# Classified Documents Found in Biden Private Office in November 2022 (January 9, 2023) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2023, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945 "2023-01-09T23:09:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/161 "2023-01-15T02:59:29Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > They’ve been in Biden’s possession for years. Yes. And no one knew about them at all. The National Archives only learned of it because Biden’s legal team contacted them and made immediate arrangements for their return. As anyone should do if they find classified materials in their inadvertent possession. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/162 "2023-01-15T03:39:09Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > Not to mention [DJT passing classified info to Russian diplomats _in person_.](https://www.npr.org/2017/05/15/528511980/report-trump-gave-classified-information-to-russians-during-white-house-visit) I agree with you on that being quite bad. But I never thought that Trump retaining worthless (from the point of view of what a reputable auction house might take and sell) and likely over-classified documents ranked high on the list of his misdeeds. I wonder if the other living former U.S. Presidents, vice-presidents, and Secretaries of State, Defense, and Energy are reviewing, at least in their minds, whether they may have any secret documents that they shouldn’t have. If all of them except Biden and Trump were meticulous in leaving physical government property with the government when leaving office, then there is legitimate reason to wonder about Biden. Or is this common? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/163 "2023-01-15T03:43:03Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > But I never thought that Trump retaining worthless (from the point of view of what a reputable auction house might take and sell) and likely over-classified documents ranked high on the list of his misdeeds. When you have evidence that this was the case, please be sure to post it. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/164 "2023-01-15T03:49:58Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > When you have evidence that this was the case, please be sure to post it. I was thinking that it would be both unpatriotic and illegal for an American auction house to sell classified documents, unless there is clear documentation of declassification. Is that the part of my post that needs citations, or is it something else? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/165 "2023-01-15T03:51:17Z")
The part that they were “likely over-classified” documents. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/166 "2023-01-15T03:58:01Z")
> [@mundylion](#): > > Carlson is fun to hate but he sure does have a staff that can make an interesting 10 minute case. > **[You Literally Can't Believe The Facts Tucker Carlson Tells You. So Say Fox's...](https://www.npr.org/2020/09/29/917747123/you-literally-cant-believe-the-facts-tucker-carlson-tells-you-so-say-fox-s-lawye)** > > Fox News viewers don't expect facts from Tucker Carlson, according to network lawyers who defended their star in a slander lawsuit filed by a woman who said she had an affair with President Trump. Do you have something from a person who hasn’t insisted that people should not take him literally? I mean, I find a lot of stand up comedians entertaining, but I wouldn’t cite their jokes as facts. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/167 "2023-01-15T04:04:49Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The part that they were “likely over-classified” documents. Yes, that statement was a personal opinion. ---
**Author:** ![mundylion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundylion/32/3604_2.png) [@mundylion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mundylion)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/168 "2023-01-15T04:38:24Z")
[NPR.org](http://NPR.org). Nuff said ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/169 "2023-01-15T05:07:13Z")
> **['I lie': Oops. Fox News host Tucker Carlson says the quiet part loud](https://www.azcentral.com/story/entertainment/media/2021/09/15/tucker-carlson-lies/8336612002/)** > > In an interview with Dave Rubin on BlazeTV's 'Rubin Report,' Tucker Carlson acknowledges that he lies. In other news, Phoenix is hot in the summer. > **[Analysis | A judge uses Tucker Carlson’s own words against Fox News](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/03/09/judge-uses-tucker-carlsons-own-words-against-fox-news/)** > > The judge says Carlson's skepticism of Sidney Powell's voting-machine claims is the best evidence that Fox meets a key legal standard for defamation. > **[Fox wins McDougal case, argues no one takes Tucker Carlson seriously](https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-karen-mcdougal-case-tucker-carlson-2020-9?amp)** > > Tucker Carlson has a long history of making racist and controversial statements as a primetime host on Fox News. I can go all day. Not that it will help, I’m sure. Or do you only trust Fox News? Because their own legal folks made that claim. ---
**Author:** ![mundylion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundylion/32/3604_2.png) [@mundylion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mundylion)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/170 "2023-01-15T05:09:06Z")
My apologies to Atamasama with the NPR reply. Too much bourbon. But the Tucker piece I linked was not a fact thing, but opinion. Disagree with the opinion, fine. I still think the opinion has merit. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/171 "2023-01-15T05:09:51Z")
> [@mundylion](#): > > My apologies to Atamasama with the NPR reply. Too much bourbon. Apology accepted. Bourbon is awesome. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2023, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/172 "2023-01-15T23:57:16Z")
I spent 10 years working for the U.S. Department of State. Even at my low level, I saw dozens of classified documents every single day, and probably a half-dozen of those were stamped top secret. As you move up the food chain in government, the number of classified documents you deal with increases by an unimaginable factor. And the classification often seems arbitrary. I recall seeing cables marked “Secret” that were only announcing someone’s birthday. Now, this is just in one department. The DOS generates a humongous amount of cable traffic from its overseas embassies. And, in turn, the department generates a like amount back to overseas posts. The subject matter of lot of these cables can end up at the highest levels of the department, congress, and yes, the White House. Now imagine interagency paperwork, much of which is classified at one level or another. Reams and reams of memos, letters, cables, and other communiques. Letters dealing with the most sensitive matters imaginable. It’s a small miracle that reams of them aren’t misplaced (and perhaps they are). So when the amounts found in both Trump’s and Biden’s possession are this small (yes, 300 is small), one has to turn to intent. How was the discovery handled? Were they promptly turned over? Was there an attempt to hide or destroy them? In Biden’s case, 10 or 15 documents could have easily and inadvertently been included along with the piles of personal papers removed from the White House. People are fallible and accidents happen. In Trump’s case, several hundred documents that were clearly stashed together looks a bit more suspicious. Given all this, it’s somewhat hypocritical that the new House majority is pursuing this, while I’m fairly certain that they are frantically scouring their own offices and homes to make sure they haven’t accidently removed and documents themselves. But any leverage is good leverage, right? And there’s nothing like tit-for-tat to get the masses riled up. Meanwhile, meaningful governance goes wanting. ---
**Author:** ![doowright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@doowright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doowright)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/173 "2023-01-16T12:46:35Z")
To be fair, he did do it, too. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/174 "2023-01-16T13:08:29Z")
> [@mundylion](#): > > But the Tucker piece I linked was not a fact thing, but opinion. Disagree with the opinion, fine. I think you missed the cites that say that Fox News says that reasonable people shouldn’t take Carlson seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/175 "2023-01-16T14:00:19Z")
Reasonable people don’t watch FoxNews in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/176 "2023-01-16T14:03:04Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I think you missed the cites that say that Fox News says that reasonable people shouldn’t take Carlson seriously. Except the judge in the March 9 article did take Carlson seriously, as evidence that some people at Fox, namely like Carlson, were pushing back hard on the « steal » arguments, and that undermined Fox’s defence. > [@](#): > > In the course of laying out the legal requirements for Smartmatic to prove its case, the judge noted that the company must prove Fox met the standard of acting with “[actual malice](https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation)” — i.e. not merely promoting false claims, but doing so either knowing they were false or with reckless disregard for whether they were false. And on that count, the judge says the best evidence that it did is Carlson. > > That’s because Carlson, unlike the others, applied significant actual skepticism to the claims — and broadcast it. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/177 "2023-01-16T15:32:20Z")
If it is “common” for classified docs to end up in politicians’ personal papers, oughtn’t we expect a large number of disclosures from other past presidents, veeps, congresscritters, cabinet officials, etc - from both sides? Or a report from the Archives documenting how frequently it was handled quietly in the past? Doesn’t seem likely that it was just Trump and Biden. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/178 "2023-01-16T16:22:28Z")
The conventional wisdom seems to be that, yeah, it happens, but it’s never been noteworthy because the materials were always immediately surrendered when found. Trump changed the rules because he did it deliberately and then fought recovery. If there are any records of prior incidents, it would certainly be illuminating. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/179 "2023-01-16T16:40:18Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I don’t understand how you can blame this on ‘staffers’ without any evidence. Documents have now been found in three places (or is it four now?) They’ve been in Biden’s possession for years. He owns this. I find the opposite implausible. As VP and even thereafter I imagine the only interaction he had with documents was to have them handed to him by a staffer and to hand them back to a staffer. The notion that he did any of the filing himself, or had anything to do with the nuts and bolts of the document flow through his office, is pretty tough to believe. That goes double for moving documents from one office to another or to storage. He still owns it, of course, because he’s responsible for what goes on in his office. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2023, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945/180 "2023-01-16T16:48:08Z")
So you are suggesting that a staffer went into a secured document facility, snuck out secret documents for some reason, took them to Joe Biden’s garage in Delaware and left them in a box? Do ‘staffers’ even have access to such documents? Is there any evidence at all that this is what happened? By the way, the house was being rented by Hunter at the time, who we all know is extremely careful with documents and secrets. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/classified-documents-found-in-biden-private-office-in-november-2022-january-9-2023/977945.md?page=10)