# Classical music haters: Why? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 20, 2019, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957 "2019-08-20T20:19:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/161 "2019-08-23T14:53:16Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > I don’t know enough about music to even join a conversation about pantatonic scales or identify rhythms. But I wouldn’t think the above comment that rock music “is all pretty simple” or only uses simple chord is true. What about many songs and albums by Frank Zappa, Yes, Rush, King Krimson, Jethro Tull, Queen, Pink Floyd? Aah, yes, Jethro Tull. Proof that you [can’t easily separate rock and classical](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWJgJkVL0xM). ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/162 "2019-08-23T15:26:10Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Aah, yes, Jethro Tull. Proof that you [can’t easily separate rock and classical](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWJgJkVL0xM). Yep, Jethro Toe certainly found a rich field chock-a-block with musical goodness. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/163 "2019-08-23T15:27:53Z")
I don’t hate classical music, but I do dislike my friends who act like I need to listen to it. I have one friend who talks about the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra all the time, knowing I don’t care for classical music. I almost feel as if he’s thinking he needs to ‘culture-ize’ me. ---
**Author:** ![Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/les_espaces_du_sommeil/32/308_2.png) [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Les_Espaces_Du_Sommeil)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/164 "2019-08-23T15:35:30Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > No, but then rock fans also don’t use the word ‘art’ to describe Pour Some Sugar on Me. Are you sure ? Listening to some rock bands describing their latest opus (ah !), you sometimes need a mountain of salt to keep a straight face. I mean, there’s a reason why [this scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgViOqGJEvM) is so hilarious. Really, there is an awful lot of pretension in _all_ art, and rock (or rap for that matter) is not exempt from it. Quite the contrary, actually. > [@Derleth](#): > > … **all you need to know about how interesting this unpopular music is how often it’s steadfastly refused to die.** In the end, that’s all there is to say, really. Classical music has been described as out-dated, boring or even moribund for decades, if not centuries and yet… it’s still here. Some people don’t like it ? Fine. It’ll still be around for awhile. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/165 "2019-08-23T17:13:28Z")
I can’t really say that I “hate” classical music – partly because the term “classical music” is such a broad genre, comprising everything from 12th c. motets to the _1812 Overture_ to Phillip Glass’ experiments in atonality – but it’s not music I often choose. I might be a bit simple in my tastes, but I enjoy music that stirs my emotions, and for the most part, that’s a human voice, singing lyrics, in English. That’s not to say that no symphonic music is ever moving; I defy anyone to listen to the “Ode To Joy” from Beethoven’s Ninth, without getting a tear in the eye. But in the main, symphonic music simply does not engage me. It’s not reverse snobbery, either – I don’t perceive any stigma against not enjoying classical music. No, that scorn is reserved for those of us who will admit to detesting jazz. I’ll sit through an opera, if required, and usually find something to enjoy in the experience; but force me to choose between a Miles Davis retrospective and a Taylor Swift concert, and I’m taking Tay Tay quicker than you can say “Shake It Off”. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/166 "2019-08-23T17:24:51Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > It’s not reverse snobbery, either – I don’t perceive any stigma against not enjoying classical music. No, that scorn is reserved for those of us who will admit to detesting jazz. I’ll sit through an opera, if required, and usually find something to enjoy in the experience; but force me to choose between a Miles Davis retrospective and a Taylor Swift concert, and I’m taking Tay Tay quicker than you can say “Shake It Off”. I get where you’re coming from, but saying you detest jazz is simply a too general statement to make, in the same way as it would be for classical music. There are light years in between Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker, Chet Baker, John Coltrane, Bill Evans, and on and on. To be clear, “too general” here applies to people at large, not you specifically. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/167 "2019-08-23T18:27:10Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > I get where you’re coming from, but saying you detest jazz is simply a too general statement to make, in the same way as it would be for classical music. There are light years in between Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker, Chet Baker, John Coltrane, Bill Evans, and on and on. To be clear, “too general” here applies to people at large, not you specifically. I agree it’s too general. I can qualify that statement. I dislike unstructured jazz that sounds like an orchestra tuning up. Not sure how to quantify it. I like a song that wanders a bit but at some point It needs to be recognizable. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/168 "2019-08-23T18:27:51Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > What you can’t say is that you got \*more \*enjoyment than someone who immerses themselves purely in the sensory nature of the music. Yes, you can. You can do so for several reasons. Firstly, the person who understands music did not always do so, and can see their enjoyment increasing as they understand more. And secondly, the person who understands the music still has the full sensory experience, and they have something more. You seem to think that enjoyment, entertainment, appreciation, whatever you want to call it, is a purely emotional thing. It isn’t, and whether or not you enjoy something is dependent on understanding. Were that not the case, you could have no more enjoyment of music than you could of the random sounds of, well, anything. If you don’t want to take the time to increase your understanding, and hence enjoyment, of anything - art or anything else - that’s up to you, time is of course finite. But don’t make excuses for it, or criticise those who simply observe what you are doing. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/169 "2019-08-23T18:57:01Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > It’s not reverse snobbery, either – I don’t perceive any stigma against not enjoying classical music. No, that scorn is reserved for those of us who will admit to detesting jazz. I’ll sit through an opera, if required, and usually find something to enjoy in the experience; but force me to choose between a Miles Davis retrospective and a Taylor Swift concert, and I’m taking Tay Tay quicker than you can say “Shake It Off”. To expand a bit on what **Fiddle Peghead** said, can you honestly say you don’t like Dixieland jazz? That was the pop music of the 1920s, before jazz started to get really “hot” (improvisational, experimental) and before the 1930s turned pop jazz into big band music which simply wasn’t as much fun on the whole. The difficulty of that music is the recording quality, frankly: The old cylinders and records tend to be scratchy messes. Modern revival groups can be pretty good, though. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/170 "2019-08-23T19:03:23Z")
Some classical music lends itself to workplace listening. I find that a lot of Baroque music goes well with looking at pathology cases. Something about the precision, I think. Late in the day though I need a pick-me-up, which generally is when the iPod goes on rock shuffle. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/171 "2019-08-23T19:04:02Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I agree it’s too general. I can qualify that statement. I dislike unstructured jazz that sounds like an orchestra tuning up. Not sure how to quantify it. I like a song that wanders a bit but at some point It needs to be recognizable. You’d probably like 1920s jazz, then; the genre started to get difficult for most people to follow in the 1940s with bebop, and that line of descent got increasingly _avant garde_ as time went on right up through free jazz. [“The Livery Stable Blues” by the Original Dixieland Jass Band](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WojNaU4-kI) is the first jazz recording. Good quality, too. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/172 "2019-08-23T19:22:53Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > You’d probably like 1920s jazz, then; the genre started to get difficult for most people to follow in the 1940s with bebop, and that line of descent got increasingly _avant garde_ as time went on right up through free jazz. > > [“The Livery Stable Blues” by the Original Dixieland Jass Band](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WojNaU4-kI) is the first jazz recording. Good quality, too. Yes, you’re right. That’s in line with what I listen to. [Benny Green Trio.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNU5tOl5HTA) that’s about as far off the reservation that I want a melody to wander. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/173 "2019-08-23T19:49:59Z")
> [@Novelty Bobble](#): > > I hear all the audible sounds that are available, same as you do. This is a major misconception. **We don’t hear music in the ear, we hear it in the brain.** If you want to know just how different people’s response to music can be, read _Musicophilia, Tales of Music and the Brain_ by Oliver Sacks. Hearing music is nothing like making a copy of a recording. It depends on our unique neurological system. If we listen with attention to some aspect of the music, then we increase our ability to hear it, because the brain develops more connections to do so. Scientific American: [Music And The Brain](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/music-and-the-brain-2006-09/) > [@](#): > > Imaging studies of the cerebral cortex find greater activation in the auditory regions of the right temporal lobe when subjects are focusing on aspects of harmony. Timbre also has been assigned a right temporal lobe preference. … > > Brain responses also depend on the experiences and training of the listener. Even a little training can quickly alter the brain’s reactions. For instance, until about 10 years ago, scientists believed that tuning was fixed for each cell in the auditory cortex. Our studies on contour, however, made us suspect that cell tuning might be altered during learning so that certain cells become extra sensitive to sounds that attract attention and are stored in memory. … > > Just as some training increases the number of cells that respond to a sound when it becomes important, prolonged learning produces more marked responses and physical changes in the brain. The whole article is worth reading. And you can probably find hundreds more studies that go into this in more detail. Scientific research shows that learning and conscious attention physically affects our ability to hear music. Learning intellectually about the structure of a genre of music, and listening with attention to what we have learned, affects neurological processing and changes what we hear. Hearing music is not the same for everyone, nor for one person over time if they cultivate the ability to hear. A professional musician in a certain genre will literally hear far more than someone who is not. And the reason they will hear more is intellectual knowledge and long experience of attention to particular details. If we are not familiar with a particular type of music, we have to cultivate the ability to hear and enjoy it. ---
**Author:** ![Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/les_espaces_du_sommeil/32/308_2.png) [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Les_Espaces_Du_Sommeil)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/174 "2019-08-23T19:55:55Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I agree it’s too general. I can qualify that statement. **I dislike unstructured jazz that sounds like an orchestra tuning up**. Not sure how to quantify it. I like a song that wanders a bit but at some point It needs to be recognizable. So, you have nothing against **Miles Davis** after all ;). ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/175 "2019-08-23T19:58:02Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > You seem to think that enjoyment, entertainment, appreciation, whatever you want to call it, is a purely emotional thing. Again, what is this insistence of some people to tell Novelty Bobble how to enjoy music? I’m not really sure why I’m writing this. NB can speak for himself. I just don’t get it… ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/176 "2019-08-23T20:08:01Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > **We don’t hear music in the ear, we hear it in the brain.** And isn’t it the strangest fucking thing? Something outside our brain moves, causing waves to enter our ears. These waves are propagated from the ear to the brain by those tiny “ear parts” that we all learned about in grade school. Whatever this “signal” is, it somehow gets to its last point in the brain, and we hear. But what are we hearing? It almost as if there are tiny speakers in our brains that amplify this signal. But then that would have to go somewhere to be processed, and the whole thing starts over again. What _is_ this? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/177 "2019-08-23T20:23:50Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > **We don’t hear music in the ear, we hear it in the brain.** To be perfectly honest, some of my favourite music over the years has rather by-passed the higher brain-functions, and been delivered via ear straight to the ass-shaking department. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/178 "2019-08-23T20:28:28Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > And isn’t it the strangest fucking thing? Something outside our brain moves, causing waves to enter our ears. These waves are propagated from the ear to the brain by those tiny “ear parts” that we all learned about in grade school. Whatever this “signal” is, it somehow gets to its last point in the brain, and we hear. But what are we hearing? It almost as if there are tiny speakers in our brains that amplify this signal. But then that would have to go somewhere to be processed, and the whole thing starts over again. What _is_ this? 😕 And why can I replay in my head big chunks of music, in a way that I can’t with any other sensory input? It’s not even just an aural thing - I certainly can’t replay/recall extended amounts of speech in the same way. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/179 "2019-08-23T20:33:06Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > [Music And The Brain](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/music-and-the-brain-2006-09/) Music And The Brian One Is A Genius And The Other’s Insane! ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957/180 "2019-08-23T20:43:03Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > And why can I replay in my head big chunks of music, in a way that I can’t with any other sensory input? It’s not even just an aural thing - I certainly can’t replay/recall extended amounts of speech in the same way. Practice. Consciously or not, you’ve probably spent more time memorizing music than speech, so you are better at it. ~Max [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classical-music-haters-why/838957.md?page=10)