# Claims about the Trump presidency that are or aren't hyperbole **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 19, 2019, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857 "2019-02-19T22:10:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/21 "2019-02-20T19:14:31Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Who’s paying for the wall? > > … Mexico. totally. I mean, I am going to be big time upset if it turns out that he lied about that and I fell for it! That was his big thing. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/22 "2019-02-20T19:16:20Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Given Iran’s actions in recent years, there’s a legitimate argument to be made that providing Saudi Arabia with some sort of nuclear help is in our national interest. And the Law be damned! ---
**Author:** ![Grim\_Render](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@Grim\_Render](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grim_Render)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/23 "2019-02-20T19:42:37Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Given Iran’s actions in recent years, there’s a legitimate argument to be made that providing Saudi Arabia with some sort of nuclear help is in our national interest. How many terrorist movements are being supported by SA oil money, even if not directly government money? How stable is the current leadership ? Letting them have nukes would be a poor decision of epic magnitude. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/24 "2019-02-20T20:52:19Z")
I think Trump is probably the most personally corrupt President we’ve ever had. There’s a lot of strong evidence that he’s accepting large amounts of money from people and organizations that are influencing his actions. This is, of course, the exact opposite of his promise to “drain the swamp” if elected. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/25 "2019-02-20T20:56:59Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Given Iran’s actions in recent years, there’s a legitimate argument to be made that providing Saudi Arabia with some sort of nuclear help is in our national interest. I don’t see this. If we feel that Saudi Arabia needs protection from regional nuclear powers, we could announce a policy that we will defend them using our nuclear weapons against any nuclear attack. We have agreements like this with other countries. But assisting Saudi Arabia to get its own nuclear arsenal would place any subsequent nuclear weapons outside of our control. And the Saudi/Wahhabi regime are not the kind of people that I feel we should trust with its own nuclear weapons. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2019, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/26 "2019-02-20T21:05:29Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Accusing Trump of treason doesn’t seem to be hyperbole. The russia ties, but now its coming out that they may have tried to help Saudi Arabia get nuclear materials (which needs to be investigated thoroughly). He trusts Russian intelligence agencies more than US agencies and Putin is one of the only people he won’t criticize. … We’ve had several threads here about the word “treason” ([here is one](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=831375)). The consensus seemed to be that even the worst alleged actions by President Trump don’t meet the legal requirements for it to be “treason”. If you want to use “treason” purely in a hyperbolic sense, well, then … that seems to be where you’re at. ---
**Author:** ![Batano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b487fb/32.png) [@Batano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batano)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/27 "2019-02-21T03:19:43Z")
Our imagination was not up to the task. Imagine if these claims had been made: The President would call for “retribution” against TV networks for making fun of him. He would fire the FBI director and say he was “a total sleaze”. He’d believe Putin over his own intelligence chiefs with regards to Korea’s rocket technology. While overseas he would call US news “fake” (This one infuriated me. We are in a hearts and minds struggle against Russian news throughout Easter Europe.) He’d announce major policy and staffing changes via Twitter. He’d declare a national emergency and use US funds to pay for the wall he said Mexico would pay for. He’d praise Kim and Putin while picking fights with our allies (who get’s into an argument with Canada?) He would have a policy of deliberately separating illegal immigrant children from their parents in order to discourage border crossings. He would make dozens of easily verifiable lies about things big and small starting with his very first day in office. He would not read intelligence reports and instead regularly get advice from Tucker Carlson and Sean Hannity. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/28 "2019-02-21T05:52:13Z")
There’s been a turn toward totalitarian rule where I live. The electorate recently “approved” a new constitution which it wasn’t allowed to debate. General elections will be held next month, but the j_ **a has used gerrymandering and appointments to affect the results and still reserves the right to intercede. Some of these measures would be absolutely unacceptable in a Western country, yet still the j** _a grows its political strength slowly and methodically. Many politicians see the handwriting on the wall and have joined the j\*\*\*a’s coalition. Yet even in that country a declaration like “I’m President for Life” would be unacceptable. > [@Mijin](#): > > He’s trying, he’s just not had much success yet. > Anyone who suggested the US would already be a dictatorship by the midterms was living in fantasy land. But eroding many checks and balances as well as breeding a “You can’t trust anybody or anything except dear leader” cynicism / idolatry, and general stoking of divisions is a good start. Yes. The idea that dictatorship could emerge suddenly, e.g. with a recently elected President just suspending elections is itself hyperbolic! Democracy is threatened at the margins, slowly. Gerrymandering and other chicanery increases the governing party’s strength. Illegal manipulation of the upcoming Census is already planned that may affect electoral balance way into the future. Citizens are repeatedly told that most media are liars and that only news that supports the ruler should be listened to. Meanwhile evidence of misdeeds is denied; Photoshopped images are presented; members of the ruling party are made to understand that their loyalty is essential to their future. A key Supreme Court appointment by the opposition is blocked, while traditional rules are overturned to allow Trump to pack the federal benches with extremists. Other attempts are made to subvert the Justice system. Low-information supporters of the regime are trained to boo when indicted or convicted felons are led away in handcuffs. Will Trump succeed in making himself dictator? The good news is that he is much too incompetent for that. A more serious risk is that Mike Pence or some other successor will use Trump’s dictatorial tools to gradually enhance the apparatus of authoritarian one-party rule. America has a long proud history of freedom and I hope some of that will be retained for the future. Let us hope that future Americans will view recent years with great shame. Let the permanent separation of asylum-seeking children from their parents — even in World War II, that wasn’t done in the Japanese detentions — be the new symbol of the Republican Party. ---
**Author:** ![Batano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b487fb/32.png) [@Batano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batano)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/29 "2019-02-21T07:32:18Z")
This could be a realistic scenario. The SC is packed with “original intenters” who rule that the Bill of Rights and other parts of the Constitution don’t apply to the states. Red states outlaw abortions, blue states limit gun ownership. Abortion clinics and gun shops rise up at the borders between red and blue states and state governments set up checkpoints or use other draconian measures to limit their residents from making use of the neighboring states’ businesses. Meanwhile, people decide that the electoral college is stupid and other’s decide that giving small states two senators is also stupid and a constitutional convention is held. One side or the other is now terrified that somethings they hold sacred (abortion or guns) will be outlawed and a secessionist movement starts. States, not being homogeneous, have factions inside them taking up arms against each other. Riots ensue. Governors refuse to let the National Guard be put under federal control and the Army is sent in. This pits the National Guard against the Army and some soldiers defect refusing to use the threat of arms against their own citizens. The raw underbelly of America is exposed: rural vs urban, white vs black, religious vs non-religious, coastal vs fly-over, south vs north. This time, people don’t want intellectual giants like Jefferson, Adams, and Madison to re-write the Constitution and they look to Hannity, AOC, Alex Jones, Al Sharpton and other nitwits. Putin laughs until the New USA, all 35 states, decides to use their nuclear weapons. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/30 "2019-02-21T15:40:29Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > You should create a website called “AmIHyperboleOrNot,” which flashes a series of claims about Trump and lets users click YES or NO. I bet you could make literally dozens of dollars while keeping your spreadsheet up to date. Throw in some statements made of whole cloth and you’d have a pretty good Poe’s law detector as well. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/31 "2019-02-21T21:50:13Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > We’ve had several threads here about the word “treason” ([here is one](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=831375)). The consensus seemed to be that even the worst alleged actions by President Trump don’t meet the legal requirements for it to be “treason”. If you want to use “treason” purely in a hyperbolic sense, well, then … that seems to be where you’re at. And what if it turns out that the reason Trump is attacking NATO is because doing so is in putins interests, and Trump is putting putins agenda ahead of America’s by using his power as president to advance the geopolitical agenda of putin? The definition mentions ‘adhering to America’s enemies’. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/32 "2019-02-21T21:54:55Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > And what if it turns out that the reason Trump is attacking NATO is because doing so is in putins interests, and Trump is putting putins agenda ahead of America’s by using his power as president to advance the geopolitical agenda of putin? > > The definition mentions ‘adhering to America’s enemies’. The sticking point is that Russia is not someone we are engaged in military hostilities with. They are not an “enemy”, at least when it comes to deciding the legal issue of “treason”. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/33 "2019-02-21T22:03:21Z")
Well, could we stretch out to “not very nice”? I mean, if that is not a wild exaggeration in your view? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/34 "2019-02-21T22:09:55Z")
> [@Batano](#): > > This could be a realistic scenario. The SC is packed with “original intenters” who rule that the Bill of Rights and other parts of the Constitution don’t apply to the states. Red states outlaw abortions, blue states limit gun ownership. Abortion clinics and gun shops rise up at the borders between red and blue states and state governments set up checkpoints or use other draconian measures to limit their residents from making use of the neighboring states’ businesses. Meanwhile, people decide that the electoral college is stupid and other’s decide that giving small states two senators is also stupid and a constitutional convention is held. One side or the other is now terrified that somethings they hold sacred (abortion or guns) will be outlawed and a secessionist movement starts. States, not being homogeneous, have factions inside them taking up arms against each other. Riots ensue. Governors refuse to let the National Guard be put under federal control and the Army is sent in. This pits the National Guard against the Army and some soldiers defect refusing to use the threat of arms against their own citizens. The raw underbelly of America is exposed: rural vs urban, white vs black, religious vs non-religious, coastal vs fly-over, south vs north. This time, people don’t want intellectual giants like Jefferson, Adams, and Madison to re-write the Constitution and they look to Hannity, AOC, Alex Jones, Al Sharpton and other nitwits. > > Putin laughs until the New USA, all 35 states, decides to use their nuclear weapons. And then, on Tuesday… ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/35 "2019-02-21T22:49:34Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > The sticking point is that Russia is not someone we are engaged in military hostilities with. They are not an “enemy”, at least when it comes to deciding the legal issue of “treason”. Oh, so it’s all OK then? Got it. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/36 "2019-02-21T22:53:40Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Before Trump took office, there were people who said that he would turn America into The Handmaid’s Tale. It’s safe to say that women aren’t being required to wear red dresses and white bonnets (and probably won’t ever be), so that one is hyperbolic. > > A more common claim is that he is turning America into a “fascist dictatorship”. While it is true that he’s trying to act with more unfettered power than many previous presidents, if Trump is a dictator in which a midterm election causes his party to lose control of one house of Congress, and a dictator in which numerous checks and balances act on him (re: judges overruling his actions, Pelosi stymieing his wall,) then this must be the weakest dictatorship of all time, or not a dictatorship at all. That is…mostly hyperbole, if not entirely hyperbole. > > As for Trump being Hitler, there haven’t been death camps or invasions of neighboring nations, or even any major wars. > > Is he making things more corrupt, not acting presidential, etc.? Yes, so that is not hyperbole. > > Was ISIS defeated in six months? No. Numerous claims or promises have not been kept, so, those were hyperbole to his supporters. The Rust Belt is still languishing, coal jobs have not come back, etc. > > What else - out of the long lists of dozens or hundreds of things that people have claimed or predicted about Trump’s presidency - have been hyperbole, or not? You didn’t really think that this discussion would be productive, did you? 🙂 I can certainly appreciate honest disagreement with Trump’s policies and I disagree with many of them myself, but I agree with you that this whole Hitler/dictatorship/Handmaids Tale/concentration camp stuff is absurdly over the top and bears no resemblance even remotely to anything that is happening. The internet and 24 hour cable news networks have replaced reasoned thought with talking points. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2019, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857/37 "2019-02-21T22:58:54Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > The sticking point is that Russia is not someone we are engaged in military hostilities with. They are not an “enemy”, at least when it comes to deciding the legal issue of “treason”. Maybe they can put that under Trump’s accomplishments. Like for LBJ they have medicare, medicaid, the great society, etc. For Trump it can say ‘he worked for America’s enemies against his own country, but it didn’t legally rise to the definition of treason’. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/claims-about-the-trump-presidency-that-are-or-arent-hyperbole/829857.md?page=1)