# Clinton v. Trump: Who would make the better POTUS? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 10, 2016, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031 "2016-06-10T16:53:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/41 "2016-06-11T03:28:14Z")
It might not be what you want, but the next four years will not be terrible if you vote for Clinton. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/42 "2016-06-11T03:45:23Z")
> [@elfkin477](#): > > They both would/will be awful. It doesn’t matter who is elected, the next four years are going to be terrible. Why do you think that? There’s a good chance that Clinton’s administration will be more of the same…have the last 4 years been terrible for you? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/43 "2016-06-11T03:49:20Z")
They should be a damn site better, actually. SHe’s got better relationships with all the power brokers in DC. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/44 "2016-06-11T05:27:01Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It might not be what you want, but the next four years will not be terrible if you vote for Clinton. Bwahahaha. That is funny. If Clinton wins, and I can see her losing by reverting to her normal behavior which is to lie about everything, we will have another 4 years (at least) of the email scandal type shit\*. Clinton doing things that are sketchy as hell that would get just about anyone else run out of office. Lots of bullshit from partisans on both sides. Time, money and political capital wasted on easily avoidable, self-inflicted scandals. Two years in the Rs retake the house and senate. All the while the politics won’t change much. The budget will be hosed, debt will increase, a lot of lip service will be paid to problems but not a lot will be done. And that which is done will be done to buy more votes so the utter scum we elect can get reelected. In other words, the exact same shit that has been going on forever. I don’t like Trump, but I understand the appeal. All of the politicians are self-serving liars and Trump, in an odd way, refutes that while being a self-serving liar. Contradictory? Yep. But it seems to be working. Trump is blatant about it while Clinton (and the rest of the politicians, both R and D) acts as though she has a bit of integrity when we all know she lies about everything. No matter who is elected, we will all eat the same shit sandwich. And it our own damned fault for electing these bozos. Slee \*In any sane world, a government official running a private, unsecure server to do classified government business would instantly disqualify that person from any office higher than dog catcher. However, we live in a world where rhetoric matters more than integrity and sound bites matter more than truth. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/45 "2016-06-11T05:34:55Z")
I have no doubt that if Clinton is elected, she will continue to lie and there will be more scandals, because the lesson she keeps learning is that she can get away with anything as long as it doesn’t directly violate the law. But skating right up to that line? She’ll do that with impunity. However, if there’s one thing we learned from the first Clinton administration is that they know their business and are not unduly distracted by dealing with their scandals. If you want a steady hand on the wheel for the next four years it’s hard to beat Clinton in that respect. I understand the appeal of Trump as well, and I think a lot of CLinton supporters are in denial about how many Sanders supporters are going to support him. There are just some issues where Trump is closer to Sanders than Clinton, such as trade and government reform. Hey, didn’t we say we wanted a President who didnt rely on big money donors? Well, Trump hasn’t relied on big money donors, he hasn’t relied on small money donors, he hasn’t even relied on his own money. Only free media. In other words, publicly funded campaigning, minus taxpayers spending the money. But Trump is a fraud, a liar, unaccountable(I had previously thought he was strong in this department, but was very wrong), and unpredictable. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/46 "2016-06-11T05:37:52Z")
> [@sleestak](#): > > Bwahahaha. That is funny. > > If Clinton wins, and I can see her losing by reverting to her normal behavior which is to lie about everything, we will have another 4 years (at least) of the email scandal type shit\*. Clinton doing things that are sketchy as hell that would get just about anyone else run out of office. Lots of bullshit from partisans on both sides. Time, money and political capital wasted on easily avoidable, self-inflicted scandals. Two years in the Rs retake the house and senate. > > All the while the politics won’t change much. The budget will be hosed, debt will increase, a lot of lip service will be paid to problems but not a lot will be done. And that which is done will be done to buy more votes so the utter scum we elect can get reelected. > > In other words, the exact same shit that has been going on forever. > > I don’t like Trump, but I understand the appeal. All of the politicians are self-serving liars and Trump, in an odd way, refutes that while being a self-serving liar. Contradictory? Yep. But it seems to be working. Trump is blatant about it while Clinton (and the rest of the politicians, both R and D) acts as though she has a bit of integrity when we all know she lies about everything. > > No matter who is elected, we will all eat the same shit sandwich. And it our own damned fault for electing these bozos. > > Slee > > \*In any sane world, a government official running a private, unsecure server to do classified government business would instantly disqualify that person from any office higher than dog catcher. However, we live in a world where rhetoric matters more than integrity and sound bites matter more than truth. Or, you’re accepting a bunch of polemics about a minor issue and allowing them to color your perceptions. In any sane world, Hillary’s private server would be a one day story. A bad idea, okay, move on. Also, if you think there is no difference between Clinton and Trump, you have a very shallow understanding of politics. Both sides aren’t equal. One side has promised to have Heritage Foundation approved SCOTUS justices. Appointing 4 of those would fuck this country for decades. America’s standing in the world will crater under Trump. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/47 "2016-06-11T05:39:05Z")
Correction: In a sane world, there’d be a scandal-free, intelligent, stable Republican running against her and he’d absolutely destroy her in the election due to her rather poor relationship with the truth. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/48 "2016-06-11T05:39:20Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > …she can get away with anything as long as it doesn’t directly violate the law. Little known fact, you have that exact same super-power. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/49 "2016-06-11T05:41:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Correction: In a sane world, there’d be a scandal-free, intelligent, stable Republican running against her and he’d absolutely destroy her in the election due to her rather poor relationship with the truth. There are zero intelligent, stable, Republicans that exist who could be chosen by the fucking mental-deficients that make up the GOP base. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/50 "2016-06-11T05:44:58Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Hey, a recession is just an excuse to lower your workers wages, pocket the profit, and maybe scoop up a business on the cheap so you can sell the assets and declare bankruptcy, thus screwing over the creditors… It will be terrific! The BEST recession EVER. It’ll be YUUUUUGE! Yes. Some assume that business tycoons want the economy to prosper, but things aren’t so simple. Recessions disempower workers and empower the elite. During the housing crisis, houses were scooped up at very cheap prices by connected speculators. Heck, wasn’t Trump on record as looking forward to the real estate price collapse? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/51 "2016-06-11T05:46:45Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Little known fact, you have that exact same super-power. :rolleyes: Sort of. I do not get as much benefit of the doubt as the privileged do, so the line is probably drawn a little more clearly for me than it is for her. Secondly, if I was running for office it would be harder to get away with some of the stuff she and her husband have. The pardons which outraged pretty much everyone are apparently forgotten. Perfectly legal, but really should have been the end for them. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/52 "2016-06-11T06:15:48Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Sort of. I do not get as much benefit of the doubt as the privileged do, so the line is probably drawn a little more clearly for me than it is for her. > > Secondly, if I was running for office it would be harder to get away with some of the stuff she and her husband have. The pardons which outraged pretty much everyone are apparently forgotten. Perfectly legal, but really should have been the end for them. Or since no wrongdoing was found, it shouldn’t have. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/53 "2016-06-11T06:21:19Z")
Pardoning campaign contributors is kosher to you? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/54 "2016-06-11T06:30:38Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Pardoning campaign contributors is kosher to you? That’s a bit of a misleading version of events, wouldn’t you say? It’s the donor’s ex wife that donated. Also, funny you should say, “kosher.”: > [@Wikipedia](#): > > Clinton also cited clemency pleas he had received from Israeli government officials, including then-Prime Minister Ehud Barak. Rich had made substantial donations to Israeli charitable foundations over the years, and many senior Israeli officials, such as Shimon Peres and Ehud Olmert, argued on his behalf behind the scenes.[26] Speculation about another rationale for Rich’s pardon involved his alleged involvement with the Israeli intelligence community.[27][28] Rich reluctantly acknowledged in interviews with his biographer, Daniel Ammann, that he had assisted the Mossad, Israel’s intelligence service,[4][13] a claim that Ammann said was confirmed by a former Israeli intelligence officer.[12] According to Ammann, Rich had helped finance the Mossad’s operations and had supplied Israel with strategic amounts of Iranian oil through a secret oil pipeline.[4] The aide to Rich who had persuaded Denise Rich to personally ask President Clinton to review Rich’s pardon request was a former chief of the Mossad, Avner Azulay.[22][29] Another former Mossad chief, Shabtai Shavit, had also urged Clinton to pardon Rich,[30] whom he said had routinely allowed intelligence agents to use his offices around the world.[17] ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/55 "2016-06-11T07:46:05Z")
OP: Please request that this thread be closed, then resubmit it with the poll being public. TIA. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![DerekMichaels00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DerekMichaels00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DerekMichaels00)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/56 "2016-06-11T07:57:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Correction: In a sane world, there’d be a scandal-free, intelligent, stable Republican running against her and he’d absolutely destroy her in the election due to her rather poor relationship with the truth. just curious; what does Hillary actually lie about that matters, that other politicians don’t? And yes, if others do it, it makes it more normal and thus less notable. But my response to the OP; Hillary would because she knows how government works, she knows the actual people in Washington, and she actually wants the job more than the celebrity, unlike Trump. She’s also not going to ruin our relationship with our southern neighbor with whom we’ve been at peace with for 150+ years. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/57 "2016-06-11T08:30:42Z")
The lies about the server matter, because they were an attempt to cover up the real reason: she wanted to avoid letting the public see her emails, except for those she first vetted for release. THe Bosnia lie doesn’t matter, it’s just stupid. But she lies to protect herself from political consequences an inordinate amount of time. ---
**Author:** ![DerekMichaels00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DerekMichaels00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DerekMichaels00)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/58 "2016-06-11T09:56:14Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The lies about the server matter, because they were an attempt to cover up the real reason: she wanted to avoid letting the public see her emails, except for those she first vetted for release. The Bosnia lie doesn’t matter, it’s just stupid. But she lies to protect herself from political consequences an inordinate amount of time. Is the Bosnia thing worse than GW Bush pretending to essentially be someone he was not (as in a Southern Good Ole Boy instead of the scion Andover/Yalie)? “I did not trade arms for hostages” (even tho I think funding the Contras was right, he still lied)? Etc. Also, who would want the public to see their emails? Unless one tapes his convos like Nixon, we should assume pols want their private talk to remain so. Also, what is actually wrong with her having a private server? In the age of hackers, it was a logical thing to want back in 2009, in the daze before Anonymous, Occupy, Wikileaks, etc. Also, its not like Hillary was spying for Russia like Robert Hanssen, unless of course that’s the insinuation from conservatives. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/59 "2016-06-11T10:21:57Z")
Doesn’t matter what they want. What our government does, we have a right to know unless there’s a national security implication. Clinton doesn’t get to do her work in secret. The only exception is the President, and that only applies to the advice he receives, not his actions as President. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031/60 "2016-06-11T10:32:39Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Doesn’t matter what they want. What our government does, we have a right to know unless there’s a national security implication. Clinton doesn’t get to do her work in secret. The only exception is the President, and that only applies to the advice he receives, not his actions as President. Are we done talking about the Clinton pardons? Because it really seemed like you had no idea what you were talking about there, and were just regurgitating nonsense from RW media. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/clinton-v-trump-who-would-make-the-better-potus/757031.md?page=4)