# CLee, a word (or 500). AKA - the next JayDub pile on thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clee-a-word-or-500-aka-the-next-jaydub-pile-on-thread/670892 "2013-10-10T17:37:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 2\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clee-a-word-or-500-aka-the-next-jaydub-pile-on-thread/670892/121 "2013-10-12T00:52:23Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > I don’t know. If I were in a situation where I was scared of persecution from an anti-Semitic government, I might say anti-Semitic things without actually being anti-Semitic. > > But there seems to be sort of a double standard here? Because on the one hand, they do try to stay true to their beliefs in spite of persecution and they get criticized like this: > > And they write a letter to Hitler saying, “Hey, you’re cool. Don’t kill us. We’re all for you! Please don’t kill us!”, and people say, > > So, what should they have done? If sticking to their principles and getting persecuted is bad, and bending their principles to avoid persecution is bad, it seems like they can’t win. If you are ‘bending principles’ to ‘avoid persecution’ - then you are giving in to ‘satan earthly stuff’ - which is exaactly what they tell the followers not to do - contrast that with the ‘no transfusions’ - any little transgression of the ‘principles’ is seen as a disfellowshipping offense - yet when the ‘governing body’ deems it necessary (removal of pages from a book to get out of prison, pleading with Hitler that they agree with his principles, join with the UN to get a ‘library card’) - thats ‘ok’. You’re right - ‘what could they do’ ? they could be less hypocritical about it for starters. They could act a little less “holier then thou” when they deride “all of christendom” for doing these same things that they have done. They are not the first to refuse service in the military and been shot for it - but they are one of the few that figured that ‘publishing books and watchtowers’ was more important than living - if they were ‘bible students’ - they shouldn’t have needed those materials anyway. As far as what they could have done in Germany, at the time? Maybe they could have worried a little less about publishing books and ‘door to door’ and a little more about family and other things - maybe Rutherford could have done a little less to make the JW a target for the regime? It’s all armchair quarterbacking for sure - but the one thing you don’t do - ‘If you’re gods organization hoping for the downfall of earthly governments so that the theocratic world can begin’ - is pick sides with one of those earthly governments. As for the “anti-semitic” to ‘fit in’ - that would make them publishing lies, right? the JW are taught that EVERYTHING the Watchtower publishes is by virtue of them being chosen - as if the words come from Jehovah himself - and god hates lies - therefore those words are meant as ‘truth’ - they should have no need to ‘please earthly people’ to fit in - in fact, they see persecution as a sign of them being ‘right’ - so - no - that doesnt work as an excuse either. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clee-a-word-or-500-aka-the-next-jaydub-pile-on-thread/670892/122 "2013-10-12T01:09:05Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > I don’t know. If I were in a situation where I was scared of persecution from an anti-Semitic government, I might say anti-Semitic things without actually being anti-Semitic. > > \ To re-address this - many of the anti-Semitic comments and the two I specifically quoted - were well before Hitler took power - years before - so that fails the sniff test as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clee-a-word-or-500-aka-the-next-jaydub-pile-on-thread/670892.md?page=6)