Civilian office workers--How do you do it?

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
21

I may well be off-base here, but it seems that in the military, you’re surrounded by people who have very similar motivations and values – love of country, desire to serve, etc. – and who have gone through a ration of shit to do what they’re doing – basic training, time away from home, low pay, danger, etc. You have a tight-knit community of people who are committed to many of the same goals. You also have leadership who have the motivation and authority to weed out the real nimrods before their mistakes cause someone to get hurt. An awful lot is at stake.

What’s at stake for me? I mean, I work in healthcare, but I’m about 1000 steps removed from the people who actually help the patients. I screw up, we lose a few bucks. Bad news, but we’re not defending the freakin’ free world. When I was in manufacturing, it was even worse – “If we bust ass this month, we’ll ship five extra soft drink display units!” Yeah, I’ll get right on that.

What passes for a community in the civilian office is mostly just the random people who fell ass-backwards into this job because it’s what they could do to pay the mortgage. We have little to no common ground outside of a shared skill set. And even that is pretty tenuous. Drop a dime out of the window, and you’ll hit someone who is willing and able to do my job.

My employer would lay me off to save money, and I would quit for an extra grand a year. Why not? I enjoy doing IT work well enough, but really, I’m here because I have to pull in a paycheck and this doesn’t completely suck.

Yes, many of us are incompetent. More of us just don’t really care. Managers, rank-and-file, everybody, for the most part, does what they need to do to get by so we can go home and be with the people we care about. I get some satisfaction from a job well done, but the things I really get satisfaction from (writing, woodworking, rehabbing the house), well, they don’t pay the bills.

You know that silly “Chicken Soup for the Soul” type parable: “I saw a man carrying stones, and I asked him what he was doing. He said, ‘I’m carrying rocks’. I saw another man and asked him the same question. He said ‘I’m building a cathedral!’” Uh-huh. Most of us are carrying fucking rocks. And, try as I might, I have yet to internalize “The Myth of Sisyphus”. Hi-ho.

OK, now I’ve depressed the hell out of myself. Back to work! I think I have some SQL to write.

22

For those of you only there for the money, are you at least motivated to find something more enjoyable? If you’re not social, I guess I get that. But otherwise, I’d think it would be hard knowing there could be a place where you can spend those 40 hours a week where it’s actually somewhat enjoyable. That’s a large chunk of your life being sacrificed for a paycheck.

23

Nope. It’s not that my office life is drudgery or anything, but I just have no interest in interacting with my coworkers any more than I have to. I make plenty of money at this point and have no need or desire to change careers.

It seems that we have very different views on what we want out of our work life and both think the other is rather strange. :smiley:

24

Reminding ourselves about how our job doesn’t involve getting shot at helps, sometimes.

25

<deleted because the previous poster beat me to the punch> :smiley:

26

I don’t get that. Work is toil; unless you’re a masochist or martyr, it sucks. I do it solely to support the rest of my life; if money was no issue, I’d never work a lick again for the rest of my life and never regret it.

27

While getting shot at isn’t fun (I’ve only been a few times), I wouldn’t trade it for anything. Having said that, having paid at least some dues, I am actively trying to stay away from that part of the world. In doing so I’m working a less than satisfying job, but it’s safe. So I suppose there are tradeoffs everywhere.

An Arky, I’d quit if I could too and never regret it, but since I have to work, I’d like to not be totally miserable while I’m doing it. You don’t have to be a masochist or martyr to enjoy your job. I mean, some level of enjoyment, even if it’s small, might make a huge difference to someone who dreads going into work every day.

28

My thoughts exactly. I only go to work to get paid so I can do the things I want to enjoy. Now, if someone wants to pay me to be globe-trotting writer/adventurer, then I’m all ears. But otherwise, I just want the money and am only even doing my job because that’s all I could get without a degree.

29

Yeah, if someone wants to pay me to write novels (and I’ve tried – they don’t), I’m delighted to comply. I actually have done quite a lot of volunteer work, where I do IT stuff for non-profits. That feels great. I’d probably get more emotional satisfaction from working at a do-good kind of place. I tried that too (3.5 years disaster relief, American Red Cross). Those guys don’t get paid for shit. So, there’s the mortgage, and the planned child, and the destitute in-laws, and the elderly parents… and, well, perhaps emotional satisfaction isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.

30

Well, yeah, I’m not a total Grinch…I do get the satisfaction of a job well done and the remote possibility that I’ve brought at least some semblance of improved efficiency to the organizations I’ve worked for.

31

It varies a lot by company.

As a coworker from a factory I worked in for several years would say “the young ones here who’ve never had another job have no idea how good this place is!” That’s my longest employment so far: 5 years, a dozen countries and three very different positions. There was an Ass Kissers Clique in the Main Office, there was the occasional incompetent git, but 99% of the people I met in that company (from wet-behind-the-ears peones to several VPs) were both competent and good mates.

I’ve worked in other nice places, for example the team I have right now is great (there is the occasional attack of stupidity, but we all get those, they just hit us in different ways) and I’ve worked in places that make me wish the people who led those companies to that culture a slow trip to Hell in the company of the person they hate most in the whole world.

32

Let’s not romanticize your military experience, ok? I’m sure there is just as much political bullshit as there is in the civilian world. Maybe more. And not every solider, sailor or Marine is a best of the best Annapolis or West Point type. There are plenty of retards in the military who I wouldn’t trust with a potato gun. And I’m sure plenty of them get into positions where they are leading people.
As to your original question, there are all types of jobs in all types of companies. I mean a low-level corporate IT job is not the same as an architect or a hedge fund manager.

You don’t need to spend 15 years working with a bunch of apathetic retards in a cubicle farm if you don’t want to. If your job sucks so bad, put check out some other jobs. You might find that there’s something better or that your job isn’t that bad after all.

I worked in management consulting for years. There is a distinct difference between people in those companies and those who work in what we call “industry” or non-consulting companies (kind of like “Muggles” from Harry Potter). People in consulting firms are motivated, driven, smart and well educated. They also tend to change jobs every few years as better opportunities present themselves. Industry-folk tend to stay in their little role for years on end, enduring all manner of crap.

You might actually enjoy working at a consulting firm like an Accenture or Deloitte. They tend to hire people with interesting backgrounds - MBAs, CPAs, Ivy League, ex-military, athletes, etc. We tend to work in teams when we go out to client sites and there tends to be a strong comeraderie. Everyone is expected to perform and those who don’t tend to be “counselled out” (IOW “fired”).

It’s not for everyone though as the hours can be long, travel extensive and competition pretty intense.

33

A timely Onion story - Study: Not Being An Asshole Boss May Boost Employee Morale. :smiley:

34

I should also point out that feeling of “doing something good” or “serving something greater than yourself” that you might feel serving your country in the military doesn’t really exist in corporate America. A lot of companies try to create a similar esprit de corps based on a combination of military indoctrination theory and cult psychology (ie Apple, Disney, Walmart, etc), but for the 90% of the sane world who is not bought in to it, it generally feels like weird cultlike propaganda.

Probably because ultimately you know that you are not working for some greater good. You are working to make the CEO, shareholders and hopefully yourself a bit wealthier.

35

flyboy, I just want you to know that I’ve been reading this thread with a smirk ever since you opened it up. Yesterday, I left my latest job (at HQ AFRC) where I was the Exec to an O-7 and O-6 for 14 months, and hated every minute of it because of our “secretary” who was bigger than her britches, and dumber than a bag ‘o’ hammers. We can’t fire her because the General loves her (for some reason–I think there’s some skeletons in some closets), but she pisses everyone off to no end with her browbeating (“I’m General So-and-So’s Secretary! I need it NOW!”) and lack of work. Imagine whatshername from Gone with the Wind trying that Southern Belle shit every time she needs something from you, but Og help you when you cross her. Now that I think about it, she may be bipolar. Or tripolar. Or just a crazy bitch.

If it weren’t for the O-7 keeping her around, her ass would be on the street.

I’m military too, and like you, just never have worked on the civilian side yet (save for those occasional summer jobs to get me through college). I’m constantly picking others’ brains for what it’s like in the ‘real world’. In other words, thanks for this thread, and man, I feel your wife’s pain.

Tripler
I’m PCSing in two weeks to EOD school, just to get away from her. :dubious: :smiley:

36

Tripler, sorry to hear one person ruined the whole office for you. It’s gotta be pretty bad to send you running to EOD, of all places. Best of luck there. Do be careful, and don’t be this guy!

msmith, sorry I sounded like I’m romanticizing anything–that wasn’t my intent, but I can see it coming off that way. It’s a very real mindset that I’ve noticed in myself over the years, and it contrasts sharply to what I see on the civilian side. So, I thought I’d put it out there for some other viewpoints. And as I tried to concede, yes, there are bad apples and some of the same problems in the military as outside of it. But on the other hand, there is this one bonding aspect that I’ve seen that runs throughout the military that I’ve never seen in the civilian world. I wouldn’t call it romantic, but I would venture to call it a phenomenon somewhat unique to the military.

37

It is unique to the military. You have very unique circumstances. On the civilian side, we don’t spend 2-3 months where our every waking moment is spent together as a unit. We don’t sign on for 4-8 (or many more for career military) years that we’re going to spend together. The atmosphere of civilian jobs is by it’s very nature a looser association then military.

For the most part, we spend 8 hours together 5 days a week. That’s it. Then we go to our own lives evenings and weekends. We are also free to leave whenever we choose. I think another thing that somewhat affects things is the increasing use of temps. In my earlier career it was odd to have more than one temp working in the office at once. In my current department of about 30 we have 4. There is a turnover rate that I don’t think you get in the military.

I do honestly hope you find a career that gets you what you want but just remember that by and large, it doesn’t exist in most cases.

38

[del]She[/del] It pretty much ruins it for everybody, so most of us are in the same boat. It just sucks that the cause of the problem is at the head of the food chain. Other than that, all of the other squadrons I’ve been in have been awesome (like yourself).

And don’t worry, I volunteered for EOD. Been chasin’ this dream for nigh on six years now.

Tripler
And no, I won’t be “that guy”.

39

Eventually you learn to just sort of roll with it and fit into the system however you can, and/or come home, drink heavily, and cry yourself to sleep.

40

I hear you. When I was in the military everyone would bitch about the politics and game playing but after I got out and entered the civilian sector I was absolutely appalled at the shit that goes on.