# Classic Songs That Glorified Pretty Rotten Behaviour ... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 22, 2008, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745 "2008-02-22T17:49:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![8675309](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/8/ea5d25/32.png) [@8675309](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/8675309)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/121 "2008-02-26T13:05:27Z")
I Used to Love Her, But I Had to Kill Her ---
**Author:** ![RiverRunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/977dab/32.png) [@RiverRunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RiverRunner)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/122 "2008-02-26T14:27:22Z")
_The Highwayman_ by Loreena McKennitt (based on a poem by Alfred Noyes. RR ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/123 "2008-02-26T14:35:26Z")
Loudon Wainwright III’s “Suicide Song” and "Suicide Is Painless (The Theme From M_A_S\*H) both endorse killing yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Catamount](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/catamount/32/2840_2.png) [@Catamount](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catamount)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/124 "2008-02-26T15:12:06Z")
[QUOTE=Ludovic] speaking of south of the border – Hey Joe. (upon preview I see that there is another closely related song, Rio by Duran Duran.) [/QUOTE] Are you talking about these lyrics: \*Hey now (wow), look at that. Did he really run you down? At the end of the drive, the lawmen arrive you make me feel alive alive alive \* I’ve been trying to figure out what that song’s about for years and so far all I’ve come up with is “catchy beat”. ---
**Author:** ![dwc1970](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a183cd/32.png) [@dwc1970](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dwc1970)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/125 "2008-02-26T16:55:23Z")
How 'bout Arlo Guthrie’s **Alice’s Restaurant**? Littering doesn’t exactly rank up there with murder or infidelity, but it can still land you in trouble with the law. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/126 "2008-02-26T17:53:11Z")
[QUOTE=j666] And …? I don’t get it, what’s wrong with that? Oh, carving her _own name_ into the seats! Yeah, that’s pretty dumb. The owner of the car is not only cheating on his woman, he’s getting a silly young girl who’s not used to alcohol drunk to ‘take advantage of her’. He’s also wearing cheap cologne. All around caddish behavior. I nominate this song as the Anti-Caddish Behavior Song. [/QUOTE] Not just the stupidity of leaving her calling card; her own behavior that she glorifies is none too admirable. Going into the bar and cock-blocking him as a warning to her would be preferable. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/127 "2008-02-26T19:35:44Z")
I agree that there are a lot of folk standards that romaticize, at the very least, bad behavior. Some versions of _Goodnight, Irene_ include lines about morphine use, which leads one to wonder whether that might have something to do with Irene’s presence in the grave. (Other versions get even more direct.) Then there are the songs that are simply dealing with fucked up people or relationships. Pete Seeger’s version of [Barbara Allen](http://www.justsomelyrics.com/628641/Pete-Seeger-Barbara-Allen-Lyrics) comes to mind as being near the top of this category. She can’t give him the time of day, even when he’s dying, but once he’s gone, she’s going to die without him? Then there’s the song cycle centering on Sweet William, which I have to admit I’m glad I’ve never heard that I can recall it. ([This](http://www.timobrien.net/Lyrics2.cfm?ID=26) is just one version, there are many…) What about [Frankie and Johnnie](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankie_and_Johnny_(song))? I love this song, but egads, the amount of fucked up in it is impossible to measure. Not to mention the slur against Nellie Bly included in passing. Oh, and almost every song mentioned in [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=453667) thread should count, I think. (Not quite all, but most of them, certainly.) [QUOTE=j666] Most of the songs in _Guys and Dolls_. I hate that musical. The only song I can stand is [Luck Be a Lady.](http://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Frank-Sinatra/Luck-Be-A-Lady.html) [/QUOTE] What’s wrong with [Sit Down, You’re Rocking the Boat](http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/guysanddolls/sitdownyourerockintheboat.htm)? The lyrics make it clear that the only rocking he’s doing is what the SOS Missions listed as immoral behavior, so the larger motif that making trouble is bad for you and your neighbors that the phrase is associated with doesn’t apply, I don’t think. Otherwise, I agree with you about the musical. I love it, and hate it at the same time. It’s fun, and I enjoy the movie version with Sinatra and Brando, and I cringe for most of the songs. It’s pretty bad when the Burlesque songs are some of the least effed up lyrics in the show. ETA: I met a woman who was dancing as one of Miss Adelaide’s girls in an off-Broadway production of Guys and Dolls, and we horrified our mutual friend who had introduced us by listing all the ways that the songs and characters made us cringe. He had no real taste for musical theatre, and knew very, very little of the specific show his friend was working on. ---
**Author:** ![Barrett\_Bonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@Barrett\_Bonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barrett_Bonden)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/128 "2008-02-26T21:58:20Z")
**Delia’s Gone** _First time I shot her I shot her in the side Hard to watch her suffer But with the second shot she died Delia’s gone, one more round Delia’s gone_ ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/129 "2008-02-26T23:22:27Z")
[QUOTE=Otaku] What’s wrong with Sit Down, You’re Rocking the Boat? [/QUOTE] Well, nothing now that you bring it up; I’d forgotten about it. Not that I agree with the definition of immoral behavior in the song, but trying to shoot craps in a life boat is just wrong. [QUOTE=kaylasdad99] Going into the bar and cock-blocking him as a warning to her would be preferable. [/QUOTE] “Let us not have a vulgar quarrel.” (I wish I could type the accent). Let’s see, embarrass everyone in the bar, including that poor silly girl, or vent on an inanimate object that symbolize all that is wrong with our current culture, specifically our tendency to indulge in and glorify self-destructive behavior … I’m still takin’ out his lights. _You_ go cause a scene, and I’ll meet you down the street for a beer and we can deconstruct a few C&W lyrics. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2008, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/130 "2008-02-27T03:13:54Z")
The Rolling Stones’ “Brown Sugar” bothered me a lot more after I actually read the lyrics, which are pretty much all about beating and raping female slaves. ``` Is Carrie Underwood's "Before He Cheats" another one of those vigilante songs? ``` Or should I say “pre-emptive strike” ? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2008, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/131 "2008-02-27T05:00:51Z")
Someone already mentioned Zevon’s “Mr. Bad Example”, but it was tailor made for this thread. Some sample verses: \*I started as an altar boy, working at the church Learning all my holy moves, doing some research Which led me to a cash box, labeled “Children’s Fund” I’d leave the change, and tuck the bills inside my cummerbund … I got a part-time job at my father’s carpet store Laying tackless stripping, and housewives by the score I loaded up their furniture, and took it to Spokane And auctioned off every last naugahyde divan\* You’ve gotta love a songwriter who can work ‘Naugahyde divan’ into a lyric. _I opened up an agency somewhere down the line To hire aboriginals to work the opal mines But I attached their wages and took a whopping cut And whisked away their workman’s comp and pauperized the lot_ I miss Warren. ---
**Author:** ![Chanteuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de053/32.png) [@Chanteuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chanteuse)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2008, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/132 "2008-02-27T11:43:21Z")
[QUOTE=vivalostwages] Is Carrie Underwood’s “Before He Cheats” another one of those vigilante songs? Or should I say “pre-emptive strike” ? [/QUOTE] A little of both, I’d say. He cheats on her, she ruins his prized vehicle. “Maybe next time he’ll think before he cheats,” she sings, and then later, “I might’ve saved a little trouble for the next girl, 'cause the next time that he cheats, you know it won’t be on me.” ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/133 "2008-02-29T02:35:10Z")
Yes, but how stupid is she going to feel when she gets home after her vendetta, and finds her man waiting with the lights down low, the Wild Turkey poured, and her favorite Old Bocephus tunes cranking on the stereo, telling her that he’s so happy that his brother came home safe on furlough from Iraq, that he loaned him his truck, and decided to celebrate by spending the evening in with his favorite gal? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/134 "2008-02-29T13:09:01Z")
[QUOTE=Rilchiam] Not unsuspecting. Check the later verses: \*Young man, I was once in your shoes I said, I was down and out with the blues I felt no one cared if I were alive I thought the whole world was so jive That’s when someone came up to me And said young man, take a walk up the street There’s a place there called the Y.M.C.A. They can start you back on your way\* Sounds to me like the young guy has been tossed out by his parents, or beat up by homophobes – something that left him down on his luck. The “you can hook up” implication is less important to me than the “you’re not alone in the world” message. In fact, I have a hard time dancing to that song since I spotted that message. I keep picturing a suddenly-homeless kid, perhaps with a black eye or split lip, being reassured by a guy who’s been there himself. Not uplifting, to be sure, but not sinister either. [/QUOTE] Vulnerable homeless boy being groomed by a faux-sympathetic predatory homosexual? Nope, nothing to worry about there. All within the context of the song, naturally. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/135 "2008-02-29T20:37:31Z")
If you’re convinced that every homosexual is a predator, incapable of sympathy, I can’t change that. But I think it’s a pretty sad view of the world. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2008, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/136 "2008-03-01T08:15:56Z")
[QUOTE=Rilchiam] If you’re convinced that every homosexual is a predator, incapable of sympathy, I can’t change that. But I think it’s a pretty sad view of the world. [/QUOTE] Take it to the Pit if you want to call me a homophobe, though it’s been tried before by better than you. You figure no homosexual would creepily hit on the vulnerable homeless? I don’t rate them either better or worse than straights in that department. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2008, 8:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745/137 "2008-03-01T08:40:15Z")
Why would I want to go to the Pit over a disco song? Some people said it was creepy. I see it as poignant, not creepy. If you still see it as creepy, then you just do. Doesn’t make you a homophobe, just a pessimist. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classic-songs-that-glorified-pretty-rotten-behaviour/438745.md?page=6)