# Clinton v Trump - The Stretch Run Thread
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277
**Category:** Politics & Elections
**Created:** [September 30, 2016, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277 "2016-09-30T11:21:19Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 47
### Author:  [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/923 "2016-10-08T17:12:06Z")
> [@tomndebb](#):
>
> Sorry. I doubt that your projected future is accurate.
>
> Trump runs on anything that inflates his ego and denies anything that would harm the ego of a person with more humanity.
>
> His charity, like most of his enterprises, appears to have been a sham, so its loss is no issue. His “brand” does not need 100% support. Few television shows since the rise of cable, to say nothing of the internet, have needed anything like 20% of potential viewers to be successful. The Apprentice was moderately successful for over ten years and in its largest audience in its most successful season it only garnered fewer than 29 million viewers–roughly 1 in 10 people in the U.S. at the time. His current “popularity” was around 30% before this current tape’s release, and he will not lose two thirds of his supporters among the sort of people who have already supported him after his remarks regarding Megyn Kelly and others.
>
> If he can attract attention, he can sell his “brand” in a number of enterprises.
> (I suspect that he might have a bit more trouble getting funding for property gambles with the amount of publicity that his tendency to abandon projects, stiffing his investors and creditors, has produced, but even there, he can probably con enough investors to continue rolling along.)
[Here](http://adexchanger.com/politics/donald-trump-politician-affects-trump-business/) is a link posted by **MacCat** in another thread.
> [@](#):
>
> His companies have experienced some short-term gains, since the campaign spends on them as well, but most outside data sources see major risks for the brand’s long-term standing. No Trump company is publicly traded, so exact figures aren’t available.
> [@](#):
>
> Foursquare recently compiled data tracking its user check-ins at Trump hotels and golf courses, showing a dip in traffic to those properties. Notably, Foursquare’s data found that Trump’s blue-state hotels (in Hawaii, New York and Illinois) fared significantly worse than hotels in more politically competitive states (like Florida or Nevada).
>
> Trump’s hotel business has seen its biggest drop among women: Female visitors are down 30%, compared to just 3% for men, according to Foursquare.
>
> Trump Hotels have lost almost 60% market share compared to last year, according to year-to-data figures from the online travel-booking site Hipmunk.
and
> [@](#):
>
> A long-running consumer survey from BAV Consulting, a firm within WPP’s Young & Rubicam, found the biggest downturn for the Trump brand among those who make $150,000 or more per year, followed closely by those making more than $100,000 per year. BAV President Will Johnson wrote in Politico Magazine in January that the Trump brand’s association with traits like “prestigious” and “upper class” have dropped by as much as 50% with high earners.
He might have a future on Fox News. No other network with cable number \< 300 is going to touch him. He will have a brand - but it will be a WalMart brand, not a Macy’s brand, and it will bring in a lot less revenue. And he is going to have a hell of time convincing people with money to let him brand his buildings. Places in his residential buildings no longer command a premium.
The article is from August - who the hell with any money is going to want to live in a Trump building now?
---
### Author:  [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/924 "2016-10-08T17:12:43Z")
> [@Voyager](#):
>
> He did not do anything to the woman mentioned in the video - but his words make the stories of women who claimed he assaulted them a lot more believable.
That’s true, but the one case that several posts have now mentioned/linked has some significant complications (ie Harth later ‘dated’ Trump, see NYT link\*) compared to the again imagined hypothetical ‘walked up and grabbed genitals’ end of story. Yes the tape is also significant wrt various stories along the way with non-groping crude remarks and unsolicited kissing stuff on Apprentice and beauty contests.
\*No point in sidetracking to how that should/shouldn’t impact anything. Like the crude remarks video itself, the chips just fall where they fall with the relevant voters. You or I could cry ‘zero relevance!’ from the highest mountain about various aspects of real stories which differ from the hypothetical criminal acts in various posts on the thread, but so what from those voters’ POV?
---
### Author:  [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/925 "2016-10-08T17:13:55Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> Look. If you’re asking me if I think Trump has ever sexually assaulted a woman, I’d say “yeah, probably”. For men of his generation, in his position of power… it would be odd if they didn’t, at some time, behave in that manner.
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#):
>
> Holy shit.
[Word.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXsbWJC8VM4&t=0m50s)
---
### Author:  [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/926 "2016-10-08T17:18:53Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#):
>
> Oh, don’t get me wrong - I absolutely agree with the above. My objection is not “he admitted to committing sexual assault”, but rather “he is boasting about committing what would functionally be sexual assault.” Now if he had actually said he walked up to Nancy O’Dell and specifically groped/kissed her without a by-your-leave, THEN I’d accuse him directly.
>
> Do I think he sexually harassed people? Yeah, absolutely. He’s just that type of vile narcissist. Do I think he could get convicted on these schoolyard boasts on _this_ tape? No.
>
> But it would sure be a nice bit of character evidence at a trial.
\*\*Tamerlane,\*\*you are a lot smarter than most of the others here (including me), but are you really unaware that many men (and especially braggarts like the Donald) love to boast about non-existent sexual prowess and conquests? I mean, its pretty much SOP. He is not boasting about committing sexual assualt, he is boasting about his virility and attractiveness.
Face it the only thing the Donald grabs when propositioning a woman is his chequebook.
Which is one of the reasons why he is doing so well, people lose their minds over him and this could backfire if its not seen as anything but what it is, example no 11174 iof why he is a despicable man with a sad empty boast rather than him being some sort of criminal.
Rubio probably regrets the day ge broght up Trump’s hands.
---
### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/927 "2016-10-08T17:20:50Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#):
>
> I think the ick factor is got to be strong among female voters. My reaction to this story, first and foremost, is Eeewwwwww.
>
> We’ve all encountered that guy. **The one that’s so full of himself that he doesn’t realize it takes two to consent.** The clueless troll that stuffs his gross halitosis ridden mouth full of tic-tacs before grabbing you with a clumsy lunge and artlessly trying to cram his tongue down your throat, because he’s convinced he’s so desirable that every woman wants a piece of him. And even after he’s been roundly rebuffed, he remains smug in his conviction that it took some great act of willpower on your part to resist his advances. If you tell him you’d rather stick your tongue in a coffee grinder, he remains condescendingly smug.
>
> We all hate that guy. EEWW !!
Bolding mine.
That’s a truly beautiful turn of phrase. Perfectly describes Trump and the others like him.
Agree with the chorus of men saying this behavior is not in fact garden variety male thinking. At least not from 21st Century males even remotely not disqualified from any position of responsibility by their abject lack of morals.
---
### Author:  [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/928 "2016-10-08T17:21:25Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> Look. If you’re asking me if I think Trump has ever sexually assaulted a woman, I’d say “yeah, probably”. For men of his generation, in his position of power… it would be odd if they didn’t, at some time, behave in that manner.
>
> But am I going to convict him on his little bragging routine with Billy Bush? No. It really is the kind of locker room talk you hear all the time among guys. It could be true, it might not be true. And Trump is not exactly known for telling the truth, is he?
>
> Let the women step forward, as they did with Bill Cosby, and tell the world what happened. Then we can all judge one way or another. It looks like that might be starting to happen, per the link provided by **monstro**. But it would be much better, more credible, if the claim were made by someone not afraid of identifying herself.
I think you’re missing the point. This video doesn’t prove he’s guilty of assault. It proves he’s _okay with assault_, and thinks it’s worth bragging about.
But what about your friends? Do you really hear bragging about groping all the time? I was in the Navy and I didn’t hear that – I heard lewd sex talk, but not groping and assault talk.
---
### Author:  [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/929 "2016-10-08T17:22:11Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#):
>
> Holy shit.
No, he has a point. I’m rapidly becoming convinced that it’s Trump who’s the real victim here. Also, both sides do it and Trump is just saying what everyone is thinking.
---
### Author:  [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/930 "2016-10-08T17:23:44Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> Firstly, we’re talking about what guys “trash talk” about, not about what they actually do. Secondly, there isn’t anything in the video/audio that is “sexual assault”. He claims:
>
> \*Trump: Yeah, that’s her. With the gold. I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star they let you do it. You can do anything.
>
> Bush: Whatever you want.
>
> Trump: Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything.\*
>
> They let you do it. There isn’t anything in there that says something along the lines of “she tried to get away, but I grabbed her anyway”. Now, you might question whether they really “let” him do it, but that is what he is claiming.
>
> If I’m missing something, please quote the part where there is a clear act of sexual assault. [Here is the transcript.](https://mic.com/articles/156222/donald-trump-billy-bush-leaked-video-full-transcript-read-the-full-sexist-exchange-here#.rXIdi7gPk)
John, let me talk to you like a big brother here.
Listen to the advice of the Pointer Sisters first…
_I want a man with a slow hand
I want a lover with an easy touch
I want somebody who will spend some time
Not come and go in a heated rush
I want somebody who will understand
When it comes to love, I want a slow hand_
-Slow Hand-
GRABBING a woman’s crotch is a no-no. Women don’t like it, no matter what they do thereafter, they didn’t invite it, desire it or deserve it.
Slow hand my friend, slow hand.
---
### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/931 "2016-10-08T17:25:31Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> You guys must live in protective bubbles if you’ve only heard “a handful” of guys talk like that. Only a few that I know of would say that in mixed company, but among the guys? Lots of guys, all the time. I personally dislike that type of banter, and agree that it’s usually assholes who spout it. There are a lot of assholes out there…
>
> And if I had a nickel for every time someone said “this will be the nail in his coffin” on this MB, I could retire without paying any taxes!
>
> I give Trump a very low percentage chance to win. Before this latest scandal and after.
Even in Thailand, I never heard guys bragging about how hard they tried to fuck a married woman. Not once. Trump has clearly gone too far this time. Finally.
> [@bucketybuck](#):
>
> Why was it not difficult looking them in the eye a week ago?
>
> Anybody with integrity could already see what type of person Trump was without needing videos like these to hammer home the fact, if people like Pence now want to pretend that videos like this change anything then they are just full of shit.
My apologies if this offends the Christians here, but my experience is the more devout, the more naive. And Trump is a showman. We don’t know the conversations they had early on, but I am sure Trump was able to persuade Pence he was a reformed man. And I’m sure Pence wanted to believe the best, especially if he had any notion that god wanted to propel him into the national political limelight.
---
### Author:  [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/932 "2016-10-08T17:26:09Z")
Clinton has made the rounds. She has went around to each table, given them what they wanted and moved on to the next interest group’s table. She has built the coalition: the women, the students, the hispanics, the neoconservatives/neoMcCartyites, the old people/SDMB crowd, and the government employees. I have been sitting here waiting all night, nursing half a beer, checking my phone for good news from Trump that never comes. I’ve been in the room but have been ignored.
Until now:
“But If Everybody’s Watching, You Know, All Of The Back Room Discussions And The Deals, You Know, Then People Get A Little Nervous, To Say The Least. So, You Need Both A Public And A Private Position.”
“The Simpson-Bowles Framework And The Big Elements Of It Were Right… You Have To Restrain Spending…”
“My dream is a hemispheric common market, with open trade and open borders, some time in the future…"
Hillary, darling, how are you!
---
### Author:  [@AnalogSignal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnalogSignal)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/933 "2016-10-08T17:26:23Z")
> [@running\_coach](#):
>
> [Pence is refusing to defend Trump.](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/oct/08/donald-trump-tape-quit-republicans-lewd-comments)
Pence was OK with Trump attacking the Mexicans and Mooslems but now it turns out Trump has assaulted White Women. That is a bridge too far for the Republican weasels – White Women are off limits.
---
### Author:  [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/934 "2016-10-08T17:26:30Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#):
>
> At least not from 21st Century males even remotely not disqualified from any position of responsibility by their abject lack of morals.
Yes, but the point is that on the whole list of objectionable things Trump has said or done in his life or even in the last 36 hours, this is rather low. We know he is a waste of matter unqualified to run even a lemonade stand.
If we discovered that Pope Francis has a secret furry fetish, then that would be news (:D), but Trump is a crass, boastful, thin-skinned, woman hating semi-sentient Orangutang and that was know before this video.
---
### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/935 "2016-10-08T17:30:40Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#):
>
> My apologies if this offends the Christians here, but my experience is the more devout, the more naive. And Trump is a showman. We don’t know the conversations they had early on, but I am sure Trump was able to persuade Pence he was a reformed man. And I’m sure Pence wanted to believe the best, especially if he had any notion that god wanted to propel him into the national political limelight.
> [@AnalogSignal](#):
>
> Pence was OK with Trump attacking the Mexicans and Mooslems but now it turns out Trump has assaulted White Women. That is a bridge too far for the Republican weasels – White Women are off limits.
Yes, or it could be that too.
---
### Author:  [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/936 "2016-10-08T17:31:01Z")
[QUOTE=Siam Sam]
Trump has clearly gone too far this time. Finally
[/QUOTE]
Famous words. Which have been said
i) When he called Mexicans rapists
ii) Attacked Free Trade
iii) Called for a wall
iv) Brought up Megan Kelly’s periods
v) Talked about banning muslims
vi) Killing peoples families
vii) Attacked family members of a dead serviceman
viii) Talked about wanting to bang his own daughter
ix) Backtracked on birtherism
x) Opened his mouth at any time since…
Yeah, so pardon my scepticism.
---
### Author:  [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/937 "2016-10-08T17:31:02Z")
Trump’s latest tweet:
> [@](#):
>
> Certainly has been an interesting 24 hours!
---
### Author:  [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/938 "2016-10-08T17:31:44Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#):
>
> I think you’re missing the point. This video doesn’t prove he’s guilty of assault. It proves he’s _okay with assault_, and thinks it’s worth bragging about.
>
> But what about your friends? Do you really hear bragging about groping all the time? I was in the Navy and I didn’t hear that – I heard lewd sex talk, but not groping and assault talk.
Yeah the Navy doesn’t really talk about it, right, they’re [doers](http://www.military.com/daily-news/2014/12/04/study-female-marines-sailors-at-higher-risk-of-sexual-assault.html)?
---
### Author:  [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/939 "2016-10-08T17:33:06Z")
> [@AK84](#):
>
> Yes, but the point is that on the whole list of objectionable things Trump has said or done in his life or even in the last 36 hours, this is rather low.
No. Bragging about sexual **assault** is not a triviality.
---
### Author:  [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/940 "2016-10-08T17:34:51Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#):
>
> I think the ick factor is got to be strong among female voters. My reaction to this story, first and foremost, is Eeewwwwww.
The majority of my middle/upper middle class midwestern catholic friends are still voting for Trump. The females are the most adamant. Because abortion.:smack:
---
### Author:  [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/941 "2016-10-08T17:35:05Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#):
>
> Clinton has made the rounds. She has went around to each table, given them what they wanted and moved on to the next interest group’s table. She has built the coalition: the women, the students, the hispanics, the neoconservatives/neoMcCartyites, the old people/SDMB crowd, and the government employees. I have been sitting here waiting all night, nursing half a beer, checking my phone for good news from Trump that never comes. I’ve been in the room but have been ignored.
>
> Until now:
>
> “But If Everybody’s Watching, You Know, All Of The Back Room Discussions And The Deals, You Know, Then People Get A Little Nervous, To Say The Least. So, You Need Both A Public And A Private Position.”
>
> “The Simpson-Bowles Framework And The Big Elements Of It Were Right… You Have To Restrain Spending…”
>
> “My dream is a hemispheric common market, with open trade and open borders, some time in the future…"
>
> Hillary, darling, how are you!
Life for a Trump supporter must be a cross between searching for an appropriate end of life option and researching a permanent move to the Ukraine. Hopefully they will not chose option one.
---
### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2016, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-the-stretch-run-thread/767277/942 "2016-10-08T17:35:14Z")
> [@AK84](#):
>
> Famous words. Which have been said
>
> i) When he called Mexicans rapists
> ii) Attacked Free Trade
> iii) Called for a wall
> iv) Brought up Megan Kelly’s periods
> v) Talked about banning muslims
> vi) Killing peoples families
> vii) Attacked family members of a dead serviceman
> viii) Talked about wanting to bang his own daughter
> ix) Backtracked on birtherism
> x) Opened his mouth at any time since…
>
> Yeah, so pardon my scepticism.
Why do you love Trump?
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