# Cold War Secrets **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 11, 2005, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663 "2005-08-11T23:53:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![StaberindeMk2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@StaberindeMk2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StaberindeMk2)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2005, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/1 "2005-08-11T23:53:42Z")
While browsing the web I came across this: [http://www.astronautix.com/details/stsg3087.htm](http://www.astronautix.com/details/stsg3087.htm) The interesting part… “In response to the American Strategic Defence Initiative and continued military use of the shuttle, the Soviet Union fired a ‘warning shot’ from the Terra-3 laser complex at Sary Shagan. The facility tracked Challenger with a low power laser on 10 October 1984. This caused malfunctions to on-board equipment and discomfort / temporary blinding of the crew, leading to a US diplomatic protest.” I never heard of this incident before? Was it kept quiet at the time? I imagine an attack on the Shuttle like this would be considered very serious? I’m asking because I find the Cold War in general fascinating _(as one who was only just a teenager when the USSR collapsed)_ and I’m continuously coming across unexpected pieces of information or incidents that I’d never heard of before. For example the Operation RYAN warscare in 1983 _(I think)_ when the USSR believed large scale NATO exercises _(Able Archer)_ were a prelude to war, in fact in a meeting of the Politburo Premier Andropov stated that nuclear war with the West was now inevitable. Probably the most dangerous incident since the Cuban Missile Crisis, with massively more destructive arsenals on both sides, and something most people have never heard of. _(I only learned of it through a passing reference in a book)_ I also recall reading that the Volksarmee had medals struck for the liberation of the FRG. Were there any other incidents or facts, little known or hushed up at the time, that have since come to light? ---
**Author:** ![MAGunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a87d85/32.png) [@MAGunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MAGunter)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/2 "2005-08-12T06:59:53Z")
I would hazard a guess to say that we probably won’t know the true extent of the cold war for another 30-50 years when all involved are long dead and it doesn’t matter anymore. It’s sorta like how I don’t expect to hear the true story of the Kennedy assassination until I’m in my 60s (and I’m in my 20s now) because they want to wait until everyone alive then is long dead. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/3 "2005-08-12T07:07:55Z")
Stab are you reading from my book, Codeword Dictionary? If so, I thank you for your wise purchase. ---
**Author:** ![StaberindeMk2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@StaberindeMk2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StaberindeMk2)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/4 "2005-08-12T13:14:23Z")
> [@Paul in Saudi](#): > > Stab are you reading from my book, Codeword Dictionary? If so, I thank you for your wise purchase. Nope, but I was wondering if you were _that_ Paul in Saudi before, its a small internet, this thread was inspired by an old Tanknet thread I’d saved and was reading though last night. Thought some people here might have something new to add to what had been a very interesting discussion. Do you have a link to your book, if it has this sort of stuff in it I might wisely purchase it after all. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/5 "2005-08-12T13:45:07Z")
Paul? Splain, please, spasibo. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/6 "2005-08-12T17:11:45Z")
About five years ago Motorbooks published my _Codeword Dictionary_ it sold about four thousand copies. (Before you ask, yes it was a real book, they paid me for it.) This makes me the (Self-Appointed) World’s Leading Authority on military codewords. By this I mean I can tell you how operation OVERLORD (the invasion at Normandy) relates to TROMBOLA (the supply of fuel to the invading force. I am not however an expert in all the ins and outs of the invasion, just the name. Also I know nothing of place names (Checkpoint Charlie) or the names of stuff (U-Boat). You have to draw the line somewhere. In any case, I later came to Saudi Arabia to escape the throngs of admirers who recognized me on the street and made my life a living hell. ---
**Author:** ![AndrewL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@AndrewL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndrewL)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2005, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/7 "2005-08-12T18:02:10Z")
Does anyone have a cite for this incident that isn’t based on the [astronautix.com](http://astronautix.com) web page? I’m not entierly willing to accept their word alone that this actually happened. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/8 "2005-08-13T01:46:58Z")
Does this help? ABLE ARCHER (U.S. 83) An American exercise in early November, 1983 testing the control procedures for American nuclear weapons in Europe including the new Pershing 2s. This exercise coming after President Reagan’s “Evil Empire and “Star Wars” speeches in March and Lech Walesa, a Polish dissident winning the Nobel Peace Prize in October seemed very provocative to the Soviets. ABLE ARCHER may have marked a high-water mark in Cold War danger as some segments in the Soviet Union saw it as a cover for a NATO attack on the Soviets. See RYAN. RYAN (S. U. 83) Soviet intelligence operation conducted in London, Washington and perhaps other Western capitals in the mid-1980’s. Soviet operatives were directed to be alert to a possible Western preemptive nuclear strike against the Soviet Union. This included monitoring of the price of human blood at local blood banks noting which lights were on late at night in key buildings. RYAN is a Russian acronym for Raketno Yadernoye Napadenie “Nuclear Missile Attack.” See Able Archer. ---
**Author:** ![Alien](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/57b2e6/32.png) [@Alien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alien)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/9 "2005-08-13T01:49:36Z")
Hi Paul _::: waives both hands :::_ Amazon sells \*Codeword Dictionary \* for $12, if they can get a hold of a copy for me. But I’ll have to give significant amounts of blood to have it shipped to my location. Is the book available in any electronic stores by any chance? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/10 "2005-08-13T03:35:14Z")
No, it is out of print. When I get around to it, I will upload it to WikiBooks. Or not. I have posted bits and pieces on the Wikipedia at [Here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_operations_and_projects_%28military_and_non-military%29#Other.2FUnknown) . ---
**Author:** ![Chad\_C.Mulligan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3be4f8/32.png) [@Chad\_C.Mulligan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chad_C.Mulligan)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/11 "2005-08-13T17:05:47Z")
> [@StaberindeMk2](#): > > Were there any other incidents or facts, little known or hushed up at the time, that have since come to light? Are you familiar with the U.S. eavesdropping on Soviet military telephone lines by submarine tapping of underwater cables? The hair-raising missions to retrieve data from these underwater taps are detailed in the excellent book Blind Man’s Bluff: The Untold Story of American Submarine Espionage. The book also details other incidents of Cold War nautical skullduggery and brinksmanship that are likely to interest you. ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/12 "2005-08-13T18:22:48Z")
Wasn’t there an incident where the USSR’s RADAR stations started picking up large number of Western ICBM’s and were about to launch a counterattack until some RADAR operator persuaded his supervisor that it was a computer fault? I seem to remember that the operator was rewarded with a telephone, or something along those lines. Am I making this up or is it a real event? ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/13 "2005-08-13T22:00:58Z")
> [@Dominic Mulligan](#): > > Wasn’t there an incident where the USSR’s RADAR stations started picking up large number of Western ICBM’s and were about to launch a counterattack until some RADAR operator persuaded his supervisor that it was a computer fault? > > I seem to remember that the operator was rewarded with a telephone, or something along those lines. > > Am I making this up or is it a real event? There have been several false alarms; you’re probably thinking of this: [http://www.commonground.ca/iss/0507168/cg168\_unspun.shtml](http://www.commonground.ca/iss/0507168/cg168_unspun.shtml) Petrov was not rewarded, though. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/14 "2005-08-13T22:57:24Z")
I was wondering if I imagined recent revelations of other spy planes from the USA show down by the USSR. A search confirmed I did not imagine that: [http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000C7BMY/103-3233050-2699036?v=glance](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000C7BMY/103-3233050-2699036?v=glance) By Any Means Necessary: America’s Secret Air War in the Cold War > [@](#): > > But Burrows also examines the issue of intelligence gathering from the Soviet viewpoint. Having been attacked by erstwhile ally Germany without provocation and having seen the atomic bombs dropped on Japan, the Soviets were understandably edgy when American planes began buzzing their borders and occasionally flying directly over their airspace. Frustrated, the Soviets struck back. From 1950 to 1969, Soviet fighters shot down 16 American planes in situations that resulted in loss of life. An appendix provides a chronological listing of these planes and the names of the crew members who perished. Most planes were converted bombers or tankers, crammed with all sorts of electronic eavesdropping devices. The whole game was generally called “ferreting.” Nikita Khrushchev’s joy when U-2 pilot Francis Gary Powers was captured after his plane was downed on May 1, 1960, is understandable. The Soviets announced the capture, but the Americans never apologized directly and still haven’t. The ultimate tragedy in this cat and mouse game befell the families of the missing airmen who were often executed if captured alive. Burrows is to be congratulated for superb research and stellar writing in this first look behind the secret curtain of intelligence gathering. ---
**Author:** ![StaberindeMk2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@StaberindeMk2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StaberindeMk2)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2005, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/15 "2005-08-13T23:32:46Z")
> [@Chad C. Mulligan](#): > > Are you familiar with the U.S. eavesdropping on Soviet military telephone lines by submarine tapping of underwater cables? The hair-raising missions to retrieve data from these underwater taps are detailed in the excellent book Blind Man’s Bluff: The Untold Story of American Submarine Espionage. The book also details other incidents of Cold War nautical skullduggery and brinksmanship that are likely to interest you. Yeah I have that book, thanks, and a very good read it is too. A similar book I picked up around the same time is “The Silent War” by John Pina Craven but I haven’t got around to reading it yet so I can’t say if its any good or not. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2005, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cold-war-secrets/316663/16 "2005-08-16T00:58:52Z")
> [@Chad C. Mulligan](#): > > Are you familiar with the U.S. eavesdropping on Soviet military telephone lines by submarine tapping of underwater cables? The hair-raising missions to retrieve data from these underwater taps are detailed in the excellent book Blind Man’s Bluff: The Untold Story of American Submarine Espionage. The book also details other incidents of Cold War nautical skullduggery and brinksmanship that are likely to interest you. I read that book also. I loved how they got the idea to look for the communication’s cable by just looking for a sign on the shore warning of a cable. I think about that every time I see one of those type of signs.