Start with Trump. Find his income streams. Take those. > > Trump may not own a helicopter but he owns some part of it…even through many steps. > > Trump makes money…take that money wherever it comes from when it dumps into accounts he can access to pay for a Big Mac. > > (not really arguing with you, just curious) So, essentially, garnishing his wages? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1022 "2024-02-21T16:15:20Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > So, essentially, garnishing his wages? Kinda. Except he does not have wages so not sure how that works for someone like him. He has to sell assets for income. Or get a loan. Can that be garnished? (I do not know) If he becomes president I suppose the courts could garnish his salary as president. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1023 "2024-02-21T16:45:09Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > … but the appellate court could take into consideration his continued slanders against her, in determining whether to reduce the award. No, they should not consider anything that’s not in the record of the trial court. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1024 "2024-02-21T16:54:06Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > If he becomes president I suppose the courts could garnish his salary as president. He’d have to be president for more than 200 years, and that’s if they garnished every penny. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1025 "2024-02-21T16:54:22Z")
he does get a pension for being president. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1026 "2024-02-21T16:55:53Z")
Pensions are excluded from garnishment. I think there should be a forced sale of Mar a lardo. ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1027 "2024-02-21T18:05:50Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Kinda. Except he does not have wages so not sure how that works for someone like him. Do we know that he doesn’t have wages? Most privately-held companies pay salaries, bonuses, etc. to their executives. Such are operating costs and deductible on the company’s taxes. Dividends paid out are not deductible. Since both are taxable to the executive, there’s a decided tax advantage to paying salaries. Of course, we’re talking about the Trump Organization, so who knows. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1028 "2024-02-21T18:21:42Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > I then used some of that money to pay what he owed me. Whoops – too late to edit. To pay what I owed him. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1029 "2024-02-21T18:58:53Z")
True in law; but i don’t doubt the justices who will hear the appeal will be aware of it, and in their brief and oral argument Carroll’s lawyers could (without mentioning the extrajudicial evidence), argue that the punitive damages in their full amount are necessary to discourage such behavior. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1030 "2024-02-21T21:21:49Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > For example, the media often reports on « Trump’s golf course at Bedminster, New Jersey », but what does that mean? Does it mean Donald J Trump is listed as the owner on the title? Highly doubtful. There’s likely a similar network of LLCs and business trusts, probably under New Jersey corporate registries. If Bedminster’s ownership structure is at some remove from the NY Trump Org companies in Engoron’s order, and can make business decisions to retain earnings and not pass them up the chain, then would a judgment creditor have anything they could collect on? They could just seize the assets: that is, the stock of the company at the top of the chain that leads to Bedminster. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1031 "2024-02-21T22:20:39Z")
I wonder if Trump would shut up about it if people just ignored anything he had to say on the subject. The guy THRIVES on getting attention. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1032 "2024-02-21T22:38:11Z")
Can the court discourage behavior if the defendant cannot pay? For example, if you got a judgement against me for $5 million (not to mention $83 million) you will never, ever, see that money. Nowhere near it. I don’t have $5 million and am old enough that I won’t live long enough to ever come close to paying that. So, why wouldn’t I just run around and slander you as much as I can? Another $100 million judgement? So what? I can’t pay that either. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1033 "2024-02-21T22:41:59Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > For example, if you got a judgement against me for $5 million (not to mention $83 million) you will never, ever, see that money. Nowhere near it. I don’t have $5 million and am old enough that I won’t live long enough to ever come close to paying that. For a regular person, the judgment probably wouldn’t be that high. You don’t go around bragging about how many billions your assets are worth, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1034 "2024-02-21T22:44:08Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > So, why wouldn’t I just run around and slander you as much as I can? Another $100 million judgement? So what? I can’t pay that either. Well, you’ve described defamation as a tort - where a civil case is brought and financial penalties applied. Some places can also treat defamation as a criminal matter. In the US, there is no federal criminal defamation. Some states though, do have criminal defamation laws. (I don’t think New York is one of them) ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1035 "2024-02-21T23:45:15Z")
I thought someone in this thread mentioned the possibility of getting a restraining order against someone who repeats the same behavior despite civil judgements. Then, if they continue doing it, it’s a violation of the restraining order and can be charged as a criminal offense. If that’s accurate, how long before Carroll goes that route against Trump? ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1036 "2024-02-22T00:33:47Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > Whoops – too late to edit. To pay what I owed him. No problem. My brain saw it that way anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Disinfectus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/disinfectus/32/11085_2.png) [@Disinfectus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disinfectus)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1037 "2024-02-22T04:14:16Z")
wrong thread. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1038 "2024-02-22T05:28:09Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Can the court discourage behavior if the defendant cannot pay? > > For example, if you got a judgement against me for $5 million (not to mention $83 million) you will never, ever, see that money. Nowhere near it. I don’t have $5 million and am old enough that I won’t live long enough to ever come close to paying that. > > So, why wouldn’t I just run around and slander you as much as I can? Another $100 million judgement? So what? I can’t pay that either. Because at some point you’d have to declare bankruptcy and THAT’S what he doesn’t want to do. People would figure out he’s not as rich as he pretends to be. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1039 "2024-02-22T05:33:53Z")
By the way does anyone remember [this promise](https://youtu.be/5CMuLWzL2iY/) made by Trump years ago? “I’m going to open up our libel laws so when they write purposely negative and horrible and false articles, we can sue them and win lots of money .” [And also this.](https://youtu.be/ACRAbU0x6hk?t=133) I guess he got his wish. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820/1040 "2024-02-22T07:26:09Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > (I don’t think New York is one of them) [Per this attorney…](https://mullenlawfirm.com/new-york-defamation-law/) > In New York, defamation is a civil matter. A person who suffers financial or emotional damages following another person’s false statement may choose to sue the offender, which would bring about a case in the appropriate New York court. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820.md?page=51) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/civil-trial-trump-v-e-jean-carroll-carroll-wins-awarded-5-million-plus-83-3-million/982820.md?page=53)