# Classical Greek Philosophers -- How Widely Read? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 14, 2016, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-greek-philosophers-how-widely-read/749026 "2016-03-14T23:40:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2016, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-greek-philosophers-how-widely-read/749026/1 "2016-03-14T23:40:57Z")
In Plato’s day, how many copies of his collected dialogues would have been written down? Who would have had them? How widely would they have been distributed? If Plato died in 347 B.C. in Athens, how much of his lore, at that time, might another philosopher in, say, Corinth, have been familiar with? Were there any kind of correspondence societies, where a dinner-and-philosophy club in Thessalonika would all be happy because they just got a copy of Plato’s most recent publication? What was (in rough terms) the speed of transmission of the great writings, Plato, Aristotle, and their ilk? (How “dark” were these ages?) How familiar would Plato have been with, say Democritus (died 370 B.C.) or Heraclitus (died 470 B.C. – an additional century to be known…or forgotten?) I’m not really asking for these specifics, but just a kind of generality. Were the works of the great philosophers spread around for others to know, or was everyone pretty much on his own, in whatever small school or academy he might start up? (Inspired in part by the thread of epicureans vs. stoics.) ---
**Author:** ![No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_Wikipedia_Cites)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-greek-philosophers-how-widely-read/749026/2 "2016-03-15T14:01:19Z")
If you mean reading in the modern sense, via the original texts, not that widely or fast at all due to no printing press, lower literacy rates, and slower pace of transportation, making distribution limited—but other cultural methods made up for it and make the comparison with modern readership inapt. From Macaulay’s essay on Samual Johnson: > [@](#): > > “The Athenians of the age of Demosthenes,” he said to Mrs. Thrale, “were a people of brutes, a barbarous people.” In conversation with Sir Adam Ferguson he used similar language. “The boasted Athenians,” he said, “were barbarians. The mass of every people must be barbarous where there is no printing.” The fact was this: he saw that a Londoner who could not read was a very stupid and brutal fellow: he saw that great refinement of taste and activity of intellect were rarely found in a Londoner who had not read much; and, because it was by means of books that people acquired almost all their knowledge in the society with which he was acquainted, he concluded, in defiance of the strongest and clearest evidence, that the human mind can be cultivated by means of books alone. > > \*\*An Athenian citizen might possess very few volumes; and the largest library to which he had access might be much less valuable than Johnson’s bookcase in Bolt Court. But the Athenian might pass every morning in conversation with Socrates, and might hear Pericles speak four or five times every month. He saw the plays of Sophocles and Aristophanes: he walked amidst the friezes of Phidias and the paintings of Zeuxis: he knew by heart the choruses of Æschylus: he heard the rhapsodist at the corner of the street reciting the shield of Achilles or the Death of Argus: he was a legislator, conversant with high questions of alliance, revenue, and war: he was a soldier, trained under a liberal and generous discipline: he was a judge, compelled every day to weigh the effect of opposite arguments. These things were in themselves an education, an education eminently fitted, not, indeed, to form exact or profound thinkers, but to give quickness to the perceptions, delicacy to the taste, fluency to the expression, and politeness to the manners. \*\* All this was overlooked. An Athenian who did not improve his mind by reading was, in Johnson’s opinion, much such a person as a Cockney who made his mark, much such a person as black Frank before he went to school, and far inferior to a parish clerk or a printer’s devil. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-greek-philosophers-how-widely-read/749026/3 "2016-03-15T21:09:14Z")
Fun quote! And great insight! My guy in Corinth might never actually read a word of Plato…but someone from Athens, passing through, might repeat at least a summary of all that’s hot back home, making the ideas, if not the exact words, available. Thank you! ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-greek-philosophers-how-widely-read/749026/4 "2016-03-16T03:52:28Z")
I doubt we have an accurate numerical figure for the number of manuscripts for any ancient book, but we can be sure that the number was very small. Parchment and ink were expensive, but more significantly, it took a large amount of time to produce even one copy of a full-length book. Scribes were costly, being among the most skilled tradesmen, and their time was valuable, hence the cost of producing any book was high.