# Cocktail: Manhattan...or? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** liquor-alcohol\ **Created:** [February 28, 2023, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462 "2023-02-28T00:11:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/1 "2023-02-28T00:11:55Z")
I poured 2 ounces of Cocchi Americano and 1 ounce of Sazerac rye over ice, added a couple of dashes of Angostura bitters and a cherry, and enjoyed it. Is this a recognized drink? Sort of a Manhattan? Or? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/2 "2023-02-28T00:20:50Z")
Just a different ratio than a regular Manhattan, no? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/3 "2023-02-28T00:31:42Z")
Wrong ratios, wrong mixer. I’ve never had Cocchi Americano, but it looks close to dry vermouth? But more bitter? I suspect it’s distinct enough that whatever you made is its own thing. Important thing is that you enjoyed it! ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/4 "2023-02-28T00:50:29Z")
Wrong vermouth, wrong proportions for a Manhattan. Maybe a Scarsdale? Add some red vermouth and a bunch more rye and you’d have a “Perfect Manhattan.” ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/5 "2023-02-28T01:21:02Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Wrong vermouth, wrong proportions for a Manhattan. Maybe a Scarsdale? A “South Side”. Put it next to a Sobieski Collins with a splash of Krupnik and alternate drinks; you’ll have a brawl in your mouth that tastes like stale athletic socks and broken glass! Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/6 "2023-02-28T01:22:36Z")
Now you’re talking! ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/7 "2023-02-28T01:47:00Z")
I’d consider it a variation on the [Black Manhattan](https://imbibemagazine.com/recipe/black-manhattan-recipe/), where the amaro is usually Averna. And of course the ratios are the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/8 "2023-02-28T03:51:39Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > I suspect it’s distinct enough that whatever you made is its own thing. > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > A “South Side”. So… not a Manhattan, but a Brooklyn? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/9 "2023-02-28T04:03:31Z")
> [@digs](#): > > So… not a Manhattan, but a Brooklyn? They get iced tea. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/10 "2023-02-28T14:20:04Z")
I’m going to call it the Statin [sic] Island ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/11 "2023-02-28T20:42:36Z")
That’s how I’d describe it too. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/12 "2023-03-01T00:17:46Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > Cocchi Americano Oh darn, I thought that was a sweet vermouth. Is there a popular sweet vermouth with basically the same name? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/13 "2023-03-01T01:09:55Z")
Carpano Antica? If so what you made was an out of proportion Manhattan. Reverse them and try Peychaud’s bitters for a change. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/14 "2023-03-01T01:15:24Z")
That’s what I use in my Manhattans so I’d have recognized it. I think I was thinking of this:[https://drizly.com/wine/dessert-fortified-wine/dessert-wine/cocchi-storico-vermouth-di-torino/p5716](https://drizly.com/wine/dessert-fortified-wine/dessert-wine/cocchi-storico-vermouth-di-torino/p5716) ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/15 "2023-03-01T01:18:17Z")
The last Manhattan I made was Sazerac Rye and Carpano Antica vermouth. Great combination. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/16 "2023-03-01T16:06:08Z")
In _[Imbibe](https://www.amazon.com/Imbibe-Updated-Revised-Absinthe-Professor/dp/0399172610)_, that’s described as a “Formula #2 (Reverse)” variant on the Manhattan, and is described as being basically a Vermouth Cocktail, which was essentially a cocktail with vermouth instead of liquor. Flip your proportions and you have a very good Manhattan recipe. I’m a big fan of Carpano Antica, and Sazerac Rye is good as well. ---
**Author:** ![fordgt100](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@fordgt100](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fordgt100)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cocktail-manhattan-or/980462/17 "2023-03-03T20:39:13Z")
That’s a different sort of Zazerac than we had in New Orleans, where it originated I believe. The “cocktail” was invented there too. An alcoholic tips their first glass of booze towards New Orleans like the Muslims face Mecca for their prayers : \>) A N.O. style Zazerac cocktail is rye, sugar, bitters and absinthe. We also invented getting drunk, peeing on Bourbon Street and being arrested. Some things we do really well.