# College Football Thread - BCS, Bowls, Conference Championship, Coaching Changes **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 27, 2007, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979 "2007-11-27T23:51:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/121 "2007-12-02T04:39:23Z")
[QUOTE=drm] Does it factor in that LSU spanked them early on in the season? [/QUOTE] Of course it should factor in. LSU _ **crushed** _ Virginia Tech. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/122 "2007-12-02T04:40:33Z")
[QUOTE=treis] Yeah according to this week’s rankings VT is better than LSU, and they beat a, again according to the rankings, better team, and they did it more impressively. VT did lose to LSU, but that was the 2nd game of the season and Tech had a freshman QB. The Hoakies are a completely different team now then there were then. [/QUOTE] Well, if we’re going by who’s playing best right _now_, then Georgia should get in. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/123 "2007-12-02T04:43:38Z")
Perhaps, but I can’t justify putting a team that didn’t even win their conference in the championship game. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/124 "2007-12-02T04:45:58Z")
It’s a conundrum. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/125 "2007-12-02T04:48:29Z")
[QUOTE=treis] Perhaps, but I can’t justify putting a team that didn’t even win their conference in the championship game. [/QUOTE] I can agree with that, but on what basis would the voters who had LSU as their #7 team last week moved them over Georgia who they had as their #4 team? They won their conference championship game? Well so did VA Tech who was ranked #6. LSU killed them earlier in the year? Yes, they did, so why did the voters put them in front of LSU last week, but this week they should change their votes? As of two weeks ago I was feeling sorry for teams like OSU and UGA who finish early, but it has it’s benefits.. We need a freaking playoff… ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/126 "2007-12-02T04:49:14Z")
[QUOTE=spoke-] Well, if we’re going by who’s playing best right _now_, then Georgia should get in. [/QUOTE] Ahem, Georgia _isn’t playing at all_ this weekend. Kinda a major factor I think. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/127 "2007-12-02T04:51:45Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] As of two weeks ago I was feeling sorry for teams like OSU and UGA who finish early, but it has it’s benefits.. [/QUOTE] I wager that if you were to look back over the years playing a championship game has moved more teams up that being idle has. Michigan last year for example. I think that this season is the anomaly, much like everything else about this season. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/128 "2007-12-02T04:53:24Z")
[QUOTE=Omniscient] Ahem, Georgia _isn’t playing at all_ this weekend. Kinda a major factor I think. [/QUOTE] Neither is Ohio State. So, fair enough, let’s have a Virginia Tech/LSU championhip, since neither Georgia nor OSU proved themselves in a title game. :dubious: (Aside: Freakin’ Kentucky bastards. Can’t just hold onto the ball and kick a simple freakin’ field goal in OT against the Vols. Grrr. Otherwise, Georgia would have been playing tonight.) ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/129 "2007-12-02T04:56:44Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] I can agree with that, but on what basis would the voters who had LSU as their #7 team last week moved them over Georgia who they had as their #4 team? They won their conference championship game? Well so did VA Tech who was ranked #6. LSU killed them earlier in the year? Yes, they did, so why did the voters put them in front of LSU last week, but this week they should change their votes? As of two weeks ago I was feeling sorry for teams like OSU and UGA who finish early, but it has it’s benefits.. We need a freaking playoff… [/QUOTE] I wouldn’t mind a +1 system, but no playoffs. IMHO VT looked better today beating BC than LSU did in beating Tenn. I’d give the slight edge to VT, but I wouldn’t complain if LSU got in. If Kansas or Georgia gets in I’ll be pretty pissed though. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/130 "2007-12-02T04:57:41Z")
[QUOTE=spoke-] Neither is Ohio State. So, fair enough, let’s have a Virginia Tech/LSU championhip, since neither Georgia nor OSU proved themselves in a title game. :dubious: (Aside: Freakin’ Kentucky bastards. Can’t just hold onto the ball and kick a simple freakin’ field goal in OT against the Vols. Grrr. Otherwise, Georgia would have been playing tonight.) [/QUOTE] But, in fairness, OSU has one loss versus UGA’s two.. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/131 "2007-12-02T05:00:25Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] But, in fairness, OSU has one loss versus UGA’s two.. [/QUOTE] I was being facetious. We can go 'round and 'round on all this, but there’s no good resolution under the present circumstances. _Some_body’s gonna wind up pissed off. LSU won the title game in what is by general consensus the best conference this year. Their only losses were in overtime, against SEC foes, and they crushed Virginia Tech. Even though I’m a Georgia fan, I’d say LSU deserves their shot. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/132 "2007-12-02T05:03:24Z")
Well Hawaii is down 14 early so hopefully we won’t have to hear their whining. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/133 "2007-12-02T05:14:18Z")
[QUOTE=spoke-] I was being facetious. We can go 'round and 'round on all this, but there’s no good resolution under the present circumstances. _Some_body’s gonna wind up pissed off. LSU won the title game in what is by general consensus the best conference this year. Their only losses were in overtime, against SEC foes, and they crushed Virginia Tech. Even though I’m a Georgia fan, I’d say LSU deserves their shot. [/QUOTE] While I admire your non-homerism (is that a word?) what did LSU do to propel them 5 spots up in the BCS standings? They beat TN, sure, but they have two losses. So do WVU, Missou, UGA, and VT, all of which were ranked ahead of them, and Kansas is also ranked ahead of them with one loss. So, LSU should jump ALL of these teams to the #2 spot??? And if you would say “yes”, then why wasn’t LSU ranked ahead of UGA, VT, and Kansas last week? And if the fact that UGA and Kansas didn’t play this week is bad, they why does the fact that OSU didn’t play this week is good? But VT, who was ranked ahead of LSU won their conference championship game, but should still be jumped? A voter would have some splainin’ to do…And defenses from the masses? ETA: And Oklahoma, two losses, won conference championship game! ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/134 "2007-12-02T05:15:52Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] But, in fairness, OSU has one loss versus UGA’s two.. [/QUOTE] More on point, OSU would have been playing a championship game had there been one to play. Can’t be said for Georgia, which is what I was snarkily saying. I think that “playing better right now” argument is a delicate one that usually fails because this flawed system we have forces you to look at the team’s whole body of work. In cases like Oregon where a key player gets hurt, it has a bit more validity, but when comparing UGA, LSU, Va Tech and USC I don’t think you can make that case. I think you could make a case that USC is “playing better” than UGA is right now but it’s probably moot. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/135 "2007-12-02T05:18:26Z")
[QUOTE=Omniscient] More on point, OSU would have been playing a championship game had there been one to play. Can’t be said for Georgia, which is what I was snarkily saying. [/QUOTE] You can’t really say that, either. Since there are no divisions in the Big Ten, you don’t know how a potential championship game in the Big Ten would work itself out.. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/136 "2007-12-02T05:19:11Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] And if the fact that UGA and Kansas didn’t play this week is bad, they why does the fact that OSU didn’t play this week is good? [/QUOTE] I don’t think anyone is discounting UGA and KU because they didn’t play this weekend, but rather because they didn’t earn their way into the conference title game. Lumping OSU in that statement misses the point. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/137 "2007-12-02T05:21:52Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] While I admire your non-homerism (is that a word?) what did LSU do to propel them 5 spots up in the BCS standings? They beat TN, sure, but they have two losses. So do WVU, Missou, UGA, and VT, all of which were ranked ahead of them, and Kansas is also ranked ahead of them with one loss. So, LSU should jump ALL of these teams to the #2 spot??? And if you would say “yes”, then why wasn’t LSU ranked ahead of UGA, VT, and Kansas last week? And if the fact that UGA and Kansas didn’t play this week is bad, they why does the fact that OSU didn’t play this week is good? But VT, who was ranked ahead of LSU won their conference championship game, but should still be jumped? A voter would have some splainin’ to do…And defenses from the masses? [/QUOTE] Rankings are based on who the voters think is the better team, which is fine for rankings. However, when putting someone in the national championship game you have to consider concrete things. Conference championship games are there to determine who the best team is in the conference. LSU won that game, and Georgia did not. Objectively that makes LSU the superior team. Sure, I might think that Georgia would beat LSU, but that’s me just guessing based on observation. When that’s the best we have that’s ok, but when there is a better metric it’s not. To use an example, I don’t think Miami was the best team in the NBA two years ago, but they won the championship. Thus, while my opinion is that Miami isn’t the best team, if they had a NBA vs. World type game I’d have chosen Miami because they won the title. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/138 "2007-12-02T05:24:30Z")
[QUOTE=Omniscient] I don’t think anyone is discounting UGA and KU because they didn’t play this weekend, but rather because they didn’t earn their way into the conference title game. Lumping OSU in that statement misses the point. [/QUOTE] So, again, why, last week, did the voters have UGA at #4, ahead of both LSU and Tenn, each of whom “earned” their way into the title game. The voters also had Kansas #5, ahead of Oklahoma #9, which the latter “earned” its way into the conference title game. Now, on what basis should those teams be jumped by those same voters, keeping in mind that VT #6 won their conference title game which in the last 2 hours seems to be the magical element of an elite team… ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/139 "2007-12-02T05:25:23Z")
[QUOTE=jtgain] While I admire your non-homerism (is that a word?) what did LSU do to propel them 5 spots up in the BCS standings? They beat TN, sure, but they have two losses. So do WVU, Missou, UGA, and VT, all of which were ranked ahead of them, and Kansas is also ranked ahead of them with one loss. So, LSU should jump ALL of these teams to the #2 spot??? [/quote] Yes, because WVU and Missouri lost, Kansas and Georgia didn’t even win their divisions, and LSU crushed VT head-to-head. > [@](#): > > And if you would say “yes”, then why wasn’t LSU ranked ahead of UGA, VT, and Kansas last week? Because in the final poll, voters are apt to step back and look at the season as a whole, rather than robotically moving the best teams up one notch for each team above them that lost. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2007, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979/140 "2007-12-02T05:28:29Z")
And USC is a two loss team! Why don’t they get consideration with LSU and OSU? They are the hottest team right now according to Lou Holtz! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/college-football-thread-bcs-bowls-conference-championship-coaching-changes/427979.md?page=8)