# College FB coaches killing players by overwork in heat? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 21, 2018, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984 "2018-08-21T15:36:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/1 "2018-08-21T15:36:57Z")
Since 2001 in the NCAA 27 players died of heat stroke, in the NFL none have died. > **[Perspective | Prehistoric college football coaches are killing players. It’s...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/prehistoric-college-football-coaches-are-killing-players-its-past-time-to-stop-them/2018/08/21/5b0f67c2-a53b-11e8-8fac-12e98c13528d_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.4e8eed5eb3ce)** > > Heat didn’t kill Jordan McNair. The unhinged practices of DJ Durkin and those like him did. Also the NFL has a union and players would not put up with these fanatical coaches. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/2 "2018-08-21T15:51:59Z")
College students are a lot cheaper than an NFL player. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/3 "2018-08-21T15:53:29Z")
The MD coach is likely to get canned, but not for this guy dying. He will get the ax for losing to much. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/4 "2018-08-21T15:54:21Z")
How many high school football players have died in the same time period? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/5 "2018-08-21T15:57:55Z")
[Mother Jones.](https://www.motherjones.com/media/2015/10/high-school-football-death-camron-matthews/) (2015) > [@](#): > > While the number of football-related deaths are far lower today than they were at their high point in 1968, when 26 high school players died, the fatality rate among high school players has remained steady most years since the late ’90s, when 0.40 per 100,000 high school football players died from on-field injuries. In 2013, when eight players died directly from on-field injuries, that rate spiked to 0.73 per 100,000, before it dipped last year slightly to 0.45 per 100,000. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/6 "2018-08-21T16:02:49Z")
as the article says, these are not deaths from an injury those are very rare. The 27 are from heat stroke due to workouts in hot weather. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/7 "2018-08-21T16:03:21Z")
The more important part of that article for the purposes of this thread: > [@](#): > > Between 2005 and 2014, another 92 high school football players died indirectly from the sport, with causes ranging from heart-related issues to heat stroke and water intoxication. That number is more fucked up then the number of kids killed from actually playing the game. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/8 "2018-08-21T16:29:53Z")
Korey Stringer died from heat stroke in 2001, I guess he’s the last NFL player to do so. Since then, I’d guess the NFL has more stringent training for coaches and assistants. The NCAA has a lot more teams, therefore a lot more players to try and enforce this kind of training. Make no mistake, there is no excuse for dying from football. > [@running\_coach](#): > > College students are a lot cheaper than an NFL player. I doubt Maryland will be getting off “cheap.” ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/9 "2018-08-21T17:05:35Z")
When my son played high school football, he collapsed during practice from heat exhaustion and ended up in the emergency room pumped full of fluids. Eventually he admitted that 1) while the coach had instructed everyone to run one set of drills, then stay off the field the for two sets, my son had decided (without mentioning it to anyone) that he was going to run two or even three sets in a row, all morning long. And 2) he wasn’t drinking nearly enough water because he was on the field running extra sets. I don’t blame the system, and I don’t blame the coaches. My teenage son deliberately ignored instructions and it came back to bite him. Fortunately, everything turned out okay. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/10 "2018-08-21T17:07:01Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Since 2001 in the NCAA 27 players died of heat stroke, in the NFL none have died. > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/prehistoric-college-football-coaches-are-killing-players-its-past-time-to-stop-them/2018/08/21/5b0f67c2-a53b-11e8-8fac-12e98c13528d\_story.html?noredirect=on&utm\_term=.4e8eed5eb3ce](https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/prehistoric-college-football-coaches-are-killing-players-its-past-time-to-stop-them/2018/08/21/5b0f67c2-a53b-11e8-8fac-12e98c13528d_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.4e8eed5eb3ce) > > Also the NFL has a union and players would not put up with these fanatical coaches. Plus, the NFL has only about 1600 players active at any given time, while the NCAA has 673 schools that play football (“the NCAA” is not just FBS, or just Division I for that matter); if they average 50 players per team, that’s 33,650 players. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/11 "2018-08-21T17:07:24Z")
kunliou, but the coaches could have kept a closer eye on your son right? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/12 "2018-08-21T17:26:18Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > Plus, the NFL has only about 1600 players active at any given time, while the NCAA has 673 schools that play football (“the NCAA” is not just FBS, or just Division I for that matter); if they average 50 players per team, that’s 33,650 players. Far more than that, in fact. NCAA rules apparently state that a school can have [as many as 125 players](https://payperhead.com/ncaa-football-player-rosters/) on its active football roster. Division 1-A programs can offer [up to 85 football scholarships](https://www.athleticscholarships.net/footballnews.htm). If there are 673 NCAA football programs, and if every team had its maximum number of players, that’s a potential 84,125 players. And, that doesn’t even include the smaller schools that are in the [NAIA](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Intercollegiate_Athletics), rather than the NCAA. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/13 "2018-08-21T17:31:37Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > kunliou, but the coaches could have kept a closer eye on your son right? How many adults are present for High School football practice? I seem to recall it was only 1-2 for up to 40 kids. Might be hard to keep track of. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/14 "2018-08-21T17:38:44Z")
smaller schools like Div 2 and below don’t have 85 players or anywhere near that. Some of the smaller Div I teams don’t have 85 on scholarship either because they cannot afford that many especially for private schools with high tuition. Some high schools have volunteer coaches or part time coaches to help out beyond the paid coaches. Locally here we have a few retired NFL players who volunteer at high schools. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/15 "2018-08-21T17:43:57Z")
Truth is I don’t know how a lot more players didn’t die when I was in high school in the 80s. The coach was a tough old bastard that played in the NFL. He allowed no water in summer practices. None. It made you weak. I’m sure he was typical of the era. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/16 "2018-08-21T17:44:37Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > How many adults are present for High School football practice? I seem to recall it was only 1-2 for up to 40 kids. Might be hard to keep track of. I coach(cross-country) at a small school (appx 800 enrollment) in the Central Valley and there are typically 4-6 coaches in the football program. Team size is usually 50-65. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Wiggler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/red_wiggler/32/13190_2.png) [@Red\_Wiggler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Wiggler)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/17 "2018-08-21T18:36:48Z")
It will be interesting to see how this issue plays into the imminent Alston v NCAA trial, if at all. One reason that college coaches are able to apply so-called “Junction Boys” methods to practices is because of the almost complete lack of leverage held by the average college football player. A decisive Alston win could inadvertently achieve safer practice conditions if players have more options at their disposal to say no. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/18 "2018-08-21T19:33:53Z")
for those that don’t know, here is the the story of the Texas A&M junction boys in 1954 under Bear Bryant [Junction Boys - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junction_Boys) ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/19 "2018-08-21T20:13:55Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > smaller schools like Div 2 and below don’t have 85 players or anywhere near that. Yes, they do. I counted 109 players on the online roster, and in uniform in the team picture, on the web site of Augustana College, a typical Division III program. The NCAA counted 73,300 football players last year, across all divisions. The relevant statistic isn’t the number of players on scholarship, it’s the number of players who practice. I don’t disagree for a minute that college football coaching is full of asshole martinets under grossly inadequate supervision, but it needs to be understood that 20-30 times more players go through college training camp than NFL training camp. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984/20 "2018-08-21T20:58:37Z")
Not sure why the number of players is relevant to the deaths? The issue is even at places like Maryland with a lot of coaches and money to hire medical staff the player died. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-fb-coaches-killing-players-by-overwork-in-heat/819984.md?page=2)