# Colin Powell tips hand, asserts link between Iraq and Al Qaeda **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 27, 2003, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331 "2003-01-27T21:07:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/41 "2003-01-30T20:14:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CyberPundit \* > \*\*The question is: how does an invasion prevent Iraq from passing weapons to terrorists? Common sense suggests that invading Iraq will make it **more** likely to work with terrorists since they will have less to lose. and will be eager to retaliate. Unless you think the attack is going to work instantaneously and finish the regime off on the first day? > > So this is an exceedingly poor argument for invasion. In fact it’s a good argument **against** invasion.\*\* I don’t agree. You have to have the weapons to pass them around. If the U.S. can get in and destroy what Iraqi WMD they can get their hands on, terrorists can’t get to them. With Iraqi WMD manufacture likely working surreptitiously, I think that having an invasion force in Iraq makes it difficult for Saddam to hold a WMD fire sale. Remember, Iraqi communications will be cut off – Saddam won’t easily be able to authorize sales, or even giveaways. I’m Joe Chemist, working in an RV in the middle of nowhere. A group of who-knows-who comes up to me asking what my price for some anthrax would be. With no word from Saddam or his underlings, how can I be sure these “buyers” aren’t CIA, MI5 or American Special Forces? Heck, American Special Forces are already in Northern Iraq – I’ll bet in part to trip up would-b WMD buyers. In short, I don’t think it will be easy for Iraq to widely distribute WMD to terrorists while the U.S. is locking down the country. I think the idea is to keep Iraq from continuing to manufacture chemical and biological weapons, while also ensuring that Saddam’s Iraq never becomes a nuclear power. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CyberPundit \* > **What about North Korea, Pakistan, Iran, Syria, Libya?. Can you explain why these are any less likely to pass on weapons to terrorists than Iraq? The latter four probably have closer ties to Islamic fundamentalists than Iraq.** One country at a time. I think it likely that Washington’s foreign policy wonks are working with the understanding that the latter four nations you list (as opposed to Iraq) can be dealt with through a combination of surveillance, diplomacy, and a little _quid pro quo_. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CyberPundit \* > \*\*The bottom line is that the US is going to have to live in a world where nasty regimes have access to unconventional weapons. In fact it has lived in such a world for decades. \*\* That’s true, but not, IMHO, a reason not to force Iraq to disarm. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/42 "2003-01-30T22:37:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RedFury \* > \*\*Where have you _been_? Hiding in a cave with OBL? Just look around you, all those guys with mustashes could potentially be carrying Saddam Bin Laden’s WOD. In fact, the mustashes could be the WOD! You know, all that secret reseach… > \*\* Who says OBL has WMD? He used a few passenger aircraft last time. Yes, “…potentially…”. If he did have WMD, other countries could also be potentially carrying OBL’s WMD. Isn’t going to war is a bit of an overreaction to a potential, unproven threat. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/43 "2003-01-30T22:59:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bordelond \* > \*\*Actually, this is only a link to the abstract of Chivers’ January 27th article, but there is a phrase therein upon which Safire is partially balancing his conclusion: > > **"American official says he now believes Kurdish government’s claim that Ansar has strong links to Al Qaeda …"** > > The (financial) link to Hussein likely has a separate source from Chivers’ January 27th article (maybe Goldberg’s _New Yorker_ piece?). \*\* The Al Qaeda-Saddam link is very tenuous. So far there have been 3 Kurds who say that Saddam is arming terrorists in northern Iraq. Nothing more concrete yet. Of course the Kurds are going to try and put Saddam in the shit. After all the suffering he has put them through. It does not sound a very credible source. Why not get the UN inspectors to check it out? OBL has links to many countries. Indonesia, USA, Germany, Britain and has proven, strong financial links with Saudi Arabia. So I wonder what the next reason for war will be. Saddam is exporting crack to the US. Maybe he has a child porn racket. ---
**Author:** ![CyberPundit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/76d3ee/32.png) [@CyberPundit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CyberPundit)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/44 "2003-01-30T23:07:21Z")
. “If the U.S. can get in and destroy what Iraqi WMD they can get their hands on, terrorists can’t get to them.” Um the US probably doesn’t know where all the weapons are kept. If it did it could simply tell the inspectors and have them destroy it. “Remember, Iraqi communications will be cut off – Saddam won’t easily be able to authorize sales, or even giveaways.” I think it’s naive to believe that all communications will be 100% cut off; especially non-electronic communications. Besides you don’t necessarily need communications. Saddam could have a trusted family member in charge of the weapons. As soon as the war reaches the point of no return he scoots off with them and passes them to terrorists. “the latter four nations you list (as opposed to Iraq) can be dealt with through a combination of surveillance, diplomacy, and a little quid pro quo.” And how do you know any of this will work with any of those countries better than with Iraq? “That’s true, but not, IMHO, a reason not to force Iraq to disarm.” The trouble is that invasion may disarm Iraq at the cost of arming terrorists who are much more likely to use those weapons in the first place. A completely self-defeating strategy. ---
**Author:** ![Tejota](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@Tejota](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tejota)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/45 "2003-01-30T23:21:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bordelond \* > You have to have the weapons to pass them around. If the U.S. can get in and destroy what Iraqi WMD they can get their hands on, terrorists can’t get to them. And how, exactly is the US going to go in and destroy weapons when they don’t know where they are? Which they clearly don’t or one of two things would have happened already. either: a) tell the inspectors where to find them, and then have your smoking gun. or b) bomb them and destroy them without risking any soldiers in an invasion. Clearly, the Bush adminstration doesn’t have a clue where Saddam keeps his WMD (if he even still has any that work), so just as clearly invasion is more likely to result in terrorists smuggling them out of the country as not. On the other hand. For anything short of Nukes, there are **far** easier places to acquire deadly substances than Iraq right now. Bush made a big deal about tons ‘growth agent’ for bio-weapons. Let’s have so show of hands for people think this is hard to obtain in the USA? …hmmm? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/46 "2003-01-30T23:31:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by antechinus \* > \*\*Who says OBL has WMD? He used a few passenger aircraft last time. > > Yes, “…potentially…”. If he did have WMD, other countries could also be potentially carrying OBL’s WMD. Isn’t going to war is a bit of an overreaction to a potential, unproven threat. \*\* I was actually _agreeing_ with your post while using a mix of hyperbole and sarcasm to get my point across. Truth be told, it’s gotten to the point where humor seems to be the only defense I have left against all the mindless rethoric and hubris coming out of this Administration and its sychophants. Logic has long ago been thrown out the window – just read this or any other thread on the topic. And I’m afraid any vestiges of humor will quickly disappear as soon as the bombs starts flying and the mindless killing begins. I keep seeing more and more parallels between Dubya and those he presents as ‘evil’ than I do any significant differences. It all boils down to “my God this Vs my God that” in order to disguise the greed and patent immorality, and in the end, a lot of innocent lives cut short. Political and moral Darwinism. Sickening. I thought Americans knew better… ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2003, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/47 "2003-01-30T23:37:33Z")
Disclaimer – Obvioulsy “Americans” in a huge overgeneralization. I did and I do admire any number of public and private citizens that are trying their hardest to stop this insanity. But when its all said and done, if the US does make good on its current threats, it’ll be next to impossible _not_ to point the finger of blame towards America as a whole. Regardless of how history may be written by the ‘winners’ in all of this, the fact is we’re _living_ this part of history and no blindfold is big enough to distort what is so plain to see. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/48 "2003-01-31T03:17:34Z")
> [@](#): > > Who says OBL has WMD? He used a few passenger aircraft last time. > > Yes, “…potentially…”. If he did have WMD, other countries could also be potentially carrying OBL’s WMD. Isn’t going to war is a bit of an overreaction to a potential, unproven threat. I guess you missed the news that an al-Qaida cell was arrested in Britain with Sarin in their possession. That is a weapon of mass destruction. Apparently, the British have intelligence that al-Qaida is planning a series of attacks in Europe using biological and/or chemical weapons. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/49 "2003-01-31T04:23:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*I guess you missed the news that an al-Qaida cell was arrested in Britain with Sarin in their possession. That is a weapon of mass destruction. Apparently, the British have intelligence that al-Qaida is planning a series of attacks in Europe using biological and/or chemical weapons. \*\* Remind me again what this has to do with the “imminent danger” posed by Saddam? Because I obviously missed _that_ particular bit of news. ---
**Author:** ![Halo13](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Halo13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Halo13)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/50 "2003-01-31T05:16:37Z")
It is highly unlikely Iraq and Al Qaeda are working together, from Bin Laden’s point of view Iraq is a secular state and the enemy of the Nation of Islam. Al Qaeda is far more likely to capitalise on the death and destruction that will be inflicted upon the people and conscripts of Iraq for recruiting purposes then it is to accept help from, or help out, Iraq. Even if Al Qaeda has recieved help from Iraq indirectly, Al Qaeda will not work in the interests of the secular Iraq state or Sadam. Thus it is yet again the actions of the west, the US in particular, that will encourage terrorism against our peoples. When America or its allies are attacked again, thank warmonger/executioner Bush, his lackeys and owners. Perhaps if America burns its fingers in Iraq they might reconsider their foreign policy, but this is unlikely as the relatively unprovoked war America is orchestrating in Iraq right now is fundamentally no different from a dozen other state terrorist wars it has waged thought out the “developing” world. Americans, wake up now! The peoples of the world increasingly hate you state because of its actions. Remember actions speak louder then the words of morons such as Bush. There is no excuse for not knowing why, how and how often your government has been in the wrong. Read something the rich didn’t pay for and you might find some truth. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/51 "2003-01-31T05:44:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*I guess you missed the news that an al-Qaida cell was arrested in Britain with Sarin in their possession. That is a weapon of mass destruction. Apparently, the British have intelligence that al-Qaida is planning a series of attacks in Europe using biological and/or chemical weapons. \*\* Sarin? You dont mean those lunatics that were extracting ricin? People have be extracting ricin from castor beans for ages. Doesn’t mean you should raze another country because of it. I agree with **halo13**. OBL thinks that Saddman is a disgace to Islam (cant argue with that). This, I hear from the journalist that interviewed OBL back in 1999. [http://www.abc.net.au/rn/talks/brkfast/stories/s773744.htm](http://www.abc.net.au/rn/talks/brkfast/stories/s773744.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/52 "2003-01-31T05:59:15Z")
I prefer to let Osama speak for himself. Here’s his [fatwa](http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm) that started all this. You’ll note that Iraq’s grievances against America figure prominently. **antechinus:** Oops. I thought they had found Sarin. [Emily Letella]Never mind.[/Emily Letella] ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2003, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331/53 "2003-01-31T06:20:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*I prefer to let Osama speak for himself. Here’s his [fatwa](http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm) that started all this. You’ll note that Iraq’s grievances against America figure prominently. > > **antechinus:** Oops. I thought they had found Sarin. [Emily Letella]Never mind.[/Emily Letella] \*\* Well I just read that cite **Sam Stone**. To read the rant was indeed a painful exercise, but thanks for the info. There was nothing in it said about OBL being mates with Saddman. But by reading this it is obvious that there is one thing that will bring them closer together. WAR. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colin-powell-tips-hand-asserts-link-between-iraq-and-al-qaeda/151331.md?page=2)